Religion is Bovine Scat

[HVAC Instructor]

Can't add anything to that. Enjoy!

[mmonroe]

Okay, I get that you probably don't believe in God or a god and you have every right to believe or not believe what you want, but how about a little respect for those who do. This isn't even about religion, but a fact of respect for others beliefs.

[HVAC Instructor]

Okay, I get that you probably don't believe in God or a god and you have every right to believe or not believe what you want, but how about a little respect for those who do. This isn't even about religion, but a fact of respect for others beliefs.

What about respect for my beliefs? Although I have not yet stated what my beliefs are. Who are you to sit in judgement of me? Who are you to assume my intent?

Seek first to understand, my friend, before passing judjement upon others...

[PennyQuilts]

Anyone who takes the time to start a thread like this is either trying to be provocative or is being intolerant. You can't have it both ways to post a thread that has a titloe attacking religion and then claim "don't judge me" and demand respect for YOUR beliefs. This is a notice me, notice me thread if I ever saw one. Okay, you got noticed. If you can't stand the heat, don't post stuff like this and then whine when people respond the way you clearly intended.

[mmonroe]

Well put ECO.

@HVAC I stated you had every right to believe/not believe. I'm not passing judgment, just asking for a little tolerance for those around you. My understanding was just that of which you posted. "All religions is bovine scat" or in the words of George Carlin, "bull****", and the fact that you "can't add anything to that," made me believe that you were inline with the same thoughts as George Carlin. Obviously if you were not, then you would have stated so or not posted such a post.

[HVAC Instructor]

Anyone who takes the time to start a thread like this is either trying to be provocative or is being intolerant. You can't have it both ways to post a thread that has a titloe attacking religion and then claim "don't judge me" and demand respect for YOUR beliefs. This is a notice me, notice me thread if I ever saw one. Okay, you got noticed. If you can't stand the heat, don't post stuff like this and then whine when people respond the way you clearly intended.

Chill ECO. I'm just having some fun here, and yes, I am being provacative. How perceptive of you! (Must be that lawyer training kicking in ) I happen to find humor in religion. I also find Christians to be among the most intolerant people on the planet next to Muslims. And you seem quite intolerant yourself sometimes.

And, my dear, I can indeed take the heat.

So, if you find yourself offended by this thread, ask yourself why. If you know that you know that your belief is correct, and everyone else is wrong, then just smile and ignore it....that is unless you really are not sure and the George Carlin video upsets you because your "faith" is really not as strong as you thought, and you actually have doubts.

BTW - I'm Agnostic. Agnostic is not the same as Atheist. Look it up. And look up ALL of the definitions before latching onto only one of them and making an incorrect ASSumption. Then, if you find yourself interested, and I'll explain my version of Agnosticism.

[PennyQuilts]

Gawd what a boor.

[HVAC Instructor]

Gawd what a boor.

Come on ECO...You are a much better jouster than that!

[PennyQuilts]

Gawd what a boor.

Sorry, that was rude. I admit, I am decidedly intolerant of religious intolerance. Probably the pagan in me. It also sets my teeth on edge for people to preach to others about their internal belief systems absent a request for discussion. By that, I mean there are a lot of people out there who are extremely proud of their beliefs and want to tell the world. A lot of agnostics and atheists tend to do this but for the life of me, I can't imagine why anyone would think anyone else is really interested. That is a personal thing. Dragging other people into it strikes me as someone who is insecure in their beliefs and wants to bounce them off other people to see if they fit. Or convert them so they won't be alone or, and this is the usual one, show off that they aren't running with the crowd. In Oklahoma, that is sometimes hard to do. I get that. But really, it is alot like talking about your sex life. In the abstract, fine. Personal stuff, icky. Go pray or something and leave us out of it.

[HVAC Instructor]

Sorry, that was rude. I admit, I am decidedly intolerant of religious intolerance. Probably the pagan in me. It also sets my teeth on edge for people to preach to others about their internal belief systems absent a request for discussion. By that, I mean there are a lot of people out there who are extremely proud of their beliefs and want to tell the world. A lot of agnostics and atheists tend to do this but for the life of me, I can't imagine why anyone would think anyone else is really interested. That is a personal thing. Dragging other people into it strikes me as someone who is insecure in their beliefs and wants to bounce them off other people to see if they fit. Or convert them so they won't be alone or, and this is the usual one, show off that they aren't running with the crowd. In Oklahoma, that is sometimes hard to do. I get that. But really, it is alot like talking about your sex life. In the abstract, fine. Personal stuff, icky. Go pray or something and leave us out of it.

Much better response ECO!

You are still making assumptions, however. But..I am thrilled to learn you are a pagan!!

OK, to your bolded quote above. You can't imagine why anyone is interested in anyone elses beliefs? Then why did you just tell me you are pagan? Do you want to convert me..LOL! And you invited yourself into this conversation, so there is nothing for me to leave you out of, is there?

This is an internet thread on a subject that I happen to be interested in. I have a few more provacative religious comedic videos to post at a later time, so prepare yourself.

You are quite the interesting character too! Not to get personal here...but since you brought it up...If you promise not to talk about your sex life, I promise not to talk about mine. Actually, I will not be talking about mine whether you talk about yours or not.

I am indeed looking for a discussion here. I realize I'm a noob here and you old heads feel compelled to challenge me. I'm OK with that. Just understand I'm up for the challenge.

[mmonroe]

Honestly, this forum is about Value, Morals, and all stuff Spiritual... i didn't see religion in that description.

[oneforone]

In my honest opinion, people have a right to believe whatever they choose to believe or not to believe.

I am a Christian and your not. No skin off my nose. I will respect you for that provided you respect me for believing in God and Jesus Christ.

The only thing I may do is compare notes with you and see why you believe what you believe. I like to know why people see things they way they do. Most of the time I find people have not done their homework on politics or relgion. They believe one thing or another based on what they hear in the media or from friends that are full of BS.

[HVAC Instructor]

In my honest opinion, people have a right to believe whatever they choose to believe or not to believe.

I am a Christian and your not. No skin off my nose. I will respect you for that provided you respect me for believing in God and Jesus Christ.

The only thing I may do is compare notes with you and see why you believe what you believe. I like to know why people see things they way they do. Most of the time I find people have not done their homework on politics or relgion. They believe one thing or another based on what they hear in the media or from friends that are full of BS.

Thank you OFO. That is all I am looking for is a discussion. I too want to know what others believe, how they came to believe it, and whether they still sometimes have doubts and questions about their beliefs.

Many people want their religious beliefs to be placed off limits to questioning for some reason. I do not understand this because if a belief is of a solid foundation, questions concerning that belief should not be able to crack that foundation.

[PennyQuilts]

For many people, their religion is sincere and private, something between themselves and their god. They don't care what others believe and don't feel the need to explain themselves to others or debate the issues. It is not a haughty lack of care, simply an absence of needing to explain or convert.

IMO, once you start explaining how your theology "works," you are going to start getting into a man made swamp. God/Goddess, to my way of thinking, is way too big for puny mortals to explain, define or really understand. The second you go down that path, you are limiting it to your own understanding of how things work. For those of us like myself, it is just something you know in your soul. You learn to trust your instincts and work to shut up your inner self so you can hear something besides internal racket. The more involved your religion is, the more man has attempted to put his stamp on a force of nature. It is like erecting a skyscraper on the frozen tundra. It suits man, not the tundra. And tells you nothing about the tundra except for those places where man tries to control it for his own purposes.

[evh5150]

for those who dont believe in any divine deity..you simply believe everything just exploded into perfection ala the big bang theory?

yeah, ..right...sure.

ive seen many things explode. never seen anything explode into flawless perfection.

going along the lines of what eastcoastokie is saying, i believe the end of the world will arrive when man's intelligence has achieved a level that he believes he can rationally explain everything, and with logical scientific blueprints to map it all out.

when adam and eve ate the apple they were told by the serpent beforehand that they would attain a level of intelligence akin to a god-like status. mankind's intellect increases everyday as we figure new things out, and learn about what we never knew before.

so one day, in the far-fetched future..we will have learned and discovered everything..literally everything. ..and thats when the world's demise will come, when not a single soul hardly believes in a god at all.

[USG '60]

for those who dont believe in any divine deity..you simply believe everything just exploded into perfection ala the big bang theory?

yeah, ..right...sure.

ive seen many things explode. never seen anything explode into flawless perfection.

going along the lines of what eastcoastokie is saying, i believe the end of the world will arrive when man's intelligence has achieved a level that he believes he can rationally explain everything, and with logical scientific blueprints to map it all out.

when adam and eve ate the apple they were told by the serpent beforehand that they would attain a level of intelligence akin to a god-like status. mankind's intellect increases everyday as we figure new things out, and learn about what we never knew before.

so one day, in the far-fetched future..we will have learned and discovered everything..literally everything. ..and thats when the world's demise will come, when not a single soul hardly believes in a god at all.

That would be weird of ol' God, don't you think? So what does he do, since hardly anyone believes in him, just say, "Screw 'em all," and catch the whole planet on fire and be done with it? Or What? This is the strangest belief and prediction I ever heard. Who gave you this idea? Or are you a prophet of some sort? Just Curious.

[mmonroe]

I too am christian, I don't like to discuss manners about religion, but I do believe I am christian as not part of a religion, but as part of a relationship with God.

@evh I believe when the Bible talks about the serpent telling adam and eve that they would become to a "god like sense" that he was purely talking about knowing the difference between good and evil. At the time, Adam and Eve knew only good and not evil. It's why they were then aware of their nakedness and hid from one another and God.

[mugofbeer]

[QUOTE=HVAC Instructor;245033]Can't add anything to that. Enjoy!

HVAC - if your goal is to get a discussion going, you used a pretty foul way of doing it. You made an assessment of religion and gave your opinion. You did it on an anonymous chat page but if you used that sort of method on the street and said "Hey buddy, your wife looks like Bovine Scat" you might not be alive right now. If you went to Saudi Arabia and said "Allah is Bovine Scat" your body might be in a dozen pieces and being dragged around the streets of the city. You have a pretty funny way of saying something and then expect people to be civil. I agree with the poster above, I think its more of a perverted way of making a big statement to compensate for something else that is small - and this is coming from an agnostic.

[HVAC Instructor]

[QUOTE=mugofbeer;245243]

Can't add anything to that. Enjoy!

HVAC - if your goal is to get a discussion going, you used a pretty foul way of doing it. You made an assessment of religion and gave your opinion. You did it on an anonymous chat page but if you used that sort of method on the street and said "Hey buddy, your wife looks like Bovine Scat" you might not be alive right now. If you went to Saudi Arabia and said "Allah is Bovine Scat" your body might be in a dozen pieces and being dragged around the streets of the city. You have a pretty funny way of saying something and then expect people to be civil. I agree with the poster above, I think its more of a perverted way of making a big statement to compensate for something else that is small - and this is coming from an agnostic.

So Mugsy, are you telling me these good peaceful Christians on the street would physically harm me for daring to point out the utter ridiculosness of their fairytale they call a religion? And you point out the obvious of what Islamists would do. Beautiful! You just made the point perfectly as to why religion is bull****, specifically the Abrahamic religions.

So much for the concept of peaceful religion.

[mmonroe]

who said all religion was peaceful? You can't tell me that there hasn't been at least one time that any religion, or lack of one, wasn't crazy or dangerous at one point in their existence of being a religion.

[HVAC Instructor]

who said all religion was peaceful? You can't tell me that there hasn't been at least one time that any religion, or lack of one, wasn't crazy or dangerous at one point in their existence of being a religion.

Exactly!! Both Islam and Christianity claim to be peaceful religions, but we all know better, although Christianity has managed to evolve beyond the violence it once openly advocated. Islam unfortunately has failed to evolve. Society can only hope religion eventually evolves out of existence or at least into a non intrusive form.

[mugofbeer]

I think you are trying to twist what I said to support your obvious attempt to anger the Christian community out there. First, I never said anything about Christians attacking you on the street for your point of view. On the contrary, I think the vast majority of evangelicals out there would love to engage you in a discussion of religion and never, ever utter a foul word as long as you didn't attack them in some way. I know the same isn't true for evangelical or Islamists out there.

Second, I never said religion wasn't the cause of much of the world's strife. But the vast majority of Christians are tolerant of those who are not religious and don't try to force their religion on you. Of course, there are those who are intolerant and do try to force their morals and beliefs - but they are in a minority. I have different feelings about Islam but I have no doubt much of it is ignorance about the religion on my part.

Third, you seem to assume I am a Christian. I am also agnostic myself but I am not going to put someone down or insult their religion or their beliefs just because I find some silly pleasure out of it. Christianity has had a huge positive impact on our country and the world along with its significant negative impact.

Fourth, I never said Christianity is a peaceful religion. Christians are to turn the other cheek but Christians are not going to take the Ghandi route and do it until everything and everyone they know is destroyed. No where does it say Christians cannot defend themselves. I feel quite certain that if attacked by a muslim nation, virtually all Christians of this country would happily defend their faith, their families and their country. Of course the same is true for ANY country that attacks this one - Christians will be at the front of the line to defend it.

My entire statement was to show how hypocritically "intolerant" the point of your entire thread is and point out the fact that belief in anything, whether its religion, whether its politics, diet, exercise and fitness, ecology, homosexuality or 1000 other things - will always result in some number of people who take things to the extreme. Of the 325 million or so people in this country, a large percent call themselves Christian - for S's & G's say 200 million. With 200 million Christians, you are pretty likely to have 50 million or so who are pretty fundamentalist. Of those, there may be 3-5 million who are extremely devout and fundamentalist. Of those you will have a few hundred thousand who you might consider to be pretty off the wall. More Christians = more intolerant people. More nutritionistas = more calls for the end of McDonalds and Tex-mex food.

Bring up veganism and you will find hundreds of people who take it to the extreme and protest to stop people from eating meat (as if that is going to stop anyone). Go to a gay pride parade and you will find people who demand homosexuality taught in school and want textbooks to mention the gender preference of those discussed. You will find factions who hate men (period). You will also find factions who support the rights of children to have sexual relations with adult men (NAMBLA). There are extremists everywhere and when you make hostile statements about religion such as you did on this thread, you risk looking rather extremist and hateful yourself. If you want to live a good agnostic life, try starting with tolerance.

Don't sit there and try to say that Christians are more intolerant than another group. Personally, I find left-leaning entertainers and 20-something political activists to be the most hypocritical and intolerant people around. Exactly how and why is it you equate Christianity with pacifism and unwillingness to defend itself?

[PennyQuilts]

Mug, I so enjoy your thoughtful, real and reasonable posts.

[mugofbeer]

Thank you. I just enjoy good, respectful debate. There are things I am pretty intolerant about too, though, admittedly.

[HVAC Instructor]

Don't sit there and try to say that Christians are more intolerant than another group. Personally, I find left-leaning entertainers and 20-something political activists to be the most hypocritical and intolerant people around. Exactly how and why is it you equate Christianity with pacifism and unwillingness to defend itself?

You twist just as much, no more, than you accuse me of doing. The discussion here is religion, not gays, not NAMBLA nor any of the other strawman arguments you just put forth in your verbose reply. And I did not say nor assume you were a Christian. I actually read your post, did you actually read mine? Further, how you assume I equate Christianity with an unwillingness to defend itself is beyond me. Didn't say it. Didn't imply it. I was responding to your implication that I would not say to a Christian face to face that their religion is a fairytale, but you put it into the context of insulting someones wife. Verbosity does not a well thought out reply make.

Bottom line, all religion is man made and has no basis in fact or historical or archeological evidence to back up the existence of a divine being, period. That is the discussion here, not veganism or any of the other ism's you have attempted to get this thread off track with.