A Better Traffic Light

[OKCTalker]

I like Traffic Lights - YouTube

Improved by the simple addition of a digital display showing the seconds until the light changes to green or red.

Helps texters anticipate when they'll have to get moving again after it turns green, and alerts those approaching the light to throttle it back.

I like, but how much per intersection?

[HangryHippo]

This really goes against what the new system does. It should sense and "see" cars coming and modify timing to optimize flow. They've started to install them but I'm not sure where and I don't think the system is online. If you put a countdown, it would probably jump down and up based on traffic patterns -- which would defeat the purpose.

In 'static' intersections where timing will always be predictable, maybe it would be a good idea.

Could they not just adjust the timing accordingly based on the optimized flow/timing? It's probably not that easy, but I'm asking anyway.

[Just the facts]

I love the traffic light count down, but it will cut into the profits of the red light cameras. Here in Jax they installed the red light cameras AND took off the crosswalk countdown and replaced them with the old fashion flashing hand - that way approaching cars don't know when the light is about to turn yellow.

In London a red light will turn to yellow and red about 2 seconds before the light turns green so traffic can get ready - and then it off to the races.

[catch22]

In OKC (haven't tried it anywhere else) there are 3 sensor loops to most every intersection.

Yellow lights stay yellow for the speed limit divided by 10 in seconds. 45 mph will give you 4.5 seconds to clear a yellow light. 35 = 3.5, 55 = 5.5 etc. The middle sensor loop (so the second one you pass) is what I call the trigger. If the light turns yellow before you cross that loop at the speed limit you will not make it through the intersection with yellow. If you are at or past the middle loop at or above the speed limit you will make it through with a solid yellow. I have tested this theory for several years in OKC and short of writing a scientific journal it is confirmed.

Some intersections are wider or have medians which absorb some of your yellow time so use proper judgment.

[OKCTalker]

Sid - I'd sure like your take on this because you're among the most well-versed here on the topic.

JTF - I support red light cameras despite some saying that their primary purpose is revenue. They would dissuade me from blowing through reds, and I imagine others are the same. To me it's simply applying technology to enforce existing traffic laws, and I'm all for that.

[venture]

My concern looking at these are people waiting for the red countdown and jumping out right away. What if someone blows the light or is in the intersection as it turns red. I can just see some dumb driver floor it when it the counter hits "0" without looking. I would favor the idea of having it for the green/yellow light...but for the red not so much.

Red light cameras are something I favor as well. I would go further though and couple them, like I've seen in many places, with speed cameras as well. So if you are racing to beat a light you are going to get it on the speeding if you manage to make it before it changes. Of course speed cameras would be great mitigating concerns along stretches of road that people think they can just open it up to 65 when it the limit if 40.

Of course I would like to see where these light counters adjust for traffic flow. Nothing annoys me more than sitting at a light for a minute with no opposing traffic in sight. File that away with wanting dynamic speed limit signs on highways and interstates to match conditions...ranging from 45 mph (or whatever is needed) on the low end to 70 on the high end.

[Just the facts]

Funny enough - we had a front page story in the Sunday paper about how much money the red light cameras were generating. Not a word if they were reducing red light running. It kind of makes me wonder what the actual objective is since in 75% of all pedestrian deaths the drive of the car is at fault.

[Just the facts]

My concern looking at these are people waiting for the red countdown and jumping out right away. What if someone blows the light or is in the intersection as it turns red. I can just see some dumb driver floor it when it the counter hits "0" without looking. I would favor the idea of having it for the green/yellow light...but for the red not so much.

I think there is a still a short time (1 to 2 seconds) where all the lights are red at the same time so as to avoid that situation.

[ctchandler]

JTF,
I've logged over 15,000 miles driving in England, Wales, and Scotland (and the lesser known, Cornwall) and the lights all work as you describe. I have felt that if they worked that way in Oklahoma it would be just another opportunity to jump the gun. But, it seems to work well across the pond. Actually, it seems to me that they are the same in Ireland but I'm not sure about that.
C. T.

In London a red light will turn to yellow and red about 2 seconds before the light turns green so traffic can get ready - and then it off to the races.

[Just the facts]

JTF,
I've logged over 15,000 miles driving in England, Wales, and Scotland (and the lesser known, Cornwall) and the lights all work as you describe. I have felt that if they worked that way in Oklahoma it would be just another opportunity to jump the gun. But, it seems to work well across the pond. Actually, it seems to me that they are the same in Ireland but I'm not sure about that.
C. T.

I didn't know they did that and tried to run across The Strand before the light turned and I got stuck between two lanes - not the center median mind you - but two lanes going the same direction. Thank goodness traffic was real heavy and no one tried to change lanes or I would have been a gonner.

[ctchandler]

JTF,
They are not "pedestrian friendly" over there! Overall though, I like their system, the roundabouts, and the way that most drivers obey the law when it comes to slow lane/passing lane etiquette. I'm afraid the roundabouts wouldn't work here. Too bad.
C. T.

[Just the facts]

JTF,
They are not "pedestrian friendly" over there!

Did you catch Russell Crowe on Jay Leno the other night?

[Snowman]

Sid - I'd sure like your take on this because you're among the most well-versed here on the topic.

JTF - I support red light cameras despite some saying that their primary purpose is revenue. They would dissuade me from blowing through reds, and I imagine others are the same. To me it's simply applying technology to enforce existing traffic laws, and I'm all for that.

While it will vary by location why red light cameras have been put in. Something more disturbing has been reports that after having it as a revenue source some cities have changed the timing to provide less warning, which provides more revenue but increased the accident count.

[Just the facts]

While it will vary by location why red light cameras have been put in. Something more disturbing has been reports that after having it as a revenue source some cities have changed the timing to provide less warning, which provides more revenue but increased the accident count.

New York City did this. What can I say other than we live in a world of screwed up priorities.

City red-light cameras take advantage of short yellow lights to increase ticket revenue - NYPOST.com

AAA is “in favor of red-light cameras,” Sinclair insisted. “But it must be fair. People lose respect for these programs if they view them as revenue enhancers. You can’t have respect for this program if you’re setting it up to be unfair and you’re just reaching into people’s pockets

Given how money hungry some cities are, even if they put in the count down clocks they wouldn't be incremented in seconds (e.g. a countdown from 10 would only take 8 seconds). People would think 10 seconds because the sign says 10, but would really only have 8. If you need proof just time the countdown on the video in the original post - it doesn't last 10 seconds.

[PHXguyinOKC]

...Of course speed cameras would be great mitigating concerns along stretches of road that people think they can just open it up to 65 when it the limit if 40...

fixed speed cameras on stretches of road to keep people in the speed limit do not work. people learn where the cameras are located, slow down over the sensors then speed right back up.
Arizona put speed cameras in all over metro Phoenix freeways back in 2005 and it did nothing to slow people down. All it did was increase the accordion effect, increase rear end collisions, and aggravate the crap out of everyone. The lack of revenue from the contracted company and increase in collisions prompted ADOT to shut off the speed cameras

[bradh]

fixed speed cameras on stretches of road to keep people in the speed limit do not work. people learn where the cameras are located, slow down over the sensors then speed right back up.
Arizona put speed cameras in all over metro Phoenix freeways back in 2005 and it did nothing to slow people down. All it did was increase the accordion effect, increase rear end collisions, and aggravate the crap out of everyone. The lack of revenue from the contracted company and increase in collisions prompted ADOT to shut off the speed cameras

Yeah that stretch of 101 in NE Scottsdale where the cameras were was brutal. I was there when those were first installed.