Penn & Memorial Interchange

[DowntownMan]

I noticed some dirt work underneath the bridge at the intersection of Penn and Memorial. Are they adding the "Texas Turn-Around" to the east side of the road? I sure hope so, but that seems to be what they might be doing as they are bringing the dirt down to road level.

Anyone know if this is what is going on here? I think this will be a major help to the traffic on west memorial trying to get to Wal-Mart/Sams.
This might also help develop the south side of memorial going east as there really isnt anything behind Sams besides a church right now.

[Plutonic Panda]

That would be nice if they were to do that.

[DowntownMan]

That would be nice if they were to do that.

I never really understood why they only did the one side to begin with a few years ago. Now if they could redo the May Ave bridge and add turn arounds there...that would help a lot. It seems May & Memorial backs up a lot more than Penn & Memorial at 5pm every day.

[Snowman]

I never really understood why they only did the one side to begin with a few years ago. Now if they could redo the May Ave bridge and add turn arounds there...that would help a lot. It seems May & Memorial backs up a lot more than Penn & Memorial at 5pm every day.

Penn & Memorial westbound entry/eastbound exit would have had more traffic when they put the turn around in since there was not an eastbound exit or westbound entrance at May then, with much of the exiting traffic making a U-turn

[Plutonic Panda]

I never really understood why they only did the one side to begin with a few years ago. Now if they could redo the May Ave bridge and add turn arounds there...that would help a lot. It seems May & Memorial backs up a lot more than Penn & Memorial at 5pm every day.

Probably a cost thing. I wish they would do it on the majority of them.

[traemac]

it's probably dirt work for the bridge on the turnpike expansion

[OKCisOK4me]

it's probably dirt work for the bridge on the turnpike expansion

The work is up above. There's no way for them to access dirt below without running through traffic and going down a grassy incline. Gotta be something else but who knows what.

[RadicalModerate]

I think they are trying to correct an engineering error in the design of the new center lane supports for the turnpike.
Something to do with accepting the low bid . . . Probably an "emergency change order" or sumpin' . . .

But seriously . . . I really hope they are executing a re-think to provide proper symmetry vis-a-vis one of those nice half-roundabouts on the east side of Penn. The net result could be less insanely pissed-off, signal-hatin' drivers in the neighborhood.

p.s. to o.p.: from my vantage point last night it looked more like "concrete un-work" done in the fastest most effective manner ever than "dirt-work" . . .

[ljbab728]

I think they are trying to correct an engineering error in the design of the new center lane supports for the turnpike.
Something to do with accepting the low bid . . . Probably an "emergency change order" or sumpin' . . .

But seriously . . . I really hope they are executing a re-think to provide proper symmetry vis-a-vis one of those nice half-roundabouts on the east side of Penn. The net result could be less insanely pissed-off, signal-hatin' drivers in the neighborhood

Will that change the access to the nearest Braums? LOL

[RadicalModerate]

Well played, Amigo!
(you haven't yet lost your memory . . . and I haven't yet mastered mind-reading. =)

No. The Most Recent ChangeProvements at the intersection from hell will not make Braum's more walkable.
for me . . . personally... =)

No, it/they won't . . . Yet, I hope that The Traffic Engineers'* Efforts will result in better, friendlier, less anxious drivers.

Oh: I still tip generously (if that ain't braggin') at Sonic. Even if their "pope" has moved on to greener pastures. =)



*Oxford Apostraphy . . ? Is that spelled correctly? =)

[LakeEffect]

Probably a cost thing. I wish they would do it on the majority of them.

It was a cost thing. I was the project manager... the project was originally budgeted for two, but then took about 5 years to engineer (this was BEFORE the GO Bond audit program, so projects languished for years). When it was actually brought forward, OKC asked the OTA to assist in the cost, but they're hired traffic engineers said it would have no affect on traffic and they wouldn't support cost assistance. Therefore, OKC could only build the west one.

[HangryHippo]

It was a cost thing. I was the project manager... the project was originally budgeted for two, but then took about 5 years to engineer (this was BEFORE the GO Bond audit program, so projects languished for years). When it was actually brought forward, OKC asked the OTA to assist in the cost, but they're hired traffic engineers said it would have no affect on traffic and they wouldn't support cost assistance. Therefore, OKC could only build the west one.

So are they now building the east one? Or is this something else?

[BoulderSooner]

It was a cost thing. I was the project manager... the project was originally budgeted for two, but then took about 5 years to engineer (this was BEFORE the GO Bond audit program, so projects languished for years). When it was actually brought forward, OKC asked the OTA to assist in the cost, but they're hired traffic engineers said it would have no affect on traffic and they wouldn't support cost assistance. Therefore, OKC could only build the west one.

can i ask a random GO bond ? how does the GO bond audit program work? and if a street project in listed by name on the GO bond issue does it have to be built?

[LakeEffect]

can i ask a random GO bond ? how does the GO bond audit program work? and if a street project in listed by name on the GO bond issue does it have to be built?

My understanding is that an audit was requested and completed in 2004 by the City Auditor. They found that bonds were sold, but projects were not started or, if started (engineering start, not construction) there was no one keeping track and ensuring they were being completed. If I recall correctly, Public Works was completing about $25 million a year in projects, but to get it all done in the time originally scheduled it should have been about $70 million a year. So, in 2005, they created a mini division in Public Works with a specific manager and staff to manage only GO Bond projects. This really ramped up construction and helped complete a lot of old projects. There were multuple 1989, 1995 and 2000 GOB projects that were far for completion in 2005. I believe all 1989 and 1995 are now done. Not sure about 2000.

Yes, if it is a specific listed project, it must be completed in the spirit of the section it was in. For instance, in 2000, the wrote the ballot so specific that widening projects said "Widen to 4 lanes". Therefore, if budget was lacking, it still had to be done and $$$ pulled from elsewhere. In 2007, we wrote the ballot more nuanced, to say "widen...", which allows flexibility. (Side note, you won't see any three lane widenings unless things change. PW is of the mindset that any road over 5,000 ADT should be 4 lanes, min. I do not personally agree with that... but oh well)

[LakeEffect]

So are they now building the east one? Or is this something else?

It appears entirely related to the turnpike widening. Nothing else.

[jn1780]

It appears entirely related to the turnpike widening. Nothing else.

I wouldn't say its entirely related to the widening. Their digging out the embankment underneath the bridge on the east side. While they may not actually be putting in the texas turnaround lane this time around, they certainly plan to put in the retaining wall system that will allow room to fit in another lane. This is probably a case where they realize its better to plan ahead for the future. There's no reason for them to be doing what their doing if its just for the bridge widening. This bridge was finished two months ago.

Edit: Another thought is that its just to make room for a sidewalk.

[RadicalModerate]

Funny you should mention a sidewalk . . . A couple of days ago, I was stopped at the northbound traffic signal for Penn at Memorial on the south side of the underpass. Parked across the street, next to the curb, was a large John Deere front end loader and next to it a large "shovel" and a couple of pickup trucks. Beyond them was the big hill of red dirt. Surrounding the scene was one of those wimpy, orange plastic, construction fences. At a break in the fence--next to the front end loader--was a small, rickety-looking, fold-out sign holder that said: "Sidewalk Closed."

I was wishing that I had a camera to capture the unintentional humor of the scene.

[BoulderSooner]

My understanding is that an audit was requested and completed in 2004 by the City Auditor. They found that bonds were sold, but projects were not started or, if started (engineering start, not construction) there was no one keeping track and ensuring they were being completed. If I recall correctly, Public Works was completing about $25 million a year in projects, but to get it all done in the time originally scheduled it should have been about $70 million a year. So, in 2005, they created a mini division in Public Works with a specific manager and staff to manage only GO Bond projects. This really ramped up construction and helped complete a lot of old projects. There were multuple 1989, 1995 and 2000 GOB projects that were far for completion in 2005. I believe all 1989 and 1995 are now done. Not sure about 2000.

Yes, if it is a specific listed project, it must be completed in the spirit of the section it was in. For instance, in 2000, the wrote the ballot so specific that widening projects said "Widen to 4 lanes". Therefore, if budget was lacking, it still had to be done and $$$ pulled from elsewhere. In 2007, we wrote the ballot more nuanced, to say "widen...", which allows flexibility. (Side note, you won't see any three lane widenings unless things change. PW is of the mindset that any road over 5,000 ADT should be 4 lanes, min. I do not personally agree with that... but oh well)

thank you for the great answer

one of the reasons i asked has to do with Classen Drive it is listed as #4 on the Prop 1 Streets/section-reconstruction

to take it from 10th all the way to harvey and 8th .. with a listed budget of 2.5 mil ..

also it has been interesting that the Maps 3 park consultant and the PW employee assigned to that project (and including david todd for that matter) were not aware that the 2007 GO bond included funds for all of the streets surrounding the new park

[DowntownMan]

Did anyone ever find out what they are exactly doing here? They seem to have brought the dirt down to street level now.

[metro]

I've driven by 3x in the last week, it really looks like they are making a Texas turnaround. I don't believe it was just work to widen the turnpike like originally posted. That work is done and it sure looks like they're fixing to pour a turnaround.

[DowntownMan]

Yea, I didn't believe it was turnpike related as they finished that bridge months ago. It does look like it is for sure a turn around as they are putting up a retaining wall.

[metro]

yep, the shape of it identically matches the west side of the intersection which has the turnaround with sidewalk barrier, so that gives me 98% confidence in that's what they are doing.

[Plutonic Panda]

That is great!!!! I don't suppose they are going to put in any sidewalks or anything on this are they?

[DowntownMan]

I bet they add a sidewalk just like the west side...which needs repair ever since someone hit it a few months back.

[metro]

That is great!!!! I don't suppose they are going to put in any sidewalks or anything on this are they?

To clarify, yes, it appears to match the west side which has a sidewalk with barriers (iron fencing) on both sides.