Will Rogers losing flights

[venture]

No. MLT is just chartering the plane from Allegiant. It has nothing to do with their scheduled service and OKC flights aren't even sold by Allegiant. Allegiant does more than just Vegas and Orlando.

This is nothing different than other tour companies chartering aircraft from Northwest, Frontier, and other airlines.

[Luke]

Just got this email from Worry Free Vacations:

Worry-Free Vacations' departure from Oklahoma City

As of October 20, 2008, Worry-Free Vacations will no longer offer service from Oklahoma City to Las Vegas. However, we would like to invite you to update your e-mail profile and select Dallas/Ft. Worth as your Origin City Airport, so that you can continue to receive e-mails and specials from Worry-Free Vacations. Also, we would like to take this opportunity to invite you to travel with Worry-Free Vacations' sister company - NWA WorldVacations.

Yet another to leave OKC...

[Kerry]

The flights being cancelled to Las Vegas are an indicator of how bad Vegas has become as a destination and not necessarily a reflection of Oklahoma City. A lady I work with goes to Vegas 2X a year and she just went two weeks ago. She said it was dead. Very empty during the week and Friday and Saturday had the crowd of a usual Wednesday. 2 major casino projects have gone into foreclosure and more are probably on the way.

[SeinfeldBlock]

Just flew Continental to Newark. My direct was cancelled, all flights to Cleveland were booked, and I had to fly through Houston. On the way back, flights from Cleveland to OKC were overbooked. Again.

Just sayin'...... sucks they have to cut that route. I'm pretty annoyed that Continental is losing it, considering it's full or overbooked almost all the time!

WRWA really needs to rally, I don't really like flying Southwest and don't want it to be a "Southwest" hot spot.

[venture]

Cleveland is not performing as well as you may think.

First quarter of 2008...

209 .. OKC-CLE ….. $7,530.07 ….. $5,797.39 ….. $0.12364 ….. $0.21327 ….. $0.15019 ….. 50.70%

50.70% is the load factor...so the 50 seat jet is only taking 25 people per trip on average. The route is also only making 15 cents per available seat mile. That is HORRIBLE for a regional jet right now.

Air service from OKC will be at the mercy of the rest of the industry...which means what you see now, is what you'll get for awhile - unless oil changes more either direction.

As far as Worry Free. Allegiant is pulling that aircraft back into its scheduled fleet. Worry Free had the option to use Northwest or another airline...but decided to pull the plug. They will also end the Mexican service as well. Hopefully, with the east wing construction getting close to becoming a reality...that a couple international gates will be added so we can get Aeromexico or another Mexican airlines - or even a US carrier going the other way.

[SeinfeldBlock]

Cleveland is not performing as well as you may think.

First quarter of 2008...

209 .. OKC-CLE ….. $7,530.07 ….. $5,797.39 ….. $0.12364 ….. $0.21327 ….. $0.15019 ….. 50.70%

50.70% is the load factor...so the 50 seat jet is only taking 25 people per trip on average. The route is also only making 15 cents per available seat mile. That is HORRIBLE for a regional jet right now.

Air service from OKC will be at the mercy of the rest of the industry...which means what you see now, is what you'll get for awhile - unless oil changes more either direction.

As far as Worry Free. Allegiant is pulling that aircraft back into its scheduled fleet. Worry Free had the option to use Northwest or another airline...but decided to pull the plug. They will also end the Mexican service as well. Hopefully, with the east wing construction getting close to becoming a reality...that a couple international gates will be added so we can get Aeromexico or another Mexican airlines - or even a US carrier going the other way.

Bummer. I can never get a seat on that flight. I thought it was doing great! Every time I fly through there it seems to be pretty full, but maybe I just have great timing.... ha ha. I'm pretty sure it's the latter...

I like getting all of this ariline information.

Also noticed the huge ExpressJet poster in WRWA. Maybe they should pull that now...

[venture]

Yeah...and the key saying - Full flights don't equal profitable flights. There are plenty of flights out there that are flying with 90% load factors, but bleeding cash (Hawaii/Florida/Vegas). People just can't or don't want to pay more so airlines can cover their costs.

[chrisok]

^^^
It'll be interesting to see 2nd and 3rd qtr numbers on CLE. I've been on about 15 segments OKC/CLE or CLE/OKC, in the past couple of months and nearly 50 this year. While I realize in the grand scheme of things it's a small portion of all the flights to and from CLE, I have noticed a HUGE upswing in passenger counts. I'm sure a large portion of that is normal vacation/leisure travel. However, it's hard not to notice the consistant oversold situations over the past month or two.

I was the on the first flight from OKC to CLE last year, and there were five passengers on board. (We had all you can eat muffins that morning..haha) Back then and early this year, there were many flights with less than 20 passengers.

[OUman]

In today's Oklahoman:

Source: Will Rogers loses 5 direct connections | NewsOK.com

All US Airways service will be eliminated, average daily departure count will apparently go down to 75. On the other hand, I do agree with the article in that OKC (as in the airport-I don't sub in airport codes for city names ) is still doing well as the passenger counts go, they're still rising, so airlines cannot cut back dramatically here.

[venture]

Nice to see The Oklahoma finally catch up to use here...only took them a few weeks.

Someone needs to correct the Airport Director though...Cincinnati is not getting an additional flight, only Atlanta. Cincinnati will be gone with in 9 months more than likely anyway.

[Richard at Remax]

does this mean that continental nonstop flight to newark will be gone?

[OKCTalker]

Steve Lackmeyer wrote in today's DO (Will Rogers loses 5 direct connections | NewsOK.com) that OKC is losing five direct flights, but he didn't name them. Does anyone know which airlines & cities are involved (e.g., AA OKC-DFW; SW OKC-LAS; UA OKC-DEN)?

[venture]

Umm...we've gone over this a LONG time ago in the other thread.

All the cuts and everything are in this thread:

http://www.okctalk.com/okc-metro-are...line-cuts.html

Like I said...the Oklahoma took its time publishing this, but we have been discussing it for weeks.

[CCOKC]

Yeah, I just had a sense of dread when I saw the headline in the paper today until I read the article and noticed this was the same old news that you had posted weeks ago. Another reason to read OKC Talk to be up to date.

[LordGerald]

Once again, the DO is behind the times, or in this case, OKCBusiness...

Airlines seek to reduce costs with passenger fees
By Randall Turk - 7/21/2008


Pay more, pack less and plan for longer delays if you expect to get airborne this summer.


Airlines have experienced huge losses resulting from a 90-percent increase in fuel prices over the past year. A series of unsuccessful attempts to impose fuel surcharges and fare increases to compensate for runaway costs last year has led air carriers to impose a roundabout means of recouping their losses.


A growing number of fees not included in ticket prices are just another annoyance for air travelers before they are shepherded, shoeless, through airport scanners.


The airlines also are cutting back on domestic routes, grounding less efficient aircraft and packing planes to capacity.


OKC ridership up

Of carriers serving Will Rogers World Airport, Continental already has announced cutbacks in nonstop service to some cities, and ExpressJet has pulled out of the state. United will cut one of its two nonstop flights to Los Angeles after Labor Day. But so far, the service cuts have not restrained passenger load at Will Rogers World Airport, officials say.


The number of commercial airline take-offs and landings began to stumble in June. There were 5,478 take-offs and landings in June, down 7.22 percent from the same month last year. But the number of arriving and departing passengers grew to 365,889 in June, up 0.94 percent from the previous June.


Mark Kranenburg, OKC director of airports, said he believes air travel through Will Rogers will be up this summer.


Although the Continental and ExpressJet decisions left some voids in nonstop service from OKC, Kranenburg said, “passengers will use other airlines to travel through connecting hub airports” to reach destinations lost to nonstop service.


The more than 1.8 million passengers arriving and departing OKC aboard commercial airliners represented a 5.7-percent increase through June, compared to the same period last year.


Cashing in on bargain fares to popular destinations is growing rarer. And so is finding cheap seats on most other flights, given the profusion of fees. Convenience, baggage size and weight and onboard appetite and amenities all have costs attached.


And the Federal Aviation Administration is enforcing tough size restrictions on carry-on items. Anything larger than carry-on size must travel as checked baggage. Some airlines are charging $2 or $3 for curbside check-in.


Hidden costs mount

Still more fees are imposed upon consumers should a child fly unaccompanied by an adult or should the family pet tag along, for example. Dining in the sky also has its price, as does reserving an aisle or window seat or seats with extra space and more legroom.


Those unfortunate enough to find they must change travel plans while in transit pay a non-refundable ticket change fee. Most carriers get $100 to $150 for a destination change.


Southwest Airlines is the one exception to the proliferation of fees. Since 1999, Southwest has shaved $3.5 billion from fuel costs by hedging futures contracts on jet fuel. The company’s fuel costs averaged $1.98 a gallon during the first quarter, about 30 percent less than its competitors. Southwest Airlines expects 4-percent growth in capacity this year, possibly through filling routes abandoned by other carriers.


Among Southwest’s fees is a controversial one for “double occupancy,” a policy that could spread to other airlines. Passengers too large to squeeze into a Southwest seat are charged for two.


Travelers waiting in terminals could encounter another expensive inconvenience – delayed flights. A report issued in May by the Senate Joint Economic Committee stated that flight delays consumed nearly 20 percent of total domestic flight time in 2007. The report, compiled from U.S. Department of Transportation flight records, showed the flight delays cost passengers, airlines and the U.S. economy more than $40 billion.

The report said most delays were caused by backed-up flights and snafus in the national system. Less than 6 percent of the delays were attributed to severe weather.

[solitude]

Venture and Lord Gerald are right. The Oklahoman is wayyy behind on this one.

[SeinfeldBlock]

Among Southwest’s fees is a controversial one for “double occupancy,” a policy that could spread to other airlines. Passengers too large to squeeze into a Southwest seat are charged for two.

I totally don't get Southwest's policy here. I flew Southwest several times, dropped a size, then they told me I fell under their "double occupancy" standard. Guess it depends on the flight attendant. Flew them again two weeks later and there was no problem. If another airline implements this problem, they better figure out how to make it work equally across the board.

Maybe that's why I don't fly them now.

[jbrown84]

does this mean that continental nonstop flight to newark will be gone?

I'm wondering this too.

[SeinfeldBlock]

Somewhere, in another thread, someone said that the flight to Newark is safe for now. I'd hope so, considering New York is a huge destintation and when I fly that route often, it's pretty full if not booked.

I hope it still is!

[jbrown84]

I hate layovers and I go to NYC once a year or so, so I hope so.

[OKCisOK4me]

Sooooooooooo....WRWA is losing flights, yet they just approved a plan for Phase III of building an east concourse for the airport?? Seems like a waste of money, unless they're planning for a future with more flights...

Don't get me wrong, I think an east gate would be great, but, seeing the current trend...

[jbrown84]

OKC has neglected to get ahead of the growth in many ways. This is once chance for us to break that trend by planning ahead.

[venture]

The Newark flight isn't going anywhere yet, as stated on the other thread. However, loads and yeilds must come up or it will be cut.

The terminal construction, say it will take 3-5 years...then its okay. The airline industry should start swinging up by then. However, it can't be for another 11-12 gates...5-6, with some being for international traffic use and a business club for higher yeilding passengers.

[HOT ROD]

Venture, Im ok with that.

We could shell in other gates/jetways later - once/if demand warrants.

that's what I was saying all along, build the building NOW - while it's cheap, then use it as you see fit. It would not hurt at all for WRWA to have a airline first class lounge and some additional shopping/restaurant options.

And the added space gives us potential so that when we hit the upswing in the aviation indistry again - OKC will be 'ready' just like we were with the Ford Center!

Remember? - I see a significant parallel here, and is why Im so upset we didn't build the airport with the E and W Concourses as was originally designed during the original construction window. Yet I am very happy that it is going to be built nevertheless during this immediate horizon.

Let's not be 'late' on anything else - who knows what opportunities we might have passed up on.

[HOT ROD]

Hiya everyone.

I have some great news!

I just wanted to notify the airliner enthusiasts of you that United Airlines has been flying a 757-200 (182 seats!!!) during their weekday flight schedule into Oklahoma City - Will Rogers International Airport.

A 757 is the largest single-aisle aircraft produced by Boeing and is the most common airplane in United's fleet. United Airlines - B757

757 is noteworthy because it is the beginning of large airplanes with the dual tandem landing gear (4 wheels per wing gear). Hence, typically big cities see them at their airports given their capacity at 182 seats (for United) and longest flying range of any single-aisle airplane. 737's and A319's have just 2 wheels and only have 120 seats or less.

It's great to see United has moved OKC up a little. Having a 757(s) daily (or weekday) service is quite an indicator of big city status.

Also, of interest is the 757 has a thrust vector that produces it's own turbulence for quite some time after the original wake vortex has been produced (you may hear on FAA radio transcripts that air traffic controllers ALWAYS caution aircraft for 757 Wake Turbulence, due to their powerful and efficient engines).

Anyways, I just wanted to let you guys know in case you hadn't realized it. Get out there and see this magnificent aircraft (and even better - fly in it!!!).

The 757 comes into Will Rogers as

United Airlines 1196 Arrives 12:37PM

and departs for Denver as

United Airlines 523 Departs 1:27 PM

that gives you roughly an hour to see this wonderful aircraft at Gate 3 or 5 (United's Gates), which are viewable as you enter the airport dropoff area.

Could somebody take some pics? Im curious if it is sporting the new livery or the older corporate one, plus it will be nice to see a large airplane at WRWA

- maybe someone can take a pic and post it on Wikipedia (we need to show a large United airplane like this one IMO).

Also note, United is also flying A319's (120 seats) and A320's (138 seats) regularly into WRWA as well. Typically, the A320 comes in during the night and departs first thing. It is also a beauty. A319's come in throughout the day, no pattern noticed.

I can't wait until all of the old 737's are gone, it's great to see United has moved some of the A320's from TED to OKC (instead of adding many more regional jets) and is flying a 757 during the weekday lunch rush hour.

Please help this continue!!!!!