Quit beggin ostate sports fans

[Matt]

. . .Berry Switzer. . .

This could get ugly, folks.

[cdbthunder]

The same attitude takes place on Sports Animal daily from OU fans except it is not only limted to OSU.

Well I can't speak for those people on talk radio but just from my own personal experiences.

[mugofbeer]

OU's gotten quite a few. The Gaylord's gave similar amounts to OU ($100+ pretty sure) but weren't public about it the way T-bone seems to be. Several large corporate donors have given millions. $600 million is a lot more than I knew of so I am even more impressed. Thats great for OSU.

[soonerfan_in_okc]

You don't strike me as someone who is familiar with OU academics. Let me help you out. You're right, there are areas where OU is superior, and areas where OSU is superior. OU is clearly superior in meteorology, and petroleum engineering, esp considering OSU doesn't even offer a petro school (the Boone Pickens equivalent is OSU's geology program).

There are a number of areas where OU is absolutely abysmal, and architecture is the one I have the most familiarity with. OU's architecture school would be a joke if it wasn't such a dire situation. OSU's architecture school is Top 20 in the nation, can't imagine a bigger difference. OU's will probably lose its accreditation eventually, and their still-craptacular recently renovated Gould Hall will be empty. OSU's arch school has an absolutely amazing facility which is going to help them expand into more graduate programs, such as city planning. OU's city planning school is kind of a joke because the reality is that undergraduate city planning degrees are irrelevant, as you should go to grad school for a good job anyway and many city planning master's students come from poli sci or other humanities backgrounds.

OU journalism is getting a lot better. It doesn't offer some of the programs OSU does, and OSU is the only j-school in the state that's always been accredited. OU's facility is absolutely amazing, thanks to The Oklahoman's money, and that's going to help OU a lot. OSU's newspaper wins awards, the OU Daily..yeah right lol.

Neither school are very strong for the arts and sciences, but OU has the edge because of the law school and the medical school. OSU has recently renovated a handful of beautiful historic buildings that host their humanities programs. A lot of OU Law and OU Medical students went to OSU, but they're in the OU system for their graduate education because of the way the state legislature has set OSU up with a speciality medical school, as opposed to a comprehensive one. OU Law is generally considered inferior in Oklahoma, especially to OCU Law which is a top law school. OU Law sort of backs up the saying that "there's a law school for everyone these days."

I think agriculture is very relevant in today's technical world, and of course OSU is a top 10 ag school--I think they've capitalized on this to build a foundation for other good science curricula, as well as engineering. Lots of engineering research is done at OSU, believe it or not. I think the two are on even footing for engineering, and both have strong programs, but OU's engineering classes for the most part take place in facilities that aren't very nice, one difference from OSU. This is starting to change though with Devon Hall and the new Engineering Practice Facility in Norman.

As for business, OU is much superior although OSU has some very dynamic business graduate programs. I think overall OSU is a much better grad school (ironic when you compare their "missions") because of the narrowness and small number of programs OU offers. It's also worth noting that a friend of mine in OSU arch showed me some impressive new designs recently for OSU's new business school that they're building. I like OU's better because they did a beautiful restoration of a historic building, but that's just me. It has more of an Ivy League-caliber feel to it.

As far as college towns go, obviously Norman is a better college town. It's much classier. I don't think Norman is on quite the "upward trajectory" that Stillwater is (being the state's fastest-growing small town and all), but I think Stillwater is too sprawled out and suburban. Downtown Norman and Campus Corner have immaculate streetscapes, and Boyd Street is just a very classy, elegant "scene" altogether. Of course it's more influenced by the Greek scene at OU, whereas OSU is more GDI--and the result in my opinion is that Norman is just head and shoulders classier. Fiji represent. It's also indicative of the arts scene that's alive and well in Norman, as opposed to the arts scene that's undergrand and badly fostered in Stillwater. OU's dance school, music school, drama school, art program, etc etc.. people would be very shocked to see how top-notch these programs are. OU also has the top university arts museum. OSU's offerings here are just not as good, but I suspect a new arts campus with a new PAC and a new art museum are on the way--I've been to Mesa Vista, TX before and seen T. Boone's art collection, which is reportedly the largest private collection of American art in the world (larger than the largest public collection at the Gilcrease in Tulsa).

I think from a campus residential life perspective though, Norman is beyond inferior to Stillwater. OU's dorms suck. The worst dorms at OSU are still a lot nicer than the typical OU dorm. I had to live in Walker and I HATED it, and sleeping in was impossible because they were doing renovations on the residential commie blocks that always started promptly at 8 am.. OSU dorms come in different varieties, unlike OU dorms. You can chose from several historic, renovated, upscale halls, you can chose cheepo commie blocks, or you can chose brand-new urban townhome-style units, or brand-new suburban apartment-style units. Off-campus most of the old rental houses are well-cared for and not falling apart like in Nompton. Norman does offer more stylish "urban living" options for high-end students, such as downtown lofts and the new condos going up on Boyd Street, but Stillwater already has something very very similar to the 401 Lofts project.

And athletically, we all have our own spin on the Sooners v. the Cowboys. But I will say this: My post isn't intended as, "I was a Sooner, I have experience here, I hated it, here's why you should all be against OU." This post is intended as, "I was a Sooner, I always will be a Sooner, and guys, we have some work to do." Take it as Berry Switzer's statements he made after touring Stillwater's amazing new athletic facilities, where he said it should strike fear deep in the heart of every Sooner. Do you think he's turning against us and rooting for the Pokes? Of course not! But he has seen first-hand that OSU is really getting their act together. OSU's gargantuan alumni giving (esp compared to OU alumni giving) has given OSU something it hasn't had in a long time thanks to the biased legislature, and that's money. They've got a strong vision, a strong leader in Burns Hargis, and all I have to say is watch out..

OU also has a strong leader in David Boren, but he will probably only be around another 5 years. Do we really want to give our school to Brad Henry?? NO!! If we let Brad Henry become the new president, the Norman campus had might as well just become OSU-Nompton or UNT-OK.

I go to OU, therefore I am plenty familiar with there academics. You talk about things like campus life and the town that the college's are located in, and that is fine and dandy, but i don't really care. I made the point that OU was better academically and had no catching up to do to OSU, and all you did was show that I was right.

However I am gonna rip you apart on a few points. First of all, you can't tell me you honestly think OU's law school is inferior to OCU and or tulsa. I have grown up in Oklahoma city and you say that ou is "considered" inferior, and while i could just list numbers, I feel it is easier to point out that my brother, who is graduating from baylor on the spring with a degree in Political science, has applied and been accepted to all 3 law schools in the state has chosen to go to OU, along with a few of his friends who went in state and are in the same boat. OU's average lsat scores are higher than OCU and has a higher % of students pass the bar exam. Read about them, it will help.
The University of Oklahoma College of Law
Oklahoma City University School of Law

You can try and blame the fact that OU's medical school completely dominates OSU's on how the state allots money, but the same could be said about the lack of an agriculture department at OU and how OSU is extremely successful compared to OU in that department. So that whole point is null.

I do want to say that that as a freshman last year, i lived in the dorms and all of them have been renovated the past 3 years. So maybe you should go visit them and re-assess your views. Now though, I live at the Edge condos. about 440 a month with everything included, which isn't bad. There are plenty of places like them, crimson park, the reserve, the cottages, blah blah blah.

I could go on and on but I do not really have time. I leave for colorado in 1 hour so I have better things to do. I never said OSU was a horrible school, i just simply disagreed with the fact that you think OU has to catch up to them , which they do not. I am not the only person who thinks this, and quite frankly I am in the large majority. And the fact that you just assumed I had no idea what I was talking about pissed me off. OU has an endowment that dwarfs that of OSU, and is ranked ahead of them in every overall collegiate ranking.

[Bunty]

I think OSU has had more aggressive political representation at the State Capitol, such as in regards to having better student housing. I can remember several years ago a Sunday Oklahoman article revealing that OSU got help with its new resident hall financing thru Stillwater State Sen. Morgan's law firm. Possibly inappropriate with OSU supposedly not getting a good deal. But nothing much other than a story came out of it.

Now OSU has its former president as it's state senator. Hopefully, more interesting things can come out of that other than Sen. Hallagan's bill that will ban smoking on the campus of OSU.

[Bunty]

Hey, T Bone Pickens is supposedly giving OSU another $100 million for academics. No matter how you slice it, thats a pretty good chunk of change and could make a significant difference in the quality of academics at OSU. Money draws better profs and better profs draw higher achieving students.

As an OU grad I applaud this action and hope OSU can improve its academics just like I hope OU continues to do the same. Oklahoma deserves two great research universities and these types of monetary gifts can do a huge amount.

Actually OSU is half way in its goal to raise $1 BILLION.

OSU halfway to its fundraising goal Local News Stillwater NewsPress

[lasomeday]

Great posts Spartan. I couldn't agree with you more!

GO POKES!

[rcjunkie]

I'm a die hard fan, both daughters are OU Grads, and I'm a season football ticket holder for 25 years. The difference I see in large donors to either school is what they get/expect from the school. The Gaylord's have donated millions to OU over the years and T-Boone has donated millions to OSU, however, you never see anyone from the Gaylord family roaming the sidelines at football games, chatting with players and coaches, having tremendous input on hiring, etc;.

[Of Sound Mind]

OU Law is generally considered inferior in Oklahoma, especially to OCU Law which is a top law school. OU Law sort of backs up the saying that "there's a law school for everyone these days."

I was following you right up to this line and then your credibility went out the window. You're woefully misinformed on this specific "fact", which begs the question what other bits of information are misinformed as well.

[PennyQuilts]

OU Law is generally considered inferior in Oklahoma, especially to OCU Law which is a top law school. OU Law sort of backs up the saying that "there's a law school for everyone these days."

Oh, ouch, I hate to say it as an OCU law grad, but this isn't really accurate. Although law school rankings are quite subjective, OU is generally ranked in the middle of what used to be called "second tier" law schools and OCU is in the fourth tier. OCU's average LSAT score in 2009 was 150 compared to OU at 157. OU has an extremely respectable bar passage rate in the 90s - but all the state law schools are competitive. OU's passage rate has been more consistent than OCUs but OCU is working on theirs.

All that being said, they draw different types of students - OCU is more likely to have out of state students - which means than more are likely to head out of state upon graduation. OU kids are pretty much home grown. And notwithstanding the higher LSAT scores at OU, that only tells part of the tale. I would put up the educational experience and benefit at OCU against OU or just about anywhere else, including many top tier lawschools (all three of my kids went to top tier law schools so I have something to compare it to). Their staff/faculty at OCU are wonderful.

But all the respect I have for OCU doesn't cause me to buy in to the notion that they are considered a top law school or that the other state schools are considered inferior in comparison.

[Spartan]

OCU LAW - Law Review

This is one of the things that has always meant prestige for OCU Law--the Oklahoma City Law Review, which is a respected law journal read by professors across the country. It takes submissions from Oklahomans as well as Ivy League professors. My dad's best friend is a constitutional law professor at UVA, and when he stayed at our place virtually all he knew beforehand about Oklahoma was OCU Law.

Outside of Oklahoma, the only law school with much "national buzz" is OCU Law--likely based off of "past success" which may have gone a little bit downhill, but it is what it is. I think the same thing is true with OCU's MBA program, which used to be highly prestigious, probably not so prestigious today. But it is what it is.

I will mention one thing that OU does well academically from my experience (well not really my experience, but my friends') is capping freshman English classes. I never took freshman English though because I came in with 21 hours already. I did have to take a lot of math classes, and almost all of them had 300-400 people. Probably half the school at any given time, and I was appalled because I thought OU put focus on its engineering students (who have to take a lot of math courses). I will say also really really appreciated the involvement of David Boren on campus. I was in the President's Leadership Class as well as his government class, and he's a great guy.

As for first hand experience academically with OSU, I have none. All I can give is my experience at OU and I can tell you that OU has a lot of work to do, it aint nearly as good as all these damn redneck OU fans across the state think it is. It is literally depressing that families pride themselves on having a kid "get into" OU. Wow. Newsflash: The OU application basically asks for your name, address, email, and if you have a pulse. I have never seen so many morons before in my life as I came across at OU. Furthermore, after two years it was enough to convince me that I just needed to find a different place, as much as it pained me to leave behind my Fraternity brothers, my friends, and good ol OKC.

Soonerfan in okc, I can't say your post is very surprising to me. Imagine that, an OU person who was absolutely convinced that their school is the best in the world. And then you mention academic rankings.. first of all, the majority of ranked schools lied and fudged the numbers they submitted on those rankings, second of all OU lied as well, and third of all, OSU didn't even fully submit all the required information because they recognized what bull**** those rankings were. Will OU/OSU really pick up students from out of state based on rankings? Of course not. I think what's sad is that OU plays the rankings game like everyone else and still can't even crack the Top 100. LOL

We're just all bowing down to the academic prestige of being ranked #109 in the country.

[onthestrip]

I go to OU, therefore I am plenty familiar with there academics.

It would appear to me that you arent that familiar with "there" academics. Just kidding though, Im sure it was just a mistake.

These threads always amuse me. Mostly because its almost impossible to get an objective opinion from anyone. Of course a sophomore from one school is going to say his school is better. Of course a grad from another is going to say his is better. The fact is, OSU is better at certain areas and OU is better at certain areas. Its hard to compare overall when they offer and/or specialize in different fields of study. Academically speaking, I'd have to call it a wash.

I think someone could argue that one or the other has better sidewalks and it would set off a firestorm of a thread.

[Spartan]

It would appear to me that you arent that familiar with "there" academics. Just kidding though, Im sure it was just a mistake.

These threads always amuse me. Mostly because its almost impossible to get an objective opinion from anyone.

I think my posts were pretty objective.

[soonerfan_in_okc]

Soonerfan in okc, I can't say your post is very surprising to me. Imagine that, an OU person who was absolutely convinced that their school is the best in the world. And then you mention academic rankings.. first of all, the majority of ranked schools lied and fudged the numbers they submitted on those rankings, second of all OU lied as well, and third of all, OSU didn't even fully submit all the required information because they recognized what bull**** those rankings were. Will OU/OSU really pick up students from out of state based on rankings? Of course not. I think what's sad is that OU plays the rankings game like everyone else and still can't even crack the Top 100. LOL

We're just all bowing down to the academic prestige of being ranked #109 in the country.

Just stop. You continue to make assumptions about me that are completely false. I never said OU was the best in the world, and I can admit that schools like Texas and Michigan, other public schools, blow us out of the water. I guess it is hard for you to comprehend the fact that there are OU fans/students out there who know their school is not the best in the country. I understand that the rankings are very controversial, and just recently baylor got in trouble for trying to inflate their position by having freshman retake the act/sat to get higher scores. However, they do provide a good general look at a school, and you cannot deny that.

I am not going to be like you and rip a program, but if you really think that a law review makes one law school better than another, then LMAO @ your logic. Just go away spartan and quit digging yourself a hole.

[onthestrip]

I think my posts were pretty objective.

Spartan, I agree. Your post was probably the most objective OU/OSU post I have ever read. However, your post is about one in a thousand.

[earlywinegareth]

2010 US News ranking of publics for Big Twelve schools:

#15 - UT
#22 - aTm
#34 - CU
#39 - ISU
#43 - KU and NU
#48 - MU and OU

Absent from list: oSu, KSU, and Tx Tech

Best Colleges - Education - US News and World Report

[earlywinegareth]

2009 Endowment Rankings for Big Twelve schools:

UT "System" - $12.163B
aTm "System" - $5.084B
NU - $0.965B
KU - $0.955B
MU "System" - $0.882B
Baylor - $0.880B
OU - $0.848B
Tx Tech - $0.680B
CU - $0.593B
oSu - $0.455B
ISU - $0.452B
KSU - $0.260B

One other noteworthy is U. of Tulsa with $0.647B

http://www.nacubo.org/Documents/rese...ket_Values.pdf

[Roadhawg]

I'm a Husker and we didn't like either one of you *lol* All schools have good and bad things about them and personally I see the most important issue is bringing down the cost of a higher education so more people can go without being thousands of dollars in debt by the time they graduate, or the parents having to go deep in debt to send their kids to college. As always JMHO

[Spartan]

2009 Endowment Rankings for Big Twelve schools:

UT "System" - $12.163B
aTm "System" - $5.084B
NU - $0.965B
KU - $0.955B
MU "System" - $0.882B
Baylor - $0.880B
OU - $0.848B
Tx Tech - $0.680B
CU - $0.593B
oSu - $0.455B
ISU - $0.452B
KSU - $0.260B

One other noteworthy is U. of Tulsa with $0.647B

http://www.nacubo.org/Documents/rese...ket_Values.pdf

What does this even mean? Because OU's endowment is over $1 billion, and OSU's "endowment" obviously must not be including anything from Boone, which is more than "$455 million" that they cite.

[Andrew4OU]

OCU LAW - Law Review

This is one of the things that has always meant prestige for OCU Law--the Oklahoma City Law Review, which is a respected law journal read by professors across the country. It takes submissions from Oklahomans as well as Ivy League professors. My dad's best friend is a constitutional law professor at UVA, and when he stayed at our place virtually all he knew beforehand about Oklahoma was OCU Law.

Outside of Oklahoma, the only law school with much "national buzz" is OCU Law--likely based off of "past success" which may have gone a little bit downhill, but it is what it is. I think the same thing is true with OCU's MBA program, which used to be highly prestigious, probably not so prestigious today. But it is what it is.

Having a law review or law journal isn't earth-shattering. Every law school has a law journal/review. And trust me, the OCU law review isn't as "prestigious" as you make it out to be.

If OCU is so well-respected, why is their Oklahoma Bar Exam pass rate consistently the lowest in the state? No offense to those who are OCU Law Graduates, but even OCU and Tulsa grads know that OU Law is top in the state.

And Spartan, I'm not quite sure where you got the line about OU touting, "there's a law school for everyone." Care to explain? I've never heard that before. OU's law admission rates are more selective than both OCU and Tulsa.

[Andrew4OU]

OU journalism is getting a lot better. It doesn't offer some of the programs OSU does, and OSU is the only j-school in the state that's always been accredited. OU's facility is absolutely amazing, thanks to The Oklahoman's money, and that's going to help OU a lot. OSU's newspaper wins awards, the OU Daily..yeah right lol.

As a graduate of OU's Gaylord College and former contributor to the Daily, I have to take issue with what you said above. You might want to take your opinion out of your "facts."

-Gaylord College is a FOUNDING member of the ACEJMC - Accrediting Council for Education in Journalism and Mass Communication.

-2009 Oklahoma's Society of Professional Journalists' awards - The Daily was named the state’s best newspaper in Division B (circulation of 7,000-24,999), besting both OSU’s student paper and The Norman Transcript.

[semisimple]

And Spartan, I'm not quite sure where you got the line about OU touting, "there's a law school for everyone." Care to explain? I've never heard that before. OU's law admission rates are more selective than both OCU and Tulsa.

You're right...lower bar pass rates for Tulsa and OCU along with higher acceptance rates. If there's a "law school for everyone" in Oklahoma, it's OCU with its 2.87-3.4 GPA range and 57% acceptance rate. (Click here for data.)

OU's law school is much higher rated than OCU's and Tulsa's. OU is a Tier 1 law school ranked #71 in the country by U.S. News & World Report whereas Tulsa and OCU are both Tier 4 (i.e., lowest tier) law schools.

None of them may be "good" law schools, but OU Law is certainly the best in the state.

[Bigrayok]

Since when is OCU's law school considered to be better than O.U.'s law school? I can remember when it was much easier to get into OCU's law school than O.U. Does OCU have a higher pass rate on the Oklahoma Bar Exam? What makes one law school better than another? One good thing about OCU is that it is closer to law clerk jobs in Oklahoma City than O.U. is. But I have not heard many say OCU has a better Law school than O.U. except some OCU graduates.

Bigray in Ok

[soonerfan_in_okc]

Guys, spartan was caught in a lie and is not gonna respond to us. oh well lol