OKC Not Alone In Downtown Investments

[G.Walker]

This is a little odd to ask on an OKC forum, but does anyone happen to know if the 5 Allen Center in Houston is still on schedule to be built soon?

I think its currently on hold.

However, I know Hines had announced they are going to build a new skyscraper on a current parking lot next to their BG Group Place, but wanted to secure tenant first, before they start turning dirt and ordering cranes...

[G.Walker]

Houston has been focused on a lot of high rise development outside of the urban core, and residential. BG Group Place was just completed last year, and what its first major skyscraper constructed downtown in a while, but I think things are starting to heat up in downtown Houston...

[G.Walker]

MDot,

If you are interested in following urban development in some new, fresh cities that will keep you interested, besides Austin and Charlotte. I suggest you follow Nashville and Raleigh, they are about to have a boom!

[Just the facts]

Downtown Oakland starting to come to life, couple 20 story towers, and then a larger one in the works, good deal.

http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/articl...ce-2709668.php

That article is a little dated - the Mayor Jerry Brown is now governor (again).

[MDot]

I think its currently on hold.

However, I know Hines had announced they are going to build a new skyscraper on a current parking lot next to their BG Group Place, but wanted to secure tenant first, before they start turning dirt and ordering cranes...

I heard about that. Some have speculated that's the 5 Allen Center, but no one can say that for sure.

[MDot]

MDot,

If you are interested in following urban development in some new, fresh cities that will keep you interested, besides Austin and Charlotte. I suggest you follow Nashville and Raleigh, they are about to have a boom!

Thanks for the heads up, G. I'll start looking at them.

[UrbanNebraska]

Anyone else seen that downtown Boise is booming?

New tallest for the city, 352 feet.



And JUMP Boise, a huge completely public space downtown with meeting space, studios for classes like dance and cooking ect, and amphitheater and a new park. Really impressive space.

[Spartan]

Gee what does that JUMP thing remind me of...

[Spartan]

Spartan, any clue as to where the possible residential project before Dowell's might be located?

Along the dead patch of Walker between Arts District and Plaza Court. We are probably talking 5 years out though, and that's with good market conditions.

edit: Oh, you meant a potential announcement before Dowell. I have no idea if it's a legit development at this point so I don't think blabbing about it will help.

[OKCisOK4me]

Anyone else seen that downtown Boise is booming?

Now, if our Stage Center looked like that, we'd have a whole other story on our hands!

[MDot]

Now, if our Stage Center looked like that, we'd have a whole other story on our hands!

That is what I was thinking.

[Oil Capital]

I heard about that. Some have speculated that's the 5 Allen Center, but no one can say that for sure.

I can say for sure that the Hines building is NOT 5 Allen Center. ;-) Allen Center is owned by Brookfield. If/when 5 Allen Center is built, it will be built by Brookfield. The Hines site and expected upcoming tower is on Main Street, far removed from Allen Center.

[MDot]

I can say for sure that the Hines building is NOT 5 Allen Center. ;-) Allen Center is owned by Brookfield. If/when 5 Allen Center is built, it will be built by Brookfield. The Hines site and expected upcoming tower is on Main Street, far removed from Allen Center.

Thanks for the correction/information. I was skeptical about that, but had no idea who owned the Allen Centers. I was also hoping 5 Allen Center and the upcoming tower were separate buildings.

[Spartan]

Now, if our Stage Center looked like that, we'd have a whole other story on our hands!

Still, you have to admit that seeing such a modern replica, and a modern example of what could be, is absolutely sensational. Tracey Zeeck should throw away those crappy renderings that Rees did and just adopt this Boise thing lol.

[HangryHippo]

Still, you have to admit that seeing such a modern replica, and a modern example of what could be, is absolutely sensational. Tracey Zeeck should throw away those crappy renderings that Rees did and just adopt this Boise thing lol.

I second this.

Also, how does Boise develop a nice headquarters for a bank and we still can't get MidFirst to move downtown into something similar? Just boggles the mind.

[Oil Capital]

I second this.

Also, how does Boise develop a nice headquarters for a bank and we still can't get MidFirst to move downtown into something similar? Just boggles the mind.

What boggles the mind is how anyone in Oklahoma City could sit in the shadow of the most spectacular recently-constructed office building in America and be jealous of Boise's 16-story bank building (which, incidentally, will be the tallest building to be built in Boise since 1978 and will at long last fill in the "Boise Hole".) The building will be a great addition to Boise, but OKC has no reason to be jealous or frustrated.

[HangryHippo]

It's not jealousy because a bank built a headquarters in Boise, it's wondering why OKC's development doesn't seem to be as infectious as it appears to be in many other smaller cities, ala Boise, Omaha, Des Moines.

[catch22]

Downtown is seen by most suburbanites and country folks as an entertainment place only, and where you go to court to pay your traffic tickets. Until downtown is recognized in mass as a community, and starts to function like one, you won't have a lot of large, nice projects. Not to say we don't have any or haven't had any. Ours just seem watered down relative to other developments in smaller cities.

We are almost at the tipping point, but I don't think we have reached it quite yet.

[Oil Capital]

It's not jealousy because a bank built a headquarters in Boise, it's wondering why OKC's development doesn't seem to be as infectious as it appears to be in many other smaller cities, ala Boise, Omaha, Des Moines.

Seriously? Take a look around Oklahoma City. You apparently are not seeing the forest for the trees.

[UrbanNebraska]

It's not jealousy because a bank built a headquarters in Boise, it's wondering why OKC's development doesn't seem to be as infectious as it appears to be in many other smaller cities, ala Boise, Omaha, Des Moines.

OKC is considerably ahead of these cities in terms of current urban development. Even leaving out Devon, OKC has residential projects like Level, Edge, The Hill. The NBA is huge. Larger convention space than any of those cities, much more high rise momentum with many very likely vertical additions. As well as much closer to the street car.

Cities always look more impressive from the outside. I would be beside myself if Omaha was on OKC's development level right now. You guys have lots of complaints to make sure it gets done right, and rightfully so do it right the first time so there doesn't need to be another "urban renewal" in 25 years. But there is no denying the sheer scale of projects in OKC right now.

[ljbab728]

You're right, UN. People can always cherry pick things in other cities and say "why can't we do that?" The totality of projects in OKC does outshine what's happening in many of our peer cities, however.

[Pete]

It's not jealousy because a bank built a headquarters in Boise, it's wondering why OKC's development doesn't seem to be as infectious as it appears to be in many other smaller cities, ala Boise, Omaha, Des Moines.

It's human nature to look at places less familiar and to assume there is more going on there because all the information is completely new to you.

I remember someone here recently posting about how Wichita's Old Town had a lot more restaurants and bars than Bricktown... I did a quick count and discovered Bricktown has twice as many. And in a larger sense, locals for some reason love to put down and discount Bricktown when outside visitors do nothing but rave and wish for something similar in their own communities.

One thing that works against impression in OKC is that we have SO many separate districts and therefore much of the development is spread across a lot of different areas. But good grief, just try and keep up with what is going on with one of them... I started to map out everything just on a mile of 23rd because there are about a dozen little projects underway or just completed. Deep Deuce has that many as well, and most on a pretty large scale. There is so much construction downtown you can barely navigate through it all.


I'm not picking on the poster I quote, just pointing out how when you live somewhere, the grass always seems to be greener. I can assure you as at least a partial outsider that by any measure there is a tremendous amount happening in OKC. I would even argue that no city near our size or smaller has more going on in totality.

[Pete]

OKC is considerably ahead of these cities in terms of current urban development. Even leaving out Devon, OKC has residential projects like Level, Edge, The Hill. The NBA is huge. Larger convention space than any of those cities, much more high rise momentum with many very likely vertical additions. As well as much closer to the street car.

Cities always look more impressive from the outside. I would be beside myself if Omaha was on OKC's development level right now. You guys have lots of complaints to make sure it gets done right, and rightfully so do it right the first time so there doesn't need to be another "urban renewal" in 25 years. But there is no denying the sheer scale of projects in OKC right now.

Great perspective and thanks for the reminders.

Really appreciate your participation on the forum in general.

[Pete]

One other thing because I think this is an important discussion...

There is the strong tendency here (and probably just plain human nature) to completely discount something as soon as it's done or nearly done.

Devon Tower isn't even finished and already people are talking like it's old news, completely in the past. Same with the Myriad Gardens. Virtually any city in the U.S. would KILL for either of those projects, which are both massive and world-class.

Remember how excited everyone was about Level?? Well, now it's mostly opened and nobody seems to care much any more.


Those most interested in development are insatiable, always looking for the next big project. I know, I feel it too... We (development obsessives) are also a chronically disappointed lot. Even when we finally get a big announcement, it's never big enough, cool enough, and certainly seems to take forever to happen. And even when something does pretty much measure up, we are very quick to sweep it aside in the constant search for what's next.

[HangryHippo]

It appears I incited a small cyber riot with my unintentionally inflammatory comment. I in no way meant to discount or discredit some of the truly wonderful things going on in this city. It was a classic case of not seeing the forest for the trees. Pete makes an excellent point about those of us most interested in development being insatiable. Disappointment truly seems to reign supreme at times if you don't continue to think about the little things that are still ongoing. I probably should have just said that I really wish we had two or three more mid rises under construction.