Lindsey Street

[Geographer]

I thought I would go ahead and start a thread since the city will be re-doing Lindsey street from the interstate to (at least) Berry. What would you like to see?

5 lanes with middle turn lane?
4 lanes?
2 lanes with bike lanes/street parking?
2 lanes with bike lanes/street parking and a median?
2 lanes with bike lanes and non-interrupted sidewalks all the way down Lindsey?
Dedicated space for bus pull-offs?
Replace intersection lights with roundabouts?


Personal preference: 2 10' car lanes with a bike lane on each side. Roundabouts replace the street lights at 24th/Lindsey, McGee/Lindsey, and Berry/Lindsey. The Roundabouts would help congestion along Lindsey as cars would not have to wait for lights, but simply merging into a roundabout. This Lindsey street project has an opportunity to be a model street for Norman and the surrounding areas...since it is a gateway into the city/university...this is all personal preference though. Revamping Lindsey Street is a MUST though. Retail Space per square foot has fallen recently in the shopping centers along Lindsey. A new, complete, streetscape could revamp the corridor and put reinvestment/renovation into the strip centers along the corridor.

EDIT: Last week, President Boren voiced his support for re-doing Lindsey from Berry into campus as long as it can be done "tastefully"....meaning two lanes/sidewalks, etc...as long as it does not destroy the current tree canopy, etc.

[jedicurt]

my preference would be 3 lanes, one each way with a dedicated turn lane, bike lanes on each side, and dedicated spaces for bus pull-off

[Geographer]

I'm not sold on the dedicated middle turn lane. I think a median that's well landscaped would do wonders for the street scape as a whole. Left turns into businesses aren't absolutely essential, especially if you have roundabouts at intersections where you can easily enter the roundabout and make a U-turn.

But I am totally with you on the bike lanes and dedicated space for bus pull offs, if there's enough space and the city doesn't have to purchase a ton of right-of-way...which is where it could get costly.

[Geographer]

I prefer 2 lanes, no median, bike lanes, and angled parking (if possible). Back in parking is even better.

Reverse Angle parking is fantastic. It's much safer....having the street parking would also set the stage to move buildings along lindsey closer to the street. I am not sure that would be able to get approved though, given the vast amount of parking lots along Lindsey.

[Geographer]

Something like this would be really cool too for Lindsey at I-35. Where you have the on/off ramps that come into two roundabouts on either side of the interstate.

roundabout.jpg

[jedicurt]

As long as U-turns at intersections (either by roundabout or traffic light) are allowed and encouraged, then i would be okay with a median or a no left turn policy if there is no median. I just know that if you allow left turns, there will be big issues for traffic backups. that is why i support a middle turn lane.

[Roger S]

From an engineering viewpoint I love the concept of RAP but at the same time my wife can barely back her car out of our garage without taking the house down and I know she's not alone in her inability to back a vehicle.

So how often would I be coming back out to my vehicle to find out that a well seasoned citizen or someone like my wife has backed into my vehicle?

[BoulderSooner]

isn't it already decided that it will be 2 lanes each direction with a turn lane .. and new sidewalks ..

[Geographer]

From an engineering viewpoint I love the concept of RAP but at the same time my wife can barely back her car out of our garage without taking the house down and I know she's not alone in her inability to back a vehicle.

So how often would I be coming back out to my vehicle to find out that a well seasoned citizen or someone like my wife has backed into my vehicle?

I suppose so, but from a safety standpoint, I would rather "pull into traffic" than "back out into traffic", as what happens with standard angle parking. I don't think people be able to back into a parking spot would be a giant issue though.


EDIT: Added a photo of reverse angle parking, just so everyone knows exactly what it looks like....where you back in and have some extra space between the parking space and where the driving lane actually starts. parking.jpg

[Geographer]

isn't it already decided that it will be 2 lanes each direction with a turn lane .. and new sidewalks ..

It is not totally decided. There was a meeting last week with Dan Burden (walkable and livable communities expert) which was attended by a few council members, engineering firm hired for the lindsey project, mayor of Norman, President Boren, etc. The workshop was specifically about a "Livable Lindsey Street" and what the design should be.

[HangryHippo]

Here's my preference:

1) A beautifully landscaped center median
2) Lindsey St. is 2 lanes each way with U-turns allowed at the signaled intersections with 24th Ave, McGee, Berry, Flood, and Chautauqua
3) Dedicated areas for buses to pull off
4) Uninterrupted wide sidewalks the entire length of Lindsey

[Roger S]

I suppose so, but from a safety standpoint, I would rather "pull into traffic" than "back out into traffic", as what happens with standard angle parking. I don't think people be able to back into a parking spot would be a giant issue though.

You have more faith in the skills of Oklahoma drivers than I do.

[Geographer]

You have more faith in the skills of Oklahoma drivers than I do.

haha...I can be optimistic sometimes

I just know that people don't like backing out directly into traffic on main street...you're literally back into a driving lane on Main...and if there's a parked car next to you that's blocking your view then it's a crapshoot backing out.

[Just the facts]

let me say that I am presently surprised by this change of design criteria. When the bond issue was being discussed and voted on the desire was for Lindsey to move as many cars as possible as fast as possible between Berry and I-35.

http://www.okctalk.com/norman/31544-...age-today.html

http://www.okctalk.com/norman/27534-...g-forward.html

[Geographer]

let me say that I am presently surprised by this change of design criteria. When the bond issue was being discussed and voted on the desire was for Lindsey to move as many cars as possible as fast as possible between Berry and I-35.

http://www.okctalk.com/norman/31544-...age-today.html

http://www.okctalk.com/norman/27534-...g-forward.html

Yeah, I am surprised as well, but I think that people and city leaders are beginning to understand that we don't want to "robinson our lindsey street" (I'm coining that phrase hah). It was encouraging to see local leaders involved in last week's workshop.

Here is the video from the workshop, towards the end of the video are some examples of what Lindsey could look like.





Malta, New York
malta.JPG

[Roger S]

I just know that people don't like backing out directly into traffic on main street...you're literally back into a driving lane on Main...and if there's a parked car next to you that's blocking your view then it's a crapshoot backing out.

That's exactly why I like the concept of RAP. And I suppose in the long run the damage from someone backing into me compared to the damage of someone clipping me doing 30-40 MPH is going to be a lot less extensive....... Unless they run into me doing 30-40 MPH while I'm backing into my parking space.

[Plutonic Panda]

Does this street run though downtown?

On edit: just noticed that it doesn't, or so I think. Anyhow, a six lane divided BLVD. with dual left turns, and right turn lanes as well as 11ft. Trails would be good.

When it runs through OU it should narrow down to 4 lanes and bike lanes on both sides

[Geographer]

Does this street run though downtown?

No, Lindsey is the street that leads into the heart of the university

[venture]

Does this street run though downtown?

Google Maps! /whip

But no it does not.

Personally I like the refocus on not doing another boring 4/5 lane road to Berry. However, we have to understand that traffic is going to be pretty heavy so I think that eliminates any on street parking for safety reasons.

A new corridor with wide sidewalks, beautiful landscaping including a median, and a setup that promotes the easy flow of traffic is what is needed. Of course we'll hear from those that want a 5 lane road all the way to campus and houses and trees be damned, but thankfully those people are few and far between. Even less now that half of the old city council is out the door as of yesterday.

[Plutonic Panda]

Google Maps! /whip

But no it does not.

Personally I like the refocus on not doing another boring 4/5 lane road to Berry. However, we have to understand that traffic is going to be pretty heavy so I think that eliminates any on street parking for safety reasons.

A new corridor with wide sidewalks, beautiful landscaping including a median, and a setup that promotes the easy flow of traffic is what is needed. Of course we'll hear from those that want a 5 lane road all the way to campus and houses and trees be damned, but thankfully those people are few and far between. Even less now that half of the old city council is out the door as of yesterday.

yeah i went to gmaps right after I posted lol But you can look at my post above. It has my thoughts on it

[Geographer]

Does this street run though downtown?

On edit: just noticed that it doesn't, or so I think. Anyhow, a six lane divided BLVD. with dual left turns, and right turn lanes as well as 11ft. Trails would be good.

When it runs through OU it should narrow down to 4 lanes and bike lanes on both sides

Please tell me you're joking about the six lane boulevard. That would make it the largest street in Norman. For a street that has been LOSING traffic over the past 12 years. Lindsey works fine now as two lanes, it just needs to have the street lights removed with roundabout replacing.

A six lane road on Lindsey would not only cost a fortune to construct (right of way purchases as well) but an absolute disaster for the area. I hope you were kidding.

[Plutonic Panda]

Please tell me you're joking about the six lane boulevard. That would make it the largest street in Norman. For a street that has been LOSING traffic over the past 12 years. Lindsey works fine now as two lanes, it just needs to have the street lights removed with roundabout replacing.

A six lane road on Lindsey would not only cost a fortune to construct (right of way purchases as well) but an absolute disaster for the area. I hope you were kidding.

if it really has been loosing traffic, then it shouldn't be six lanes. Everything else on my list remains same though. I'm going by your word.

Btw, on gmaps it has Lindsey at five lanes one way, what am I missing here???? Where is the two lanes at?

[Geographer]

if it really has been loosing traffic, then it shouldn't be six lanes. Everything else on my list remains same though. I'm going by your word.

Btw, on gmaps it has Lindsey at five lanes one way, what am I missing here???? Where is the two lanes at?

I have no clue where you're looking. Lindsey Street between I-35 on the west and Berry Road on the east. Lindsey is a mile south of Main Street and a mile north of Highway 9.

[venture]

if it really has been loosing traffic, then it shouldn't be six lanes. Everything else on my list remains same though. I'm going by your word.

Btw, on gmaps it has Lindsey at five lanes one way, what am I missing here???? Where is the two lanes at?

Lindsey is only 4 lanes until just east of 24th SW then it goes to 2 lanes with a center turn lane all the way to Berry. I think you are looking at Hwy 9.

[Plutonic Panda]

I have no clue where you're looking. Lindsey Street between I-35 on the west and Berry Road on the east. Lindsey is a mile south of Main Street and a mile north of Highway 9.

Lindsey is only 4 lanes until just east of 24th SW then it goes to 2 lanes with a center turn lane all the way to Berry. I think you are looking at Hwy 9.

ah, I think I see it now. So if it is that kind of street they should add bike lanes, center median w/ landscaping, 12' sidewalks and that would be swell. Also, dedicated turn lanes to.