Airline Cuts

[venture]

Just going to keep this generic since more will happen as schedules come out.

Continental will end service from OKC to Cleveland in September due to fuel costs.

[brianinok]

Any chance they'll consolidate some of those 7 RJs to Houston into more than 2 mainlines? Having that many RJs on a route is beyond rediculous. There should be a law with a maximum RJ count on routes like this....

[venture]

I would say no. They are grounding their older 737-300s and -500s...and they only have so many -700s to go around.

I am with you though, if these airlines were forced to consolidate back to larger aircraft and away from RJs - congestion wouldn't be an issue. Plus they wouldn't have ran off so many customers by switching traditional large jet routes to RJs. Sure everyone wanted to have more frequent schedules, but the 50-seat RJs are money losers most of the time now.

[JWil]

I hate the regional jets.

At least Southwest gets it. All the others are jokers. Charging for checking bags? That's a crime IMO. I can't wait for the next step: Banning carry-on bags, so they can make more money.

[venture]

I don't agree with the method they are using to cover costs, but definitely not a crime or unexpected. Airlines elsewhere in the world have been charging for these things for awhile now, so no shock we are going down that road.

Airlines just need to deal with it and raise fares to cover their costs. If it scares the people who are too cheap to pay their fair share, so be it. However the side point to all this, airlines are getting to the point of pure transportation companies. You are paying to go from point A to point B...and that's it. You won't anything else, pay more.

Southwest would be bleeding cash right now like the rest of them without their fuel hedging program and the money they've made off that.

[solitude]

Southwest's marketing over the whole fee issue with other airlines is nothing short of brilliant. Some of the best ad work I've seen in a long time -- especially the print ads. Brilliant!

[chrisok]

I hate to hear about the cut in service. While connection times weren't great, I didn't mind connecting through CLE. Just about every city they're dropping to/from CLE were new routes, most newer than OKC's. (TUL, SAV, DSM, and AUS) It's funny how quickly companies can change their minds. All of this happens just a few months after CO announces these big plans to expand its hub in CLE.

Not a very proactive group, these airlines.

[flintysooner]

April 23, 2008 article on Motley Fool:
Let's Nationalize the Airlines!

I am a capitalist pig. I am a total economic libertarian, and I am ready to send the airline executives to the gulag. You know, I am ready to nationalize the whole thing."

-- P.J. O'Rourke, speaking on Real Time With Bill Maher, March 21, 2008

[Kerry]

You mean we get the safety and performance of Aeroflot at twice the prices we currently pay. How do we sign up? Name just one thing our government does well - just one thing. Why trust Washington with anything else?

[flintysooner]

There's a growing chorus for some kind of federal intervention. Even a Forbes on Fox guy this morning was promoting some kind of temporary deal.

[venture]

Eh...the fed can do a few things, but definitely not nationalize. Couple steps that come to mind...

1) Relax the taxation on the airline tickets. Airline service is the highest taxed form of transportation and business (i believe) in the country.

Right now airlines and airline passengers pay a Federal Ticket Tax (7.5%), Federal Segment Tax ($3.30 per seg), Passenger Facility Charge ($4.50 per departure, used to fund airport improvements), Federal Security Service Fee ($2.50 per ticket), and I'm sure I'm missing a couple.

The FTT and FST both go to fund the FAA's operations. Commercial operations only account for about 30% or so of the national traffic. Military makes up about 6% and Air Cargo is about 3%. The rest of the flights...over 60% are flow by general aviation, business jets, or air taxis. Imagine if that 60% had to pay a similar amount as the airlines for use of the FAA system...airlines would see a HUGE drop in what they were do. Or...ATC and other areas would actually get improvements.

2) Establishment of fixed landing slots at airports and restrict the frequency of smaller aircraft on the same route.

Let's say Philadelphia can handle only 70 arrivals/departures per hour...but the airlines have 100 per hour scheduled. Massive delays. Restict service to an airport to where it won't be overflowing with traffic it can't handle. This also will mean airlines will have to go back to offering flights on larger aircraft. Ideally this should allow them to spread the cost of fuel over additional seats.

The flip side...this will have some other effect by hopefully pushing airlines back into secondary airports. Philly is full, okay...you start looking at Wilmington, DE or Trenton, NJ.

[flintysooner]

It seems to me that the antiquated air traffic control system might bear significant responsibility, too. Seems like once there is GPS in every aircraft that routes could be significantly altered for much greater efficiency. That would even allow for innovation in plane sizes and faster and more flexible adaptation to consumer needs.

Right now the consumer and the airline each regard each other as the enemy with the possible exception of Southwest. That's not a good situation.

Just like the NWS and the military and every other federal system the ATC is so outdated. It just seems impossible for the bureaucracy to stay anywhere near close to current with computing and software engineering.

The airlines are in such bad shape though and there is nothing optimistic on the near term horizon that I see. The quickly approaching consolidation in the industry is unlikely to improve things for the employees, support companies, or the consumers. The owners and lenders have already changed more than once.

I think federal intervention should occur at some point before the entire industry is lost.

[venture]

I totally agree if the ATC was upgraded like it has been in Europe...we wouldn't have nearly the problems we do now. However when only 30% of the users are being charged for using it, its no wonder money is tight.

i don't think airlines look at their customers as enemies...its just management doesn't know what else to do. The passengers demand to see low ticket prices, well if the other expenses are added in up front - they won't be all that low. So it comes down to airlines having to break out those feels to show customers how much it has cost them to get things for free before. Southwest has done a great job marketing wise for this, but they are also feeling the pinch. Continental is the other that I would put up there as far as respecting the customer.

[OUman]

^CO has been better than most other legacy carriers but lately I've heard service standards are dropping with it as well. And I'm sure the passengers on that broken lavatory flight across the Atlantic would beg to differ

[jbrown84]

So is XJet pulling out for sure? My friend flew last week and said while he was gone, they took down XJet's big add in the concourse and put up a new one advertising their Ontario flight.

[venture]

Yes...the XJet branded flights are leaving for good. In fact, the entire branded operations sounds like it'll be gone for good by fall.

[jbrown84]

Probably just making sure the flights do as best as possible while they're still around...

[venture]

American detailed their Q4 cuts today.

OKC will lose one daily round trip to Chicago O'hare, dropping to 3 daily from 4. St. Louis and Dallas remain unchanged.

[OKCTalker]

GPS is a much better option than the current ATC-dictated airway system. Ironically, GPS-direct flights are in less-congested airspace and run a lesser risk of a midair than following VR or IR routes. Add TCAS, and it's a no-brainer (note: "TCAS" stands for Traffic Collision Avoidance System which is a little screen in the cockpit showing other aircraft in the pilot's vicinity. Also known as a "fish finder.")

My last two IFR flights back home were delayed by ATC routing, delaying our takeoff from Denver by 30 minutes, and giving me the ___ Arrival into Wiley Post from the northeast. Would have been better to launch VFR and pick up a clearance in the air.

[venture]

Delta will be announcing thier cuts either this week or just have their holiday. Stay tuned.

[flintysooner]

I just flew again for the first time in 10 years.

There have been a lot of changes. I parked off airport in the same place but now a different company name. I was surprised how full the lot was even at my very early hour. The lots at the airport were bigger and fuller.

The security experience at the airport was better than I anticipated but I was expecting something more like torture. I really like the renovations to the terminal. I was surprised at the number of people.

Ticketing is pretty different with these kiosks for boarding passes.

Oklahoma City's airport is so much more convenient than other places.

The airplanes are the same except even more crowded and older and a little more worn than I remember. There were no empty seats. I had forgotten the discomfort of air travel.

Everything seems more rushed and busier.

On the return there were storms in Dallas and the flight to OKC was canceled so ended up renting a car and driving back. I didn't remember the rental car terminal in Dallas. In fact DFW seemed larger. I was at DFW in 1974 a few months after it opened and recall a tram stranding passengers. Now they have a brand new train.

[venture]

American will be cutting DFW to 7 from 8 flights in November.

[OUman]

^venture I think the American and Eagle/Connection "cuts" aren't really cuts as such, just seasonal eliminations, they do these every winter.

[venture]

Nah, this is a cut. They are eliminating a large portion of the fleet and having to move aircraft around. This is the main reason for the larger than expected cuts out of Chicago.

[chrisok]

Yes...the XJet branded flights are leaving for good. In fact, the entire branded operations sounds like it'll be gone for good by fall.

September 2 to be exact.