2021 Oklahoma City Aviation Thread

[catch22]

Hello all,

Going to get this started with a baseline schedule for Jan 2021. 1/11/21 is the date I am using.

Alaska Airlines
SEA 1x E75

Allegiant Air
LAS (Not operating on date, 2x weekly service; operates Su Th)
LAX (Not operating on date, 2x weekly service begins 6/2)
SFB (Not operating on date, 2x weekly service begins 5/26)
VPS (Not operating on date, 2x weekly service begins 4/16)

American Airlines
CLT 3x (2x E75; 1x CR7)
DCA Not Operating, but will likely return
DFW 6x (3x CR7; 2x 319; 1x E75)
LAX Not Operating, but will likely return
LGA Not Operating, but will likely return
MIA Not Operating, but will likely return
ORD 1x CR7
PHL Not Operating, but will likely return
PHX 2x CR7

Delta Air Lines
ATL 5x (3x CR9; 2x 712)
DTW Not Operating, but will likely return
MSP 2x CR9
SLC 2x E75

Frontier Airlines
DEN (Not operating on date, 2x weekly service; operates Su Th)
MCO (Not operating on date, 2x weekly service begins 3/7)
LAS (Not operating on date, 2x weekly service begins 3/15)

Southwest Airlines
ATL (Not operating on date, 3x weekly service begins 2/7)
BNA (Not operating on date, operates Sa)
BWI Not operating, but will likely return
DCA (Not operating on date, 1x daily service begins 4/11)
DEN 2x 737
HOU 3x 737
LAS 1x 737
MCO (Not operating on date, 1x weekly service begins 3/13)
MDW (Not operating on date, operates Sa)
PHX 2x 737
STL 1x 737

United Airlines
DEN 3x (2x CR2; 1x E75)
EWR Not operating, but will likely return
IAD Not operating, but will likely return
IAH 4x E75
ORD 2x (1x E75; 1x CR5)
SFO Not operating, but will likely return

Happy New Year!

[HangryHippo]

As always, thanks a lot Catch!

[Celebrator]

Great info, thank you. I found out that WN was trying MCO once again when I was trying to book OKC-MHT and they were offering MCO as a connection. The only other connection they were offering was via MDW. And these were the ONLY two flights they were offering for a date in late July! We almost always fly thru BWI on that route, but it was not offered! I suppose it is likely that they will add seats to routes as things open up later in the spring for the summer, but as of now, there are not a lot of options on this route at least. Unusual times to be sure.

[PaddyShack]

Southwest will now have the largest planes at OKC, I really like seeing the larger planes come in, but alas they usually are military or freighters.

[PaddyShack]

Great info, thank you. I found out that WN was trying MCO once again when I was trying to book OKC-MHT and they were offering MCO as a connection. The only other connection they were offering was via MDW. And these were the ONLY two flights they were offering for a date in late July! We almost always fly thru BWI on that route, but it was not offered! I suppose it is likely that they will add seats to routes as things open up later in the spring for the summer, but as of now, there are not a lot of options on this route at least. Unusual times to be sure.

I really liked the one stop in BWI for MHT. We are looking at taking a road trip, instead of flying, this year with out destination being the White Mountains.

[Celebrator]

I really liked the one stop in BWI for MHT. We are looking at taking a road trip, instead of flying, this year with out destination being the White Mountains.

If I had more vacation time, I would LOVE to drive back east! The White Mountains (and New Hampshire in general--say as opposed to VT and ME) are/is an under-appreciated destination outside of the northeast--a very beautiful and charming place to visit any time of the year.

Hopefully, more connections between OKC and MHT will open up as we move closer to summer.

[BG918]

I really liked the one stop in BWI for MHT. We are looking at taking a road trip, instead of flying, this year with out destination being the White Mountains.

I used BWI as a one-stop connection on Southwest from OKC to PWM (Portland ME) a few years ago. Another great spot to start a road trip along the Maine coast, especially if you like eating fresh lobster and clam chowder!

[no1cub17]

Nice rundown, catch! Here's hoping we see at least some kind of recovery this year. OKC was on quite a roll pre-COVID. Was especially excited for AA's OKC-LGA flight. Would love AA to resume OKC-LAX as soon as feasible! If DL wanted to get in on that route, I wouldn't mind that either.

[Plutonic Panda]

You aren’t kidding about the LAX-OKC flight. That has really impacted me and it’ll be like a breath of fresh air once it resumes. I just wish it was Southwest operating it. Sometimes I’ll hop on a bus to Vegas when I can take it easy just to fly SW to OKC.

[Celebrator]

You aren’t kidding about the LAX-OKC flight. That has really impacted me and it’ll be like a breath of fresh air once it resumes. I just wish it was Southwest operating it. Sometimes I’ll hop on a bus to Vegas when I can take it easy just to fly SW to OKC.

I have always wondered why this route hasn't been flown by WN. I have to think it would do well.

[catch22]

Several factors:

1) LAX is extremely competitive. This drives yields/prices down - for a route like OKC-LAC to work you need a certain percentage of downline contribution (connection traffic). Network carriers such as AA offer this in the form of Hawaii and Intl Pacific, even offline connections (oneworld). Southwest can't touch that, although they are trying Hawaii.

2) LAX is a gate constrained airport. Southwest has plenty of gates, but they cant get anymore. They are essentially maxed out on gate space. Adding OKC-LAX would require them reduce service in a different market. There are always markets that can be cut or reduced, but is it worth it? Let's assume Southwest's worse performing market in LAX has the least desirable time slot. Such as a 10pm arrival in LAX and a 6am departure out of LAX. Trading that time window to an OKC flight might be equally or even less profitable than whatever route is "fortunate" enough to operate at those times.

TLDR: Markets like LAX are highly competitive; very expensive to operate in; maxed out assets require a potential market to significantly outperform whatever route is currently using that asset

[no1cub17]

Several factors:

1) LAX is extremely competitive. This drives yields/prices down - for a route like OKC-LAC to work you need a certain percentage of downline contribution (connection traffic). Network carriers such as AA offer this in the form of Hawaii and Intl Pacific, even offline connections (oneworld). Southwest can't touch that, although they are trying Hawaii.

2) LAX is a gate constrained airport. Southwest has plenty of gates, but they cant get anymore. They are essentially maxed out on gate space. Adding OKC-LAX would require them reduce service in a different market. There are always markets that can be cut or reduced, but is it worth it? Let's assume Southwest's worse performing market in LAX has the least desirable time slot. Such as a 10pm arrival in LAX and a 6am departure out of LAX. Trading that time window to an OKC flight might be equally or even less profitable than whatever route is "fortunate" enough to operate at those times.

TLDR: Markets like LAX are highly competitive; very expensive to operate in; maxed out assets require a potential market to significantly outperform whatever route is currently using that asset

Definitely makes sense - with Hawaii and the Pacific at near zero compared to what it was, I can see how OKC-LAX would be a tough one for AA at the moment. Do you know if they closed the Eagle's Nest at LAX also? As much as I hated it, it was worth it for the nonstop flights.

[Celebrator]

Several factors:

1) LAX is extremely competitive. This drives yields/prices down - for a route like OKC-LAC to work you need a certain percentage of downline contribution (connection traffic). Network carriers such as AA offer this in the form of Hawaii and Intl Pacific, even offline connections (oneworld). Southwest can't touch that, although they are trying Hawaii.

2) LAX is a gate constrained airport. Southwest has plenty of gates, but they cant get anymore. They are essentially maxed out on gate space. Adding OKC-LAX would require them reduce service in a different market. There are always markets that can be cut or reduced, but is it worth it? Let's assume Southwest's worse performing market in LAX has the least desirable time slot. Such as a 10pm arrival in LAX and a 6am departure out of LAX. Trading that time window to an OKC flight might be equally or even less profitable than whatever route is "fortunate" enough to operate at those times.

TLDR: Markets like LAX are highly competitive; very expensive to operate in; maxed out assets require a potential market to significantly outperform whatever route is currently using that asset

Thank you; a very interesting perspective. As an avgeek, I could talk this stuff all day long!

[Ward]

Pardon my ignorance in airlines language.

Are you guys talking about a direct flight from OKC to LAX?

There are, I think, 4 other airports that Southwest flies into the the LA general area. Ontario, Burbank, I can't recall the other 2.

Since LAX is maxed out, I'm just curious why Southwest might not offer a direct flight to one of the other LA area airports?

I have flown Southwest Ontario airport before, it was fine.

Anyway, just a curious thought and question, thanks for letting me show my lack of knowledge in this area.

I appreciate reading you guys comments on the OKC airport and flights.

[Celebrator]

Pardon my ignorance in airlines language.

Are you guys talking about a direct flight from OKC to LAX?

There are, I think, 4 other airports that Southwest flies into the the LA general area. Ontario, Burbank, I can't recall the other 2.

Since LAX is maxed out, I'm just curious why Southwest might not offer a direct flight to one of the other LA area airports?

I have flown Southwest Ontario airport before, it was fine.

Anyway, just a curious thought and question, thanks for letting me show my lack of knowledge in this area.

I appreciate reading you guys comments on the OKC airport and flights.

Yes, we were talking about an OKC-LAX nonstop on Southwest (WN is the International Air Transport Assoc. airline designator). Southwest flies to LAX, BUR, ONT, SNA (Orange Cty.), and soon LGB (Long Beach). I'll take a stab at answering a question based off of Catch's answer above. Capacity is probably a factor as these airports are considerably smaller. Also, I have heard there is a marketing challenge with helping people) who don't know the southland well) understand that these airports are secondary L.A. airports because they do not contain the name Los Angeles. A couple of them have tried in the past to include the name Los Angeles in their official names so that people understand that! So, it might be a hard sell, even if they did have capacity, to market a OKC-BUR nonstop, let's say, as opposed to an LAX flight. It's probably just not cost effective is the bottom line, when OKC has good connectivity out west with WN at two of their hubs that direction, LAS and PHX. Even DEN can be a good connection for SoCal from OKC. So, when they can just put you through a hub instead of launching an OKC-LAX nonstop, they're gonna do it. We'd have to be a bit bigger market to get a nonstop to LAX on WN (for instance MCI and STL are other heartland markets that have an LAX nonstop, but those metros are about a million/million and a half bigger than we are in population).

[Plutonic Panda]

I would love to see an OKC flight to LA area to an airport that isn’t LAX. That would be a dream come true. Long Beach is expanding or remodeling IIRC, Ontario, OC, and Burbank are great airports I’d have no issue with.

[Ward]

Thank you for responding, I appreciate it, I've learned some new things.

[Celebrator]

I would love to see an OKC flight to LA area to an airport that isn’t LAX. That would be a dream come true. Long Beach is expanding or remodeling IIRC, Ontario, OC, and Burbank are great airports I’d have no issue with.

It would be great to have a fight to a secondary L.A. airport. I have used all except SNA, but I think BUR is my favorite. For one I grew up in its flight path, but it is my preferred airport when going to L.A., it is SO easy to use in an area where crowds everywhere you turn are the norm rather than the exception. Highly recommend using BUR.

[brianinok]

I have reservations on AA in June for the non-stop OKC-LAX for a multigenerational trip. So, I hope it is back up and running by then. It is planned to be our first trip since Covid started. I hope all of us can get a vaccine by then; if not we would have to cancel regardless of if the flight has restarted.

[catch22]

I think we will just have to be thankful for whatever actually returns this year and next. Service to secondary airports is a pipe dream when we don't even have service to the primary.

Alaska tried SNA-ABQ a few years ago and I don't think it worked out.

[BG918]

It would be great to have a fight to a secondary L.A. airport. I have used all except SNA, but I think BUR is my favorite. For one I grew up in its flight path, but it is my preferred airport when going to L.A., it is SO easy to use in an area where crowds everywhere you turn are the norm rather than the exception. Highly recommend using BUR.

Great in that it’s an easy airport to get in and out of - the actual airport is terribly outdated and in need of a renovation. Reminds me of the OKC airport before the rebuild.

If I’m flying to Los Angeles I prefer BUR and SNA. Haven’t done ONT but I’ve heard it’s equally easy. Same for San Francisco -I much prefer SJC and OAK depending on where I’m going in the Bay Area

[no1cub17]

Great in that it’s an easy airport to get in and out of - the actual airport is terribly outdated and in need of a renovation. Reminds me of the OKC airport before the rebuild.

If I’m flying to Los Angeles I prefer BUR and SNA. Haven’t done ONT but I’ve heard it’s equally easy. Same for San Francisco -I much prefer SJC and OAK depending on where I’m going in the Bay Area

We've considered flying into ONT but man, it is FAR from LA proper. If you're going anywhere inland then ONT would work, but otherwise, ONT is quite a haul from LA or Orange County.

I have reservations on AA in June for the non-stop OKC-LAX for a multigenerational trip. So, I hope it is back up and running by then. It is planned to be our first trip since Covid started. I hope all of us can get a vaccine by then; if not we would have to cancel regardless of if the flight has restarted.

Certainly hope it's running by then, and I appreciate you wanting to get vaccinated!!!

I would love to see an OKC flight to LA area to an airport that isn’t LAX. That would be a dream come true. Long Beach is expanding or remodeling IIRC, Ontario, OC, and Burbank are great airports I’d have no issue with.

Can't see this happening anytime in the near future - an OKC-SNA/ONT/BUR flight would be the definition of point-to-point and would have to survive on local traffic alone. Hard to see any airline biting on that when LAX offers both the O&D and worldwide connections.

[Rover]

Great in that it’s an easy airport to get in and out of - the actual airport is terribly outdated and in need of a renovation. Reminds me of the OKC airport before the rebuild.

If I’m flying to Los Angeles I prefer BUR and SNA. Haven’t done ONT but I’ve heard it’s equally easy. Same for San Francisco -I much prefer SJC and OAK depending on where I’m going in the Bay Area

Ontario is very easy airport to get in and out. Good if you are going to Riverside, Redlands, Rancho Cucamonga, Ontario, West Covina, and other places on the east. And, it’s usually much cheaper to fly into for a short drive to Palm Springs/Cochilla Valley than flying into Palm Springs airport.
J

[d-usa]

Flying Southwest to Houston tomorrow morning, gonna be interesting to see how full of a flight it will be.

[gopokes88]

They've been fuller than you might expect