I am really worried about West & Northwest OKC

[Pete]

I'm talking about everything south of Memorial and west of Portland. And now that I think about it, that's pretty much the boundaries for the Putnam City schools.

As I mentioned in another thread, that whole area is really looking shabby, even the somewhat newer areas around PC North (north of NW Expressway). There is a huge pawn shop just west of McArthur on NWE and I noticed several check cashing and pawn places as you head northwest.

I went to PC schools for all 12 years and at the time, they were considered best in the state. I know from a recent 25-year reunion that the huge majority of the people I went to school with now live in the Edmond/QS area.

And why wouldn't they? You can buy a new or nearly new house out there pretty reasonably and it only takes about 20 minutes to get downtown.

But the net result is that a giant section of town is really starting to suffer and I don't see anything turning the tide. I think people will just continue to abandon the area for Edmond schools.


This is the direct result of 1) building freeways out in the middle of nowhere that only encourages sprawl and 2) absolutely zero planning by OKC and Edmond. They basically rubber stamp any development presented to them. The new development is way out of proportion with population growth, so you basically have people just shifting to another part of town.


And I'm afraid the damage is already done and the NW side of town will continue to go downhill indefinitely. That's a huge area that was considered upper middle class just a couple of decades ago.


For all the things being done right in central OKC (which rotted and was abandoned for the exact same reasons, just at an earlier time) the city is doing a terrible job elsewhere. I'd sure like to see the mayor and other city leaders address this problem in the near future.

[CCOKC]

I understand what you are saying. My mom lives near NWE and Rockwell and everytime we want to go out to eat out that way, we have to come back to my side of town, inner NW. There are a lot of fast food restaurants along the NWE but no nice sit down kind of restaurants that we like.

[Karried]

Yes, I agree with the above. When I was selling real estate I had quite a few clients who told me they wanted to move out of the area because it hds gone downhill.

It's an older neighborhood/area and it appears that they don't have the benefits of strong HOA or CCRs (like historical districts) that force you to maintain your property to keep property values strong.

It's really sad.

[jbrown84]

The neighborhood I lived in as a kid at Council and Hefner looks REALLY bad these days. Almost as bad as some of the inner city areas.

The problem is, I don't think the City of Edmond is in the business of being concerned about the well-being of another city's once-growing neighborhoods.

[Pete]

What's really bad is that so many people are leaving the city limits of OKC for Edmond, Deer Creek and now even Guthrie.

That means an erosion of the tax base yet there are still the same number of roads to maintain, same area in which to provide police and fire, etc.


I drove down 39th street and it now looks, really, really bad. The Bethany part is actually okay but east of there even the fast food places are closing.

Northwest Expressway seems to be heading in the same direction.

[Pete]

jbrown, that's true about Edmond but remember before OKC built out Memorial Road then the Kilpartrick Turnpike and greatly expanded Broadway Extension (not to mention okay-ing Quail Springs Mall) Edmond was not the place to be.

And much of what people consider Edmond (and a good chunk of the Ed school district) is actually in OKC city limits.


BTW, Mayor Cornett was two years ahead of me at Putnam City and grew up in the area we are all discussing. He's more aware than anyone of the downward slide. I'd sure like to bend his ear on this subject.

[Misty]

We are paying the price for the sprawl. I hate urban sprawl! I was pretty active with the Austin Home Builders Association before I moved here because of my job but it was so hard to watch the big sprawl push there from the builders.

[escan]

I agree. My husband and I lived in the Western Ave. corridor, moved to Wichita, lived downtown in a loft and are now moving back. We looked EVERYWHERE for houses...somewhat limited because I def. wanted a pool and had to buy the one weekend we were in town, so couldn't wait for the "perfect" house to come on the market. All of those areas we looked at in NW OKC...Edgewater, Blue Stem, etc were really, really shabby compared to just a few years ago. It was really sad. Even though I always said I don't like urban sprawl or new (ish) construction, we just put an offer in on an Edmond(ish) house in the Oaks, just off the turnpike because it's really cost effective, has an awesome pool (deal closer) and is around lots of new restaurants and stores. In my more urban based mindset, this goes against everything I believe in, but it's almost like I'm being "forced" to live there to get the amenities we want....thank goodness, as Malibu Sooner alludes to, my address is still OKC...whew!

[Misty]

It's a shame to see neighborhoods get run down. There needs to be active neighborhood associations. I've recently been elected Secretary of the Neighborhood Alliance board, if you want to know who your neighborhood officers are or see if you even have an association in your area contact Georgie Rasco, Director, at 528.6322. If you need help getting one started, improving your existing association or starting a security patrol they can assist. They really are a wealth of information, knowledge and training to help build strong neighborhoods. Georgie helped us get Urban Neighbors up and running and is AMAZING. More info at
Neighborhood Alliance

[CuatrodeMayo]

To be a positive voice here:

I believe we will start to see the tide turn against sprawl. Individuality is becoming more popular in our culture and I think that will have a negative impact on cookie-cutter housing developments on the outskirts of the city.

Look for the younger generation of homebuyers to begin to avoid the higher-priced boring homes and instead purchase a better-built, more unique home closer into the city. Our urban neighborhoods will begin to gentrify as more and more young people look leave their parents in the distant suburbs and move closer to the action.

The growth of distant suburbs will reach a critical mass at which it will make more sense to buy and fix up older homes in less-than-desireable neighborhoods.

The tide is now turning against long commutes by automobile as well, people want to be close to work and, as was noted in the MAPS3 survey, they want mass transit options. Mass transit and typical suburban development are nearly mutually exclusive.

And remember, amenities should follow the people, not the other way around. Be a pioneer!

[escan]

I agree Cuatro...I've lived urban for a long, long time.....both in a historical area and in a converted warehouse. HOWEVER, when you say amenities should follow the people, I think it should really read, Amenities "should" follow the people...because in theory that works, but in practice, it's not that easy. I always preached urban living and looked disdainfully at people who chose to move closer to the outskirts, but as a professional in my early thirties, who doesn't want to spend money on private schooling..... it forced my husband and I to be a little more open minded about locations as we look to (finally) start a family....I swear people act like we're the only couple in our thirties without kids in the entire state! Ha!

[rugbybrado]

I swear people act like we're the only couple in our thirties without kids in the entire state! Ha!

whats the ticking sound i hear?

[Pete]

escan, glad to hear you guys are moving back to town!

And I don't fault anyone for living in Edmond. It's just a shame that a great deal of it's growth and success has to come at the expense of NW OKC.

[Karried]

escan, I think you hit the nail on the head... as we get older, ( at least in my case) I knew I had to have a good school district .... Nearly every decision we make ( and for the last 14 years) it's been with the kid's best interest in mind. In fact, that's a major reason we left the Bay Area and moved to OK. It's amazing what you'll do when you have kids!

I hope the area improves.. I agree with the Neighborhood Assoc. .. HOA and CCR's really help maintain the neighborhood.

(Even though our nosy neighbor drives us all crazy because she calls the city on anyone and everyone who parks a boat in the driveway or has a trailer, etc etc.. if your grass grows over 12" in the backyard, you can count on her calling). But in the long run I guess it will keep property values up.. but she sure is disliked by everyone!

[escan]

whats the ticking sound i hear?

Seriously....It's not my biolgical clock is it? Think my MIL believes her poor baby has lost his chance now that we've waited so long. Whatever!

[Karried]

I had my first son when I was 30 and my second 5 years later.... I loved waiting - felt settled and ready to have a baby. Now, it's all the rage to have babies when your 'older' not that your older! Sorry, I'm taking this way off topic...

What would be the best thing to do now to get the area 'nice' again?

[Dark Jedi]

Yes, I agree with the above. When I was selling real estate I had quite a few clients who told me they wanted to move out of the area because it hds gone downhill.

It's an older neighborhood/area and it appears that they don't have the benefits of strong HOA or CCRs (like historical districts) that force you to maintain your property to keep property values strong.

It's really sad.

A HOA or CCR is a reason I refuse to buy in an area. That knife cuts both ways. I refuse to live where some bored retired covenant Nazi can sue me because he doesen't like the color of my shed, or the direction I cut my grass.

[David Pollard]

All I can say about urban sprawl is Oil at >$80 per barrel! Talk about ticking clocks! It is only a matter of time before reality sets in and people (or the city) realize they can no longer afford the luxury of living in such a widely dispersed manner. It is just always such a shame that OKC has to be so far behind the curve. Can someone enlighten me why this is the case?

[Karried]

Ha,ha.. that describes my neighbor!

On one hand she is a pain in the butt... on the other hand, the guy who tried to park his car on the lawn won't try that again.

I think there has to be a fine line between not caring at all what the neighbors do with their property and being overzealous about a boat or a motorhome in the driveway over Labor Day weekend...the best deal is when the HOA can help maintain the neighborhood while still being understanding and neighborly.

[Misty]

A HOA or CCR is a reason I refuse to buy in an area. That knife cuts both ways. I refuse to live where some bored retired covenant Nazi can sue me because he doesen't like the color of my shed, or the direction I cut my grass.

I'm talking about voluntary neighborhood associations, not necessarily homeowners associations.

[MadMonk]

Say what you will about the evils of urbal sprawl, but it will take a lot more than $80-$100/barrel oil to get me to move back into the city core.

I like the wide-open spaces, thank you very much. The far-northwest and Deer Creek areas are perfect (for me). In fact, we are considering building a new house around the County Line and Waterloo area. It's close enough to conveniences, but still plenty of space between houses in the neighborhood.

Houses so close that you can jump from rooftop to rooftop, or stacking people vertically in box-like condos and apartments is not my idea of paradise. That's not to say I'm against it if you like that sort of thing. Different strokes and all that. Besides, it leaves more room for me and other like-minded people.

[Misty]

MadMonk's gone country.......look at them boots

[traxx]

The problem is that when they built the area we're talking about neigborhood assocs. were practically unheard of and HOAs weren't as strong. So the neighborhoods in that area that do have HOAs really don't enforce much, so you're just paying for nothing. Plus it's not a historical area so most people see the houses and neighborhoods as nothing special and not worth saving.

I mentioned just the other day in another one of Malibu's threads about how I grew up in the area (the original Warwick) and how it's sad to see what the area has turned into. In my time Warwick was one of the nicer neighborhoods. Now all the housing additions are going downhill (or have already gone downhill) and the businesses around there have left nothing but empyt concrete shells.

Don't get me wrong, I need to have my space and if I had the resources would live on 20 acres but it would be country living. The problem with the DC/Edmond/Piedmont area is city living in the country. Meaning no matter how far out you move Little Ceasers, McD's, Starbucks, 7-11, etc. are gonna follow you thus creating the same problem over and over again. The evidence of that is 23rd st., 39th expwy, NW expwy etc. The same problem just keeps moving further north.

It's just really poor planning and/or a lack of planning.

[rugbybrado]

MadMonk's gone country.......look at them boots

he needs space for his mobile home and the cars in the front yard.

[windowphobe]

I'm just fine where I am (south of 50th and east of May). The houses are smallish to, um, less smallish, and sit on lots of around 8000 square feet, so there's no sense of crowding, and we're in a UCD, so there won't be any of that teardown stuff you see west of Nichols Hills. (I have one of the tinier houses, but my lot, due to street curvature, is over 11,000 square feet, so I figure I have enough room to wander around.)