Sugar Daddy Ads on I-35 targeting our young adults

[Anonymous.]

Let's just make every billboard in OKC a bible quote and call it good.


It is frightening how much everyone in this thread here is okay with censorship.

[jerrywall]

It is frightening how much everyone in this thread here is okay with censorship.

Yes, everyone is. Including you I'd hazard a guess. Or do you think there should be no limits at all on what is put on a billboard.

What people disagree with is the line.

[jerrywall]

Gee, he surely wasn't talking about crimes done against the will of the people and against children. Typically, a person does not feel like a victim and calls the cops after doing business with a prostitute. Neither does the prostitute. I also think he thinks the media making big news stories about these provocative services and their ads makes it known and draws some people into it.

A SIGNIFICANT percentage of prostitutes begin when they are underage. An also significant percentage of prostitutes are working involuntarily, and are basically in a form of slavery. And many of those who appear to be doing it voluntarily were victims of abuse or enslavement at an early age, and have simply accepted the lifestyle as normal, after years of abuse.

Anyone who thinks there are no victims in prostitution hasn't done their research. Look into the human trafficking and massage parlours in the US. Look at the studies the UK and Sweden have done. As for legal, and well regulated prostitution? The Netherlands has legalized and well regulated prostitution, and is a top destination for human trafficking.

[Bunty]

A SIGNIFICANT percentage of prostitutes begin when they are underage. An also significant percentage of prostitutes are working involuntarily, and are basically in a form of slavery. And many of those who appear to be doing it voluntarily were victims of abuse or enslavement at an early age, and have simply accepted the lifestyle as normal, after years of abuse.

Anyone who thinks there are no victims in prostitution hasn't done their research. Look into the human trafficking and massage parlours in the US. Look at the studies the UK and Sweden have done. As for legal, and well regulated prostitution? The Netherlands has legalized and well regulated prostitution, and is a top destination for human trafficking.

Whether it's legal or not, the world's oldest profession goes on. Not every guy finds it real easy to get sexual intercourse for free. Getting the business off the streets and on the Internet is surely more good than bad.

[jerrywall]

Whether it's legal or not, the world's oldest profession goes on. Not every guy finds it real easy to get sexual intercourse for free. Getting the business off the streets and on the Internet is surely more good than bad.

Before I started making myself more aware of the human trafficking and slavery aspect of prostitution, I used to agree with you. From everything I've seen though is that the internet has just helped to proliferate the bad side even more.

[hoya]

This is really not about sugar daddy ads anymore.

[Bunty]

Before I started making myself more aware of the human trafficking and slavery aspect of prostitution, I used to agree with you. From everything I've seen though is that the internet has just helped to proliferate the bad side even more.

So then rather then just complaining about it, do you, or Bates, have any contstructive ideas as to how to stop or discourage human trafficking and/or prostitution? Is part of the problem is that it's not regarded as serious as some other crimes ,and so doesn't get as much investigative attention? If that is true, then maybe part of the problem explaining why that is so is because there isn't as much money and physical assets to confiscate to go to police departments, like there often is for drug operations. Or is there?

[jerrywall]

So then rather then just complaining about it, do you, or Bates, have any contstructive ideas as to how to stop or discourage human trafficking and/or prostitution? Is part of the problem is that it's not regarded as serious as some other crimes ,and so doesn't get as much investigative attention? If that is true, then maybe part of the problem explaining why that is so is because there isn't as much money and physical assets to confiscate to go to police departments, like there often is for drug operations. Or is there?

Brian I'm sure has his own thoughts. My guess is that it's a combination of multiple factors. Education (many folks may not be aware of the trafficking side), is a big factor. Many of the victims are immigrants, so there's not much public outcry there. In Sweden, Norway, and Iceland (and a handful of other countries) it is illegal to pay for sex, but not to be a prostitute (the client commits a crime, but not the prostitute). This type of law is the "Swedish Model" and is being used by countries wanting to reduce human trafficking, and avoids punishing the victims (which would make it less likely for them to seek help).

[Edmond_Outsider]

This is really not about sugar daddy ads anymore.

I don't think it ever was for some. How 18+ became underage prostitutes and sex trafficing victims seems hard to understand unless some can't see a difference which is possible.

[jerrywall]

I don't think it ever was for some. How 18+ became underage prostitutes and sex trafficing victims seems hard to understand unless some can't see a difference which is possible.

The info about trafficking and underage prostitutes was in response to Bunty's comment about prostitution being victimless.

[jerrywall]

What ads? ArrangementFinders? Not hardly. They've only appeared in a handful of cities and we've been the only city so far to be able to get rid of them so quickly. Chicago and Philly both had very public outcries against them. Even the mayor's office got involved in trying to get them down.

No city where they've appeared has the city turned a blind eye.

The only thing 'backwoods' is being okay with pimping out your daughter.

Hell, even Atlantic City wasn't OK with these billboards. When you're too trashy for the Jersey Shore, then you know you've maybe crossed a line of good taste?

[Jim Kyle]

In Sweden, Norway, and Iceland (and a handful of other countries) it is illegal to pay for sex, but not to be a prostitute (the client commits a crime, but not the prostitute). This type of law is the "Swedish Model" and is being used by countries wanting to reduce human trafficking, and avoids punishing the victims (which would make it less likely for them to seek help).

I think that's an excellent model for our city/state/nation to follow. As an outside observer, it seems to me that Brian is attempting to do just this by publicizing the customers on his web site. It would be much better if the vice squads did it through the creiminal justice system -- and included the pimps themselves among the offenders.

[kelroy55]

Let's just make every billboard in OKC a bible quote and call it good.


It is frightening how much everyone in this thread here is okay with censorship.

I wonder if people were offended by anti-abortion billboards they would be taken down as well?

[jerrywall]

I wonder if people were offended by anti-abortion billboards they would be taken down as well?

Probably. Remember, the government didn't step in an force this billboard down. The potential customer base of the sign company and the advertiser reacted poorly to the message and content, so it was changed. If they reacted the same way to the anti-abortion billboard, I expect you'd see the same actions.

I remember a friend in advertising talking to me years ago about Carl's Jr ads, and that special ones were produced for the Oklahoma market because they had found poor response from the national produced ads. This isn't censorship, it's tailoring your message for your market.

[kelroy55]

Probably. Remember, the government didn't step in an force this billboard down. The potential customer base of the sign company and the advertiser reacted poorly to the message and content, so it was changed. If they reacted the same way to the anti-abortion billboard, I expect you'd see the same actions.

I remember a friend in advertising talking to me years ago about Carl's Jr ads, and that special ones were produced for the Oklahoma market because they had found poor response from the national produced ads. This isn't censorship, it's tailoring your message for your market.

I'm sure the advertiser would have been happy to keep it up and didn't think it was offensive before they took the money. But you're right each community decides what they like and don't like. I do wonder if the company could claim freedom of speech violation.

[jerrywall]

I do wonder if the company could claim freedom of speech violation.

No, because the government didn't pull down the sign and freedom of speech only applies to governmental limitations of power.

[kelroy55]

No, because the government didn't pull down the sign and freedom of speech only applies to governmental limitations of power.

Good point.... maybe breach of contract if they had one, and I'm pretty sure they did.

[jerrywall]

Good point.... maybe breach of contract if they had one, and I'm pretty sure they did.

Possibly. I've never bought a billboard so don't know what terms would be in a contract. I know with TV commercials I've done that not only did they have right of refusal, but they could pull or not air them (and adjust my billable amount respectively). The only ads TV station legally can't pull are federal election Campaign ads. I'd expect there's some clause that allows the company to pull or alter an billboard as they see fit.

[OKCTalker]

On issues like this I ask myself, "Would I want my father paying a college girl to do that," and "Would I want my college-age daughter being paid to do that?"

That tends to clarify the issue pretty quickly.

[BBatesokc]

I think that's an excellent model for our city/state/nation to follow. As an outside observer, it seems to me that Brian is attempting to do just this by publicizing the customers on his web site. It would be much better if the vice squads did it through the creiminal justice system -- and included the pimps themselves among the offenders.

The Sweden model is pretty close to what I think is the best solution for the US. Most studies seem to back that up also. I've always publicly supported the idea of decriminalizing the sex worker and focusing more harshly on the Johns and pimps/traffickers.

[BBatesokc]

We just photographed the new billboards. A young lady who has appeared on several TV shows (ex: NCIS) in minor roles volunteered to model for the board. Turned out excellent. Boards should be up in a week or so.

[Bunty]

The Sweden model is pretty close to what I think is the best solution for the US. Most studies seem to back that up also. I've always publicly supported the idea of decriminalizing the sex worker and focusing more harshly on the Johns and pimps/traffickers.

Yeah, why not simply try charming the woman and get romance for free? Maybe not all of them think looks are everything. But what about that preacher from Tulsa that got arrested at the 39th St. gay area over soliciting for sex? Can you still get arrested for trying to get sex for free, if your approach is too direct about it, or whatever?

[Bunty]

I'd like to see a billboard up promoting legalization of marijuana in Oklahoma. It would be interesting to see how controversial it would be, or go largely ignored, knowing how intense the apathy toward the marijuana issue is in Oklahoma.

[jerrywall]

I'd like to see a billboard up promoting legalization of marijuana in Oklahoma. It would be interesting to see how controversial it would be, or go largely ignored, knowing how intense the apathy toward the marijuana issue is in Oklahoma.

There's sort of one, on Kelly Ave between 33rd and Memorial in Edmond. It's actually for a marijuana possession defense attorney. But says something along the lines of "Until it's legal..."

I think location has lots to do with the reactions as well. There's a line of good taste that shouldn't be crossed (like putting cigarette ads in Boys Life magazine), when it comes to targeted audience or location.

[BBatesokc]

Yeah, why not simply try charming the woman and get romance for free? Maybe not all of them think looks are everything. But what about that preacher from Tulsa that got arrested at the 39th St. gay area over soliciting for sex? Can you still get arrested for trying to get sex for free, if your approach is too direct about it, or whatever?

I actually attended preacher Lonnie Latham's hearings. While I initially broke the news of his arrest and uncovered proof he frequented the area, I became a supporter of his innocence when the details of the arrest were revealed. Latham didn't do anything hundreds of horny guys aren't doing ever weekend in Bricktown - hitting up on individuals for a one night stand.

The case was prosecuted by Wes Lane - so no shocker he was morally outraged and misused his position to re-interpret the law. I don't think Lane really thought he'd win the case, I think he just wanted to out Latham and ruin him. Latham owed his congregation and supporters an explanation and apology, but nobody else and certainly should not have faced arrest and prosecution. The case was eventually dropped. Wish he would have sued.

You can be arrested for soliciting a sexual act that involves no payment under certain conditions......
1.) To engage in the sex act publicly.
2.) Making the solicitation to someone who files a police complaint (ex: you walk up to some person at the mall and say "hey, wanna go do it?")