New Downtown Arena

[HFAA Alum]

Hopefully/presumably the Paycom land will be valuable enough such that a mostly unused secondary arena is at the bottom of the list of best uses for the site and it can quickly be redeveloped into something great/be part of the overall mixed use development that will ideally be incorporated into the new arena.

If anything, I think the development of Boulevard Place may be relocated to the Paycom site, and as a result, Omni may purchase the empty lot adjacent to it and save that for an expansion project.

I just think its funny how Boulevard Place developers have been sitting on their cards and getting more TIF funds allocated before the big vote to keep the Thunder in town. At this point you might as well assume they were in the know for some months before the initial announcement.

[jn1780]

2) Thanks. Demolishing Paycom Center is just a silly and wasteful thing to do if that eventually happens.

Sure its a "first world problem", but there are just not a whole lot of financially practical applications for it after the new one gets built. We will also have a new state fair arena also. Paycom Center became a sunk cost as soon as the new arena was approved.

[Teo9969]

That’s why I used the tilde…most likely will go over $1B total cost. Still unlikely to be an over-the-top art piece.

"Iconic" was the promise, so as long as we get something that most of the public views as "iconic" then we got what we paid for. The discourse surrounding that design will hinge on that single word.

[David]

If anything, I think the development of Boulevard Place may be relocated to the Paycom site, and as a result, Omni may purchase the empty lot adjacent to it and save that for an expansion project.

I just think its funny how Boulevard Place developers have been sitting on their cards and getting more TIF funds allocated before the big vote to keep the Thunder in town. At this point you might as well assume they were in the know for some months before the initial announcement.

This makes no sense as a possibility, Boulevard Place is an OCURA selected project and there's zero chance the Omni would be allowed the buy the site instead to keep it as an empty lot as a just in case for the future.

[Rover]

"Iconic" was the promise, so as long as we get something that most of the public views as "iconic" then we got what we paid for. The discourse surrounding that design will hinge on that single word.

What you think is iconic is your own opinion and not a design standard. "Iconic" is nebulous and a matter of opinion.

Lots of people think that some things that are IMHO very average are "iconic". The term "iconic" is as definable as "world class". Does "iconic" mean designed like a traditional icon? Or futuristic as in an imaginary icon? Or just popular, which could be anything. Is iconic lots of curves and mirrors, or because of size, or odd shape, or... or... or.

Anybody with an opinion (and not necessarily taste or design sense) will have a take on whether what we get is "iconic". If we resort to the most popular and consensus, and too many people are involved in the design decisions, what we will get is the least common denominator and no one will be satisfied. We need to hire the best and most talented design firms, confirm our budgets to them and let them create the best possible building that reflects the aspirations of Oklahoma City.

[Urbanized]

"Iconic" was the promise, so as long as we get something that most of the public views as "iconic" then we got what we paid for. The discourse surrounding that design will hinge on that single word.

I certainly expect it to be striking, identifiable, and iconic would be a reasonable expectation. Just saying we need to temper expectations.

[Teo9969]

What you think is iconic is your own opinion and not a design standard. "Iconic" is nebulous and a matter of opinion.

Lots of people think that some things that are IMHO very average are "iconic". The term "iconic" is as definable as "world class". Does "iconic" mean designed like a traditional icon? Or futuristic as in an imaginary icon? Or just popular, which could be anything. Is iconic lots of curves and mirrors, or because of size, or odd shape, or... or... or.

Anybody with an opinion (and not necessarily taste or design sense) will have a take on whether what we get is "iconic". If we resort to the most popular and consensus, and too many people are involved in the design decisions, what we will get is the least common denominator and no one will be satisfied. We need to hire the best and most talented design firms, confirm our budgets to them and let them create the best possible building that reflects the aspirations of Oklahoma City.

Agreed...I'm just saying that we voted for "Iconic", and if the general public agrees that it is, we'll be in great shape. If the general public believes that it's a blase arena design, that will foster distrust with public officials.

If I had a seat at the table, I'd be advocating for an exterior design that departs from a lot of what we see in other arena designs. The public will care less about the internal design because that area does not really belong to the public (even if it does), and I would concern myself with this initial budget more in the external aesthetics than the internal ones. Obviously function is the presiding factor in all of the design choices, but having a statement piece/area inside the arena is less important up front than having something that calls our attention as a public art piece on the outside.

[BoulderSooner]

"Iconic" was the promise,

where was this "iconic" promise?

not on the ballot .. and not on the chamber website??

[SouthOKC]

where was this "iconic" promise?

not on the ballot .. and not on the chamber website??

I believe the quote was from Clay Bennett. Why wouldn’t we expect “iconic”? Which iconic can be defined and a consensus established to validate that term. It’s not completely subjective as some might want you to believe.

Why can’t we set our expectations high? It could be close to $1.4B budget and the ownership contributions covering the interest cost to do this as a loan and not pre-funded.

I have a hard time understanding why others feel the need to temper expectations…

[BoulderSooner]

I believe the quote was from Clay Bennett. Why wouldn’t we expect “iconic”? Which iconic can be defined and a consensus established to validate that term. It’s not completely subjective as some might want you to believe.

Why can’t we set our expectations high? It could be close to $1.4B budget and the ownership contributions covering the interest cost to do this as a loan and not pre-funded.

I have a hard time understanding why others feel the need to temper expectations…

do you view this as iconic??

https://www.chasecenter.com/home

i don't but it is one of the nicest arenas in the country ..

[SouthOKC]

do you view this as iconic??

https://www.chasecenter.com/home

i don't but it is one of the nicest arenas in the country ..

To be fair, it’s probably not iconic by San Francisco standards. However, there are elements that they preserved and improved upon from the old Oakland arena I find very impressive.


Now with that said. Take that same building reduce the number of suites (OKC based needs) and put that into the various design elements. Couple that with cheaper land and a much better opportunity to make it interactive with the surrounding area. I would say 100% it has the potential to be an iconic building for Oklahoma City.

I was recently in the Suns arena when the Thunder played in Phoenix. I would say the interior of that arena was extremely impressive after a $200M renovation.

[Dob Hooligan]

I think a 160 story residential tower on top of the arena would be iconic. Make the exterior surface the worlds largest video board that flashes lightning bolts after every Thunder home win.

[SouthOKC]

I think a 160 story residential tower on top of the arena would be iconic. Make the exterior surface the worlds largest video board that flashes lightning bolts after every Thunder home win.

When you consider there is $700M planned for the Dream Hotel/Boardwalk area you quickly exceed $2B. If the city is able to engineer interactive elements to that development and the arena you’ve got “art piece” level money. The renderings obviously show a commitment to video boards. lol

The Bean located in Millennium Park (Chicago) is considered an iconic art installation at a cost of $23M.

[Plutonic Panda]

I’ll never understand the bean. I mean it’s a goddamn bean. Who the hell travels to see a bean. That one really gets to me. It almost makes me as mad as an unlocked footlocker. But you know that.

[SouthOKC]

I’ll never understand the bean. I mean it’s a goddamn bean. Who the hell travels to see a bean. That one really gets to me. It almost makes me as mad as an unlocked footlocker. But you know that.

Plu - you’re not helping my point about subjectivity…

Overall, I’m just saying the opportunity is there and we should keep our ambition’s high.

[citywokchinesefood]

I’ll never understand the bean. I mean it’s a goddamn bean. Who the hell travels to see a bean. That one really gets to me. It almost makes me as mad as an unlocked footlocker. But you know that.

You don't travel to see it, you travel to flick it.

[Teo9969]

where was this "iconic" promise?

not on the ballot .. and not on the chamber website??

Obviously not on the ballot. This is from State of the City:

"The architectural ambitions of this new arena will exceed anything our residents have ever experienced. Remember the pride you felt seeing this convention center or Scissortail Park for the first time? This arena will meet that standard, and finally people will stand outside of our arena and marvel. This building will make a statement that we are truly prepared to be a top 20 city. And we are committed to using this arena to tell our city’s story and the story of its people. This won’t be a cookie cutter arena. This will be uniquely ours. The same thoughtfulness and care that the Thunder models in its community work will be reflected in this building.

The bar will also be raised inside the building. Obviously, the..."

[Urbanized]

Hey, I’m all for it. And I trust the mayor.

[Plutonic Panda]

Plu - you’re not helping my point about subjectivity…

Overall, I’m just saying the opportunity is there and we should keep our ambition’s high.

You don't travel to see it, you travel to flick it.

Idk if you’ve seen Ed Bassmaster on YouTube but I’ll inmate him and when I finally visit the bean I’ll walk around like a macho man and tell people I Chicago “psh, I’m not impressed at all. We got way better stuff than this in OKC my man.”

[Plutonic Panda]

[Rover]

Agreed...I'm just saying that we voted for "Iconic", and if the general public agrees that it is, we'll be in great shape. If the general public believes that it's a blase arena design, that will foster distrust with public officials.

If I had a seat at the table, I'd be advocating for an exterior design that departs from a lot of what we see in other arena designs. The public will care less about the internal design because that area does not really belong to the public (even if it does), and I would concern myself with this initial budget more in the external aesthetics than the internal ones. Obviously function is the presiding factor in all of the design choices, but having a statement piece/area inside the arena is less important up front than having something that calls our attention as a public art piece on the outside.

The iconic Eiffel Tower was considered an eyesore by the public of Paris when it was built and there was clamor for it to be torn down. The public’s opinion of what is iconic can be very flawed.

[Jersey Boss]

You don't travel to see it, you travel to flick it.

That's what she said.

[jn1780]

Iconic is a strong word. It usually takes several years for something to be considered iconic. I'm sure whatever gets built will look great by Oklahoma standards. I wouldn't expect anything by Santiago Calatrava standards nor would we want to pay 2 billion for something elaborate

[Shortsyeararound]

Idk if you’ve seen Ed Bassmaster on YouTube but I’ll inmate him and when I finally visit the bean I’ll walk around like a macho man and tell people I Chicago “psh, I’m not impressed at all. We got way better stuff than this in OKC my man.”

Would you just look at it.

[Plutonic Panda]

Would you just look at it.

They probably would let you off it looked at it