Crossroads Mall

[bchris02]

They tried to turn Eastland Mall in Charlotte into a Hispanic-themed mall modeled after the one in Ft Worth but it failed and I believe the mall is now slated for the wrecking ball. It's a popular idea and an excellent concept but most of the time it isn't the success that it was in Ft Worth. I wish Crossroads all the best but part of me has my doubts that the ambitious plans will actually come to fruition.

[bluedogok]

Very salient point. I don't know how many people here remember the big center fountain just amid the switchback ramps between the floors at center court, but it was buried years ago. I asked someone why, and they said that the understructure of the fountain had rotted beneath the foundation and was essentially gushing water out beneath the floor and eroding the foundation. Fixing it would have required busting out the floor and pouring/building a brand new fountain, which would have surely cost a small fortune, so they just buried it.

That's just one example of an issue I *did* know about, so I suspect its entirely likely there are myriad others we don't know about. For those who never worked there, there's a fairly complex "maze" of back-tunnels, shipping entrances, storage areas that interconnect essentially every storefront in the mall, and there's no telling what kinds of physical plant issues may be present there, eg electrical, plumbing, heck, maybe even termites for all I know

Back when Crossroads was still commercially viable, I always thought they were kinda neglecting it structurally, with barely more than a few coats of paint or entirely cosmetic fixups over a span of years, and I think we're finding out now that the place just how serious that neglect was. That's an absolute shame. The neglect may not have hurt Crossroads in the following years in terms of the broader economic picture ongoing during that time, but it surely didn't help.

When we redid Midland Park Mall the fountains were already gone, part of our renovation was ripping all of the fountain remnants and planters because they ate up so much space that could be used for revenue generating kiosks or advertising (car displays). Simon did develop that mall back in 1979 and the fountains and fixed planters were popular at that time but over the years they were maintenance nightmares and I think they kept it in pretty good shape maintenance wise over the years. Since Crossroads changed owners so many times I do think that the maintenance was probably neglected.

[Plutonic Panda]

https://freepressokc.com/what-happened-plaza-mayor/

[Canoe]

https://freepressokc.com/what-happened-plaza-mayor/

Panda, thank you for sharing this article. It answered alot of questions I had about the project.

[stile99]

I'll admit maybe it's because I'm reading it with this bias in my mind, but I always got the impression that the owners wanted this to BE a cultural center, but never wanted to put the work into MAKING it a cultural center. This article just further reinforces this belief, they brought in some people who did realize the work it would take, and have had success in doing so in other places, and then just ignored the very people who would have made it happen.

[warreng88]

At a crossroads: Owners put Plaza Mayor up for sale

By: Molly M. Fleming The Journal Record February 8, 2018

OKLAHOMA CITY – Plaza Mayor is for sale, again. But its next life likely won’t be as a retail center.

The property, previously known as Crossroads Mall, is owned by CRM Properties Group LLC. The company purchased it in 2011.

“We want someone to come to us with a plan,” said Roddy Bates, with Raptor Properties. Raptor has been overseeing the redevelopment of the mall.

“We have a lot of heart and soul in the property,” Bates said. “We want to see it redeveloped in some form or fashion. We are not just trying to sell it to the highest bidder.”

The Price Edwards retail investment team is representing CRM in the sale. Broker Paul Ravencraft worked with Bates to buy the property originally. Retail investment brokers Phillip Mazaheri and George Williams are working on the sale this time as well.

The property is listed for $8.27 million, which includes the mall building and 63.31 acres.

But there could be multiple new owners. The property can be sold in a minimum of 10-acre tracts.

“We feel like the acreage of the land that’s just sitting on the interstate is just valuable as land itself, whether it’s with the building or not,” Bates said.

The entire mall isn’t for sale, as it’s owned by three entities. CRM Properties Group owns the west side of the property, the southern anchor space, and the center’s entire middle section. The company’s part totals more than 800,000 square feet.

Maryland-based Crossroads QALICB LLC owns the space that was home to Montgomery Ward, but it is now occupied by Santa Fe South High School. The charter school started classes there in August 2017. The second floor is being renovated for KIPP South Community Preparatory School.

The northern anchor space for what was formerly Crossroads Mall is owned by DLH Properties LLC. The Hudiburg Auto Group has a parts department at the building.

With a school and auto-parts warehouse on the property, the ownership wants the next owner to be sensitive to those two different users.

Ravencraft reiterated on how valuable the land could be to a development, with Interstate 35 and Interstate 240 creating the property’s perimeter.

He and Bates said the mall will likely not be used for retailers.

“I don’t think retail is where this deal goes,” Ravencraft said. “It’s zoned industrial. But it could also be used as a school hub or government offices.”

South Oklahoma City Chamber of Commerce President Elaine Lyons said there is a need in the city’s south sector for office space. She said there’s also been talk of turning the empty space into an educational center. Bates said the former anchor retailer spaces could become schools, and the interior space could be businesses that support the staff and students.

Lyons said the South Chamber was supportive of Raptor when it attempted to turn the mall into a Hispanic retail center. The chamber gathered area business leaders and visited the former Fort Worth mall that’s now a Hispanic retail center. It’s anchored by a Fiesta grocery store.

She said the chamber wants to see the property stabilized.

“You don’t want it to become an eyesore,” she said. “It’s obviously visible. The high school students there need to be in a good environment, and you don’t want that area to deteriorate around them.”

Ravencraft said the retail investment team plans to work with Price Edwards’ office investment brokers and the industrial investment brokers to find suitable buyers.

“It’s not going to be retail,” Bates said. “It has to be something different in today’s market.”

[SoonerDave]

I'll admit maybe it's because I'm reading it with this bias in my mind, but I always got the impression that the owners wanted this to BE a cultural center, but never wanted to put the work into MAKING it a cultural center. This article just further reinforces this belief, they brought in some people who did realize the work it would take, and have had success in doing so in other places, and then just ignored the very people who would have made it happen.

I think it was a lot simpler than that: When they got into the nitty-gritty details of getting those "incubator" businesses started, they discovered that the number of such potential businesses was nowhere *near* what they expected. They tried mightily, in my view, because no small amount of money was spent modifying the old Dillard's space to facilitate the open-air market/bazaar concept where the incubator business were supposed to start. They carved out a monstrous chunk of the floor between levels 1 and 2 and had cleared out the rest of the space in a manner I interpreted to be in expectation for growth - growth that just never happened.

What I saw the last few times I went to the place just before it closed was that a few businesses had grown out of incubator status, and a few were now occupying larger, more conventional retail spaces, but the overwhelming chunk of the mall was still vacant with remnants of past tenants, incomplete construction, and general debris within.

I may be completely wrong, but I think they really wanted and tried to apply the incubator concept. They just vastly overestimated how much fuel there was to start the engine - but once they realized that, it was too late.

[jn1780]

I just think the incubator concept is outdated. If your trying to get a new business off the ground, the cheapest way to do that is online retail and social media marketing. A physical space needs to be super cheap if that's the route you want to go.

[kukblue1]

Perfect spot for a MLS stadium outdoor concert venue. The Zoo is ok but I think OKC could do much better in the outdoor concert space.

[JRod1980]

Always thought this would have been great for an indoor amusement & water park/mall/aquarium similar to the Mall of America. Plenty of space for nicer hotels in surrounding land. It would draw from all over the place and bring in tons of money to South OKC.

[OkiePoke]

There are plans to hold some autocross events here organized by some local car clubs.

[hoya]

Always thought this would have been great for an indoor amusement & water park/mall/aquarium similar to the Mall of America. Plenty of space for nicer hotels in surrounding land. It would draw from all over the place and bring in tons of money to South OKC.

At this point, it would be a great place to hold The Running Man.

[baralheia]

Considering that - if the forthcoming Regional Transit Authority is able to get off the ground - there is a tentative stop for this area on the planned Edmond-Norman commuter rail line, the highest and best use for this property would likely be a large-scale mixed-use development.

[Ginkasa]

The AMC Crossroads 16 has permanently closed according to the AMC website.

[jn1780]

It lasted longer than I thought it would.

[jdg78]

It lasted 20+ years with zero economic development support around it. Moore sucked every last drop out of crossroads which they will soon regret with the crappy development on 19th st. Let’s not forget that Moore was willing to work with the Warren regarding incentives when OKC said no. I can only imagine what could have been had OKC proactively supported Crossroads like Quail Springs (Von More) and other incentives as well as Penn Square. They let Crossroads die and compound that with no political pressure to influence ODOT to improve infrastructure at I240 and I35. How many decades are they going to punt improvements while we improve every other area thoroughfare in the metro? The interchange project should've been completed a decade ago? How about improvements along 240? Comparing that stretch to Memorial, Kirkpatrick, Broadway extension and I35/I44 interchange is a joke. Wonder why one specific area has choked off and died and the others have experienced exponential growth and development???

Listen social warriors who champion in other parts of the city fighting overt discrimination. What say you about South OKC? Hypocrites!!!

Just like the jail in OK County landing in the farthest south point of OK county. Sre you kidding me there was no other viable location north of the river???? It’s all political will and influence. Complete joke and WAke THe F up HYPOCRITES!

[bombermwc]

As someone living in Moore, i'd be interested how you came to the conclusion that 19th street is crappy? It's been an economic absolute BOOM for Moore. And most of that is stuff that would never have been in Crossroads and I certainly wouldn't have go to Crossroads for it f there was an alternative.

I think your opinions are flavored with not much fact, but a lot of passion.

Crossroads failed as a matter of trends in how people shop. It failed like a MASSIVE number of malls in the US have.

[Zuplar]

It lasted 20+ years with zero economic development support around it. Moore sucked every last drop out of crossroads which they will soon regret with the crappy development on 19th st. Let’s not forget that Moore was willing to work with the Warren regarding incentives when OKC said no. I can only imagine what could have been had OKC proactively supported Crossroads like Quail Springs (Von More) and other incentives as well as Penn Square. They let Crossroads die and compound that with no political pressure to influence ODOT to improve infrastructure at I240 and I35. How many decades are they going to punt improvements while we improve every other area thoroughfare in the metro? The interchange project should've been completed a decade ago? How about improvements along 240? Comparing that stretch to Memorial, Kirkpatrick, Broadway extension and I35/I44 interchange is a joke. Wonder why one specific area has choked off and died and the others have experienced exponential growth and development???

Listen social warriors who champion in other parts of the city fighting overt discrimination. What say you about South OKC? Hypocrites!!!

Just like the jail in OK County landing in the farthest south point of OK county. Sre you kidding me there was no other viable location north of the river???? It’s all political will and influence. Complete joke and WAke THe F up HYPOCRITES!

As a southsider I feel your pain. This jail debacle is crap.

[Colbafone]

As someone living in Moore, i'd be interested how you came to the conclusion that 19th street is crappy? It's been an economic absolute BOOM for Moore. And most of that is stuff that would never have been in Crossroads and I certainly wouldn't have go to Crossroads for it f there was an alternative.

I think your opinions are flavored with not much fact, but a lot of passion.

Crossroads failed as a matter of trends in how people shop. It failed like a MASSIVE number of malls in the US have.

Economically, 19th might be successful.

But I'm not kidding when I say it might be the absolute WORST stretch of street to navigate in the entire metro. It makes May (from Mayfair up to Memorial Road) look like friggin 23rd Street east of I-35. I absolutely HATE 19th street.

[jn1780]

It lasted 20+ years with zero economic development support around it. Moore sucked every last drop out of crossroads which they will soon regret with the crappy development on 19th st. Let’s not forget that Moore was willing to work with the Warren regarding incentives when OKC said no. I can only imagine what could have been had OKC proactively supported Crossroads like Quail Springs (Von More) and other incentives as well as Penn Square. They let Crossroads die and compound that with no political pressure to influence ODOT to improve infrastructure at I240 and I35. How many decades are they going to punt improvements while we improve every other area thoroughfare in the metro? The interchange project should've been completed a decade ago? How about improvements along 240? Comparing that stretch to Memorial, Kirkpatrick, Broadway extension and I35/I44 interchange is a joke. Wonder why one specific area has choked off and died and the others have experienced exponential growth and development???

Listen social warriors who champion in other parts of the city fighting overt discrimination. What say you about South OKC? Hypocrites!!!

Just like the jail in OK County landing in the farthest south point of OK county. Sre you kidding me there was no other viable location north of the river???? It’s all political will and influence. Complete joke and WAke THe F up HYPOCRITES!

Quail Springs isn't really doing that great these days when compared to Penn Square.

[jdg78]

I live in far sw okc and went to Moore schools. Im in area frequently but choose to spend my tax dollars in OKC. Inquire with Ms. Embrey the economic development point person for city of Moore and educate yourself on the massive incentives provided by the city to develop that area. They were desperate to build a sales tax base and provided big incentives to create what is now there. It is a massively ill planned area. Also, ever wonder why there is only one non fast casual or fast food restaurant in Fritz Farms????? Perhaps they enticed Chilli’s by including a provision that another sit down restaurant is located there. Massive missed opportunity. The rest of that area is cookie cutter.

[BoulderSooner]

As someone living in Moore, i'd be interested how you came to the conclusion that 19th street is crappy? I.

do the words "Suburbia Hell " mean anything to you ..

[jn1780]

do the words "Suburbia Hell " mean anything to you ..

Yeah, I don't think Moore is any different from Yukon or North OKC/Edmond area. That's just where a lot of people of families move to.

[BoulderSooner]

Yeah, I don't think Moore is any different from Yukon or North OKC/Edmond area. That's just where a lot of people of families move to.

19th street Absolutely is different

[Plutonic Panda]

do the words "Suburbia Hell " mean anything to you ..

Do the words street widening mean anything to you? This street should be 3-4 lanes each way.