NW 39th Street gentrification

[Spartan]

I wanted to start a thread over this because I saw an article in the Gazette, as well as some discussion on Ed Shadid's Facebook page, where some stakeholders in the Gay Enclave are getting serious about neighborhood revitalization. I imagine we probably have some privy folks on here who could add to a discussion, but here you have a typical cultural diversity resource that we don't take advantage of because it's rundown.

Many other cities brand gay districts as cultural amenities, and so I wonder if this discussion Shadid is kickstarting will be more to do with just getting them a new streetscape (probably needed) or finding more holistic ways to revitalize the area which is pretty rough.

http://www.okgazette.com/oklahoma/ar...g-the-str.html

[soonerguru]

I wanted to start a thread over this because I saw an article in the Gazette, as well as some discussion on Ed Shadid's Facebook page, where some stakeholders in the Gay Enclave are getting serious about neighborhood revitalization. I imagine we probably have some privy folks on here who could add to a discussion, but here you have a typical cultural diversity resource that we don't take advantage of because it's rundown.

Many other cities brand gay districts as cultural amenities, and so I wonder if this discussion Shadid is kickstarting will be more to do with just getting them a new streetscape (probably needed) or finding more holistic ways to revitalize the area which is pretty rough.

Oklahoma Gazette News: N.W. 39th strip

This is an exciting development. From what I'm hearing, the biggest barrier to progress is the primary owners in the area. Apparently, they haven't exactly gotten on board with the drive toward renovation.

[Spartan]

I hope I can say this without offending anyone, but it's not exactly the classiest group of bars. That's not surprising. They'll have to take an introspective look within the gay community and decide if they want to have a nice district.

[Pete]

This is a weird situation because the gay community adopted an ugly, largely industrial area, primarily because it was stealth at a time where being openly gay in Oklahoma was -- to put it politely -- frowned upon.

That area emerged in the 70's and if you weren't gay, you probably never even knew those bars were there. Most were plain outside with a very discrete sign -- if there was one at all. I'd say even most the young people in town didn't know about Angles and the others well into the 80's.

So, the local gay community ended up centering on a pretty lousy area, instead of cool neighborhoods like West Hollywood, Oak Lawn in Dallas or what you would find in a lot of bigger cities. And of course, those areas have become some of the most desirable urban neighborhoods in the U.S.

Making matters worse, it's not an area you can walk to from anywhere any of us would want to live. Putnam Heights is east of there but I doubt very seriously anyone is walking over from that neighborhood.


Frankly, I'd almost rather not put energy and resources into yet another urban district. It would be far better if some of those establishments would merely adopt the Plaza District, Film Row or any of the dozen other urban areas that all currently lack critical mass.

Even with improved streetscape and the like, this is never going to have the charm of 20 other OKC areas I could name.

Also, having gay/mixed bars closer to established bars and restaurants would help everyone in terms of business-to-business flow.


Probably not going to happen, though, so best to try and spruce up 39th & Penn.

[Pete]

Let's take a look at the buildings in this area...

Because this started out as largely metal warehouses, even newer construction has been to very low standards:

The Boom


Tramps


Park / Wreck Room (this is the one nice little strip)


Angles


Phoenix Rising and Star Pizza have potential (left side of this street view; Park / Wreck Room on right:

[Spartan]

In that last photo the ROW is huge. They could just re-stripe the road as one lane bidirectional with a center lane for left turns (so 3 total) and add angled on-street parking, and then widen the sidewalks. I don't think the road pavement is in bad shape so you could retain most of that, but curb-to-building absolutely needs to be reconstructed.

Isn't it more than just the 4-5 clubs you mentioned above? I agree that the need for a "gay ghetto" should be reevaluated but probably won't be. The concept of a "gay ghetto" as it relates to the Village in NYC works because it's mixed-use and people live there. I just don't get the idea of having a "ghetto" (and I mean that in the cultural sense, not as a pejorative term) that everyone drives to.

[Pete]

There are a couple more clubs (Finish Line & the Copa) in the Habana Inn.

But this property fronts I-44 rather than 39th. It's a big part of that neighborhood but it doesn't contribute much to the 39th Street frontage.

[Bunty]

Haven't gays been fleeing from Oklahoma City for the last decade to friendlier cities, like nearby Dallas? The too often less than friendly atmosphere gays live under in OKC can't provide much inspiration to look forward to for a better future on 39th St. It's very good that there is Shadid, along with Sen. Al McAffrey to counter Sally Kern, but as a Democrat there's not much he can do.

As I understand it, Angles is never open anymore, unless it's for a special event. That tells me the gay district is stagnant at best, with the fairly recently built Boom probably saving the district from outright decline. Perhaps other gay districts in America aren't doing much and are fighting decline.

[Pete]

The problem with the area (apart from aesthetics) is there are only clubs/bars; no retail or real restaurants or other services.

The only possible exception is the Habana Inn but that hardly gives locals reasons to go to the area.

39th & Penn has always been the epicenter of gay nightlife in OKC but it's never been a true district. I suppose a little streetscape couldn't hurt but I really feel like this is never going to be the place people are going to be spending a weekend afternoon.

[soonerguru]

There are a couple more clubs (Finish Line & the Copa) in the Habana Inn.

But this property fronts I-44 rather than 39th. It's a big part of that neighborhood but it doesn't contribute much to the 39th Street frontage.

Is Gusher's, the piano bar, still there?

[soonerguru]

Haven't gays been fleeing from Oklahoma City for the last decade to friendlier cities, like nearby Dallas? The too often less than friendly atmosphere gays live under in OKC can't provide much inspiration to look forward to for a better future on 39th St. It's very good that there is Shadid, along with Sen. Al McAffrey to counter Sally Kern, but as a Democrat there's not much he can do.

As I understand it, Angles is never open anymore, unless it's for a special event. That tells me the gay district is stagnant at best, with the fairly recently built Boom probably saving the district from outright decline. Perhaps other gay districts in America aren't doing much and are fighting decline.

If this year's Pride Parade is any indication, OKC has never been more gay-friendly than it is now. Sally Kern hurts us nationally image-wise, but she doesn't represent OKC.