Christian Atheist

[metro]

Seems like a pretty in your face book. He did a series on "Practical Atheist" last year and it was intense. Awhile back he had a website up where you could read Chapter 1 for free. Can't seem to find the link now.

[OKCisOK4me]

Oxymoron

[silvergrove]

Read the small quotes above his title: Believing in god but living as if he doesn't exist.

A quick google search will show you that he's the founder of lifechurch.tv

[possumfritter]

Is this something along the lines of "God save us from your followers?"

[OKCisOK4me]

Read the small quotes above his title: Believing in god but living as if he doesn't exist.

A quick google search will show you that he's the founder of lifechurch.tv

He looks like Christopher Reeves too. I'm spiritual but not religious. I hope that's what he's getting at...

[Edmond_Outsider]

He looks like Christopher Reeves too. I'm spiritual but not religious. I hope that's what he's getting at...

I doubt it. This is one of those clever "Satan Hates Life Chruch" "Life Church Sucks" kind of clever marketing things. The message doesn't leave much room for any ways but being a "fully devoted follower of life church," Groeshel, or Christ...take your pick. I'd bet all paths lead back to mr charisma.

[OKCisOK4me]

I doubt it. This is one of those clever "Satan Hates Life Chruch" "Life Church Sucks" kind of clever marketing things. The message doesn't leave much room for any ways but being a "fully devoted follower of life church," Groeshel, or Christ...take your pick. I'd bet all paths lead back to mr charisma.

I don't like Life Church... It's too "cult-ish" for me, lol.

[Jethrol]

I don't like Life Church... It's too "cult-ish" for me, lol.

Yep and this book will put millions more in his pockets.

[NikonNurse]

As a "cult member", the book is based on a series he preached about saying you're a christian, going to church on Sundays and Easter, but living like you're not on the 6 other days of the week and the other holidays. You can't be a true Christian if the only time you act like one is in church.

I am now signing off to go drink my Groschel Kool-aid.

[Nutri]

Jethrol,

You seem like a very smart, well-informed guy / lady and it appears that you have educated yourself on the topic of Groeschel's income from his book proceeds. There's just one thing that is missing from your post. FACT... Please enlighten us on where you got this information. Tell us how you know that Groeschel is lining his pockets with book sales. When did he make his first $1 mil, as you have implied? I look forward to your response and the maybe this time, you can back it up with some evidence.

Isn't it fun to hide behind a computer and try to engage in conversations that you know nothing about...?

[OKCisOK4me]

As a "cult member", the book is based on a series he preached about saying you're a christian, going to church on Sundays and Easter, but living like you're not on the 6 other days of the week and the other holidays. You can't be a true Christian if the only time you act like one is in church.

I am now signing off to go drink my Groschel Kool-aid.

So this should be a book about Catholics...? Cause I know plenty of them that live like that. I'm gonna go drink my water now

[NikonNurse]

So this should be a book about Catholics...? Cause I know plenty of them that live like that. I'm gonna go drink my water now

Where is that implied?...are Catholics the only christians? Rephrase the question.

[sam greenroyd]

Where is that implied?...are Catholics the only christians? Rephrase the question.

As a christian the only authority we have to live our lives is in the Holy Bible the Bible says Eph 4 v 1-6 there is only one church and one belief , so its up to the christian to study the sciptures and to find that one church that christ established.

[possumfritter]

Where is that implied?...are Catholics the only christians? Rephrase the question.

I am not one to judge, but this problem is present in every denomination.

[NikonNurse]

Its not Groschel's version of how to be a Christian..It IS the teaching from the bible that he references...It's not how to be a Life Church Christian or a Catholic Christian.

[possumfritter]

I am tempted to buy the book, or at least run by Mardels and take a look at it to find out if it might be worth purchasing.

I do know this, God knows our hearts and He cannot be fooled.

[NikonNurse]

It was a pretty good series...
I'm not trying to push an agenda or any thing but you can see the series here:

1. Practical Atheist LifeChurch.tv - Message Archive
If I remember right, the "STOP ACTING LIKE A CHRISTIAN' was along the same lines.

2-There is also another series based on the ONE GOD, ONE CHURCH. They do it every year and partner with many metro and worldwide churches. It is the ONE PRAYER sereis.

[possumfritter]

I'm not trying to push an agenda or any thing...

I don't think you are in any way pushing an agenda. This is an open forum with all talk-all day format.

Thanks for posting the links.

My fav is Charles Stanley of First Baptist, Atlanta, and many of his sermons end up as books and vice-versa.

Locally, I just haven't find quite the right Church yet. I am thinking of going to Rosh Penah Messianic.

[MsDarkstar]

I haven't read this book, and I'll be honest - I probably will never read it (just not my cup of tea). I can say this though - the message of this book is something that pre-dates LifeChurch.

When I was an active member of First United Methodist Church OKC, he was an associate pastor & singles minister. They had a singles service & social every Friday night and one thing that he talked about or made frequent reference to were what he called CEO Christians; people that considered themselves Christians because they went to church on Christmas and Easter only. His whole point was going to church every now and again didn't make you a Christian. In order to be a Christian, you have to LIVE like one every day, not just on holidays. Other than the fact that he's the minister of LifeChurch, I don't see how this book could be construed as LifeChurch propaganda.

[metro]

I doubt it. This is one of those clever "Satan Hates Life Chruch" "Life Church Sucks" kind of clever marketing things. The message doesn't leave much room for any ways but being a "fully devoted follower of life church," Groeshel, or Christ...take your pick. I'd bet all paths lead back to mr charisma.

Blah blah I hate lifechurch again, I'm a Craig Grochel hater, you never once prove your point with actual facts against LC.tv. You spend more time typing about that you hate Grochel on this website than anything. Scary.

[fuzzytoad]

Blah blah I hate lifechurch again, I'm a Craig Grochel hater, you never once prove your point with actual facts against LC.tv. You spend more time typing about that you hate Grochel on this website than anything. Scary.

Not to defend EO, but I see far more lifechurch.tv recruitment on these forums than I see anti-lifechurch.tv rhetoric.

[Edmond_Outsider]

Not to defend EO, but I see far more lifechurch.tv recruitment on these forums than I see anti-lifechurch.tv rhetoric.

Metro uses this forum exclusively for prosletizing LC. I do know what Groeshel's message is. I have attended LC, watched the online sermons, etc.
I don't agree with his theology or the marketing of the church.

Metro, you can't expect everybody to be in lock step with you and act like it is the second coming of Elvis everytime Groeshel gets out of bed in the morning.

If you want to talk theology, great. If you want to advertise for LC, that's your perogative and it is mine to react to your advertisements with a less than enthusiastic reaction.

I don't advertise my church here and I think we're pretty special. When there are real theological discussions here, not just the Metro's Craig Groeshel Fan Club threads, then we can discuss things.

As long as you keep advertising, I'll keep responding with my opinion of yours and his marketing because that is the subject at hand--selling a book, a lecture series, etc isn't about faith or religion, it is marketing. Perhaps these threads would be better on the local business forum.

My objection isn't the message, it is the marketing.

[metro]

And just what is it that LC stands for? I still haven't heard any solid answers for all your accusations. Ironic how you don't bash any other churches promoted here other than LC, does your church have an anti LC agenda? Last time I checked, we were all on the same team, maybe you should check your church's instruction manual.

[Edmond_Outsider]

How to never measure up to an evangelist's unrealistic and unobtainable expectations of you.

I grew up Southern Baptist so I'm really familiar with this message. It is well trod ground for the SBC and most other Christian denominations.

It is an easy message to gleen from Jesus' teachings but a hard one to reconcile with the realities of modern life or a broader and more holistic approach to Jesus' teachings.

If one believes that God expects us to live good lives, care for our families and others who need our help, and also experience Joy, then he forgives us our sins and does not expect the laundry list of expectations Groeshel lays out for us.

Of course, it begins with the premise that one is either a good christian or an Atheist which is, by extension, a serious and mortal threat.

Coersive manipulation was one of the reasons I left the SBC and never regretted it. I spent a lot of my early life destroyed by the constant message that I would go to hell because I couldn't ever live up to the expectations of the church which diverge only slightly from Groeshel's book. In fact, they diverge very little from the message I grew up trying to live up to.

This message seems to indicate that one must live as John, Paul, or the diciples which is a zealots life.

Christian Atheists look a lot like Christians, but they live a lot like Travis [READL Atheists].

I will admit to fairly extreme cynisism. It isn't an uninformed bias, it is one which has come from a life of "practising" Christianity. Some day I will get it right but not with the help of books like this.

Having seen this basic message being used by politicians for votes, siding salemen to cheat little old ladies, Pat Robertson to build diamond mines under the guise of sending food and medicine to the starving and afflicted, and, most of all, myself and many many others sincerely looking for spirituality but finding a litany of guilt and self-serving instruction instead.

I don't beleive this is really a message designed to help. It seems more designed to make one dependent on the approval of the evangelist. I'm not interested in living up to Groeshel or anybody else's standards than my own.

I think it is a message designed to instruct people in all the ways they don't measure up and are unworthy and unforgivable. Just to make sure, Groeshel even makes feeling of unworthy or unforgivable into sins.

Wow! Leave no stone unthrown.

Truth is, nobody can escape shamed of thier past, be sure of God's existance let alone understand what "God's love" is, not believe in prayer like Groeshel says you should, avoid worry, not pursue self-interst, not be concerned about money, strive to live as an evangelist, or not be distrustful of "God's" Church's.

My review and my theological perspective in a nutshell.

[metro]

Two things. One your still forgetting to cite specific sources of the church and/or Groechel and two your not mentioning grace in any of this.