Change the Method, Not the Message.

[metro]

Change the Method, Not the Message - LifeChurch.tv : swerve

[Martin]

just put the movie id inside the youtube tag, not the whole url.

like so:
[ yt ]gWRv1mf-Bk4[ /yt ]

-M

[metro]

Thanks M!

[HVAC Instructor]

From the comments section of youtube:

(2:50) It's a sad day when people aren't in church because they're "not interested". There are people going to hell every day not because they're not interested in church but because they're not hearing the TRUE Gospel. I'm sure if people knew the Bible was true they were TRULY loved by a Holy and Just God Who died for their sins to keep them out of hell, they might have an interest in hearing about it.

We REALLY do need to reach these people!!!

Translation: The church really needs to find better methods of communication to get people into church through guilt and fear tactics such as the concept of spending an eternity in hell for not accepting our concept of god. (but god loves you! and the church needs the money.)

[Midtowner]

And boy oh boy does LC need the money. Those webservers and laser light shows don't pay for themselves y'know.

[PennyQuilts]

Back in the days when I was a practicing Baptist, I found the amount of money given to the pastor and his family for every single thing they wanted to be a real stumbling block, as they say. I mean, I couldn't afford to take my kids to DisneyWorld but they'd take up collections so they could, and camps and trips to Europe and you name it. If I heard once, I heard a zillion times that you need to look past the messenger to the message - just the same, it left a bad taste in my mouth. I felt like the flock was getting fleeced a bit too much.

[HVAC Instructor]

Back in the days when I was a practicing Baptist, I found the amount of money given to the pastor and his family for every single thing they wanted to be a real stumbling block, as they say. I mean, I couldn't afford to take my kids to DisneyWorld but they'd take up collections so they could, and camps and trips to Europe and you name it. If I heard once, I heard a zillion times that you need to look past the messenger to the message - just the same, it left a bad taste in my mouth. I felt like the flock was getting fleeced a bit too much.

You godless heathen!

[PennyQuilts]

You godless heathen!

Heathen, yes. Godless, nope!

[HVAC Instructor]

Heathen, yes. Godless, nope!

Wait a minute...don't you pagan types worship godesses?

[PennyQuilts]

Wait a minute...don't you pagan types worship godesses?

Some do. It is definitely open to a maternalistic leanings but not nearly so rigid as the paternalistic ones.

That being said, if you want an orderly society, a paternalistic religion is your best bet.

[HVAC Instructor]

Some do. It is definitely open to a maternalistic leanings but not nearly so rigid as the paternalistic ones.

That being said, if you want an orderly society, a paternalistic religion is your best bet.

People are going to start whispering stuff about us if we keep agreeing like this.

Yes, if women ran the world, there would be no wars. I could live with that. I've had enough macho BS for my lifetime.

[Luke]

Translation: The church really needs to find better methods of communication to get people into church through guilt and fear tactics such as the concept of spending an eternity in hell for not accepting our concept of god. (but god loves you! and the church needs the money.)

Are you opposed to punishing people generally speaking?

[PennyQuilts]

Yes, if women ran the world, there would be no wars. I could live with that. I've had enough macho BS for my lifetime.

Oh, I don't agree with that, darling. Women can be plain mean - tons meaner than men. You didn't want to fall into the hands of Apache women, for sure. I've seen women cause more commotion on a slow afternoon than men can do in a month. I do think mothers want to stop war because they have kids to protect. I also think it is really, really difficult to keep young men from going out and clobbering SOMEONE if they don't have a good war. Thank god for contact sports is all I can say about that energy reliever.

[metro]

And boy oh boy does LC need the money. Those webservers and laser light shows don't pay for themselves y'know.

Actually LC asks far less often for money than any other church I've attended or visited. Show me another church who offers a 100% money back guarantee on the tithe and tells you to take out of the offering bucket if you're an adult in need of food,clothing or shelter.

[HVAC Instructor]

Oh, I don't agree with that, darling. Women can be plain mean - tons meaner than men. You didn't want to fall into the hands of Apache women, for sure. I've seen women cause more commotion on a slow afternoon than men can do in a month. I do think mothers want to stop war because they have kids to protect. I also think it is really, really difficult to keep young men from going out and clobbering SOMEONE if they don't have a good war. Thank god for contact sports is all I can say about that energy reliever.

Goes back to the yin/yang principle of balance. And that was what I was referring to: Mothers. My mother is Cherokee, but I'd swear she's Apache, but she completely despises war.

[Easy180]

Actually LC asks far less often for money than any other church I've attended or visited. Show me another church who offers a 100% money back guarantee on the tithe and tells you to take out of the offering bucket if you're an adult in need of food,clothing or shelter.

How many folks tithing would have the bells to walk in and ask for their tithe back?....Probably a little cynical but I'm certain the guarantee and the whole take money from the bucket wouldn't be offered up as much if they weren't raking in the cash

Have nothing against LC but it's beyond evident their cash flow is plenty strong

[bluedogok]

How many folks tithing would have the bells to walk in and ask for their tithe back?....Probably a little cynical but I'm certain the guarantee and the whole take money from the bucket wouldn't be offered up as much if they weren't raking in the cash

Have nothing against LC but it's beyond evident their cash flow is plenty strong

They said the same thing when there was barely 100 at the one service when they met in a large empty room a Mat Hoffman's bicycle facility at 122nd & Santa Fe. That message hadn't changed in the time that I went there up until the time that I moved to Austin in 2003.

[Easy180]

They said the same thing when there was barely 100 at the one service when they met in a large empty room a Mat Hoffman's bicycle facility at 122nd & Santa Fe. That message hadn't changed in the time that I went there up until the time that I moved to Austin in 2003.

I'm sure it has stayed the same bluedog...Just comes across more as marketing to me is all...They know very few would take them up on the offer

[HVAC Instructor]

Are you opposed to punishing people generally speaking?

How in the world did you come to make that ASSumption?

[Luke]

How in the world did you come to make that ASSumption?

Are you backtracking? Why not answer my original question?

[HVAC Instructor]

Are you backtracking? Why not answer my original question?

Geezeo-Petey! I'm missing your logic Luke. Here's my comment you are referring to:

From the comments section of youtube:

Translation: The church really needs to find better methods of communication to get people into church through guilt and fear tactics such as the concept of spending an eternity in hell for not accepting our concept of god. (but god loves you! and the church needs the money.)

I was referring to the use of fear and guilt by churches to increase attendance and income to the church. Get a grip man! What's that got to do with punsihment, as in law & order? There is no law in America you break by not believing in a particular diety, (although there are some here who wish there was) or not attending church and tithing. You are attempting a strawman argument here.

[Midtowner]

Actually LC asks far less often for money than any other church I've attended or visited. Show me another church who offers a 100% money back guarantee on the tithe and tells you to take out of the offering bucket if you're an adult in need of food,clothing or shelter.

I've never been to a church which required or even asked for anything called a "tithe" (even thought he church I attend invented the darn thing).

[Luke]

Geezeo-Petey! I'm missing your logic Luke. I was referring to the use of fear and guilt by churches to increase attendance and income to the church.

First, you're assuming hell is not real.

Obviously, if there were no hell, then you might be accurate in your assessment of LifeChurch's alleged scare tactics.

However, if there is a hell, then is it not the responsibility of people who believe in hell to warn people about the dangers therein?

I would hope (at the very least) that the murderers, rapists and torturers of the world who get away with it in this life would at least get what's coming to them in the one to come.

Finally, I believe that our innate sense of right and wrong and the expression of that in our society by means of a system of justice (which I assume you support) is simply a reflection of the ultimate justice system in place by our Creator.

[Martin]

How in the world did you come to make that ASSumption?

that looks an awful lot like flamebait... and it was unnecessary. certainly you're capable of carrying on a conversation like a mature adult.

-M

[Martin]

even though the church i attend invented the darn thing

huh... i didn't know you were jewish.

-M