Wheeler District

[Plutonic Panda]

There are a few in Edmond these days. Less dense, but similar.

With commercial? They were trying “retrofit” Coffee Creek subdivision in a sense and integrate commercial but unfortunately that project was killed by local opposition, of course.

[dankrutka]

What is the end game with this mentality?

It's actually pretty simple. Actually engage and form relationships with people in the neighborhood. Respect community leaders who have long cared about the area. Work with them to determine goals for the area that benefit everyone. All this requires is effort and an interest in equity. A primary tenet of gentrification is to do whatever you can to get your vision achieved without compromise.

[Plutonic Panda]

It's actually pretty simple. Actually engage and form relationships with people in the neighborhood. Respect community leaders who have long cared about the area. Work with them to determine goals for the area that benefit everyone. All this requires is effort and an interest in equity. A primary tenet of gentrification is to do whatever you can to get your vision achieved without compromise.

I’m trying to understand what the compromise is though. Why should someone going through the proper zoning and building procedures need to compromise with a very small percentage of people nearby. But again, what is the compromise? I follow development in LA very closely and the building next to me in Hollywood is being “gentrified.”

The developer is required to make a certain number of the units affordable and give proper compensation to anyone living that needs to find a new place to live. I have a friend who is among around 4 people that have refused to leave. It doesn’t seem like developers get to do whatever they want.

[GoGators]

This has nothing do with people in suburbs being jealous. Lol

Im not saying people are jealous at all, I’m just saying it’s so bizarre for a lot of people they don’t understand it and it causes an immediate visceral reaction of dozens of “this is so f*** stupid” “I can’t believe people would be dumb enough to buy this in the ghetto” “Who would do this” type of reaction. I mean from the comments, some people are mad enough to go down to wheeler and start punching the buildings. Just from a couple of posted Ariel photos. It’s triggering some type of emotion.

[dankrutka]

I’m trying to understand what the compromise is though. Why should someone going through the proper zoning and building procedures need to compromise with a very small percentage of people nearby. But again, what is the compromise? I follow development in LA very closely and the building next to me in Hollywood is being “gentrified.”

The developer is required to make a certain number of the units affordable and give proper compensation to anyone living that needs to find a new place to live. I have a friend who is among around 4 people that have refused to leave. It doesn’t seem like developers get to do whatever they want.

See last post.

[Richard at Remax]

My only beef, which is well documented in this thread, is the MASSIVE amount of tax breaks this project received to build housing that the vast majority of people cannot afford.

[Swake]

What is the end game with this mentality? How does an area get nicer? Are we just going to give free money to disadvantage people so they can live in the same type of lifestyle those who have money(many who work their asses off for) are able to live? Are we just going to let these areas rot and decay? Gentrification, when the factor of race is removed, is literally a person going in and restoring a build to its former glory. Well, it’s really when a bunch of buildings are remodeled. Yes the rent is raised because new money is invested and the world isn’t a charity case.

But again, what should happen?

This might make more sense without the $120 million in public money (welfare) given to this project.

[Plutonic Panda]

Im not saying people are jealous at all, I’m just saying it’s so bizarre for a lot of people they don’t understand it and it causes an immediate visceral reaction of dozens of “this is so f*** stupid” “I can’t believe people would be dumb enough to buy this in the ghetto” “Who would do this” type of reaction. I mean from the comments, some people are mad enough to go down to wheeler and start punching the buildings. Just from a couple of posted Ariel photos. It’s triggering some type of emotion.

Oh I see well then I agree with you

[BoulderSooner]

This might make more sense without the $120 million in public money (welfare) given to this project.

what public money??

[LocoAko]

There are, I think, valid questions and concerns about gentrification, why they're getting a new school when the city just shuttered a number of neighborhood schools, the lack of connectivity with surrounding neighborhoods, etc.

I am much more thrown off by the criticism of its density (its strongest suit), the design of the homes (including a thorough analysis of the side windows of a single home), and sarcastic hyperbolic comparisons of it to Jonestown and being an expensive neighborhood in a field (has anyone checked on every single outlying development in OKC???). It's been vicious and seemingly a contest of who could criticize the development in the harshest terms.

None of these are new issues or discussions to be had and yet Twitter just absolutely blew up yesterday over all of this. It's like everyone just learned of Wheeler yesterday. Bizarre.

[SouthSide]

In my opinion, a lot of the hate for this project stems from its location - southside. Every place I have ever worked in north okc i have had to endure repeated comments about how ghetto, dangerous, etc. south okc. Go on to any social media where people are asking about where to move in okc and the response is always avoid south okc. I don't have a problem with the school. Only one school was closed in south okc since most of them are overcrowded!

[David]

I am much more thrown off by the criticism of its density (its strongest suit), the design of the homes (including a thorough analysis of the side windows of a single home), and sarcastic hyperbolic comparisons of it to Jonestown and being an expensive neighborhood in a field (has anyone checked on every single outlying development in OKC???). It's been vicious and seemingly a contest of who could criticize the development in the harshest terms.

None of these are new issues or discussions to be had and yet Twitter just absolutely blew up yesterday over all of this. It's like everyone just learned of Wheeler yesterday. Bizarre.

This is what was getting to me yesterday, I think.

[AP]

My disdain has nothing to do with location or density. It's all execution.

I've been here from the beginning and was actually the very first to post anything about the "Wheeler District."

Does this have something to do with the Downtown Airpark?

http://wheelerdistrict.com/

We all talked about how awesome this development would be because of the potential for affordable urban housing.

Great article. I am excited for Blair Humphreys. This is the project he was probably born to do. Fwiw, the MAPS 3 streetcar makes it down to the planned maintenance facility at the new I-40 and Walker. It won't take much effort to connect the Wheeler District, the river area, and Capitol Hill into the system. I am excited. It is really hard to find a reasonably priced house in Gatewood, Mesta, or the like. At least one that isn't already renovated and energy efficient. This is a real opportunity to build all types of new housing at all different types of price points dead center in the middle of OKC.

There have always been concerns about it detracting from the area.

Don't take this the wrong way, as I want it to happen, but curious, will this detract from, or contribute to the rise of Capitol Hill? If this happened semi-organically following a master plan, I think Capitol Hill would gain and benefit. However, if there is any sort of competition for city dollars, I fear Capitol Hill might suffer...

Then we saw these beautiful designs come out of the charette, which obviously was just filler, but got everyone really excited.

These are from Will. Snaps of the presentation of the drafts formed from the charette:

I was also very on board at that point.

I am so in love with this development.

Here Chad also mentions the mixed-income and affordability of the housing options.

Actually the timeline (10 years to substantial completion) is not that different from a suburban housing addition. People are missing that - while they will be building homes and commercial themselves too - they are inviting other homebuilders in to build within the framework and design guidelines of the district. This is no different that dozens of developments in places like Edmond or Norman (or wherever); it is just more carefully-planned and focused on the pedestrian environment.

There were MULTIPLE homebuilders (and commercial developers) in attendance at the charettes, and they already have strong interest from them. This wasn't just a bunch of potential residents and community do-gooders participating.

People are also missing that this involves a wide range of housing product, not just luxury homes and not just large multi-family, both of which are most likely to be affected by the market. This development includes tons of modest product. What is perhaps most staggering in fact is the variety of lifestyles it will address.

Naysay all you want. This development is moving forward, and while it may not (even certainly will not) look exactly like what came out of the charettes (they are just now taking the charette conceptuals to their respective shops for final planning documents) the finished product will be anything but watered down.

What we talked about back then and what has been delivered to this point are very different things. Which is fine. They are a private company and allowed to do what they want. Doesn't mean they haven't delivered to this point. There is not a house in that development listed <$230/sqft.

[LakeEffect]

This is what was getting to me yesterday, I think.

Yep.

I didn't see the comment myself, but apparently someone even said the people working on it should "hang themselves." To make a comment like that over development is insane.

[AP]

Yep.

I didn't see the comment myself, but apparently someone even said the people working on it should "hang themselves." To make a comment like that over development is insane.

Agree that there were several comments that were totally out of line. But for everyone here to just dismiss legitimate criticism of the development as trolls and jealous suburbanites is not a good look.

[David]

Yep.

I didn't see the comment myself, but apparently someone even said the people working on it should "hang themselves." To make a comment like that over development is insane.

Yep, I saw that one.

[BoulderSooner]

My disdain has nothing to do with location or density. It's all execution.

I've been here from the beginning and was actually the very first to post anything about the "Wheeler District."



We all talked about how awesome this development would be because of the potential for affordable urban housing.



There have always been concerns about it detracting from the area.



Then we saw these beautiful designs come out of the charette, which obviously was just filler, but got everyone really excited.



I was also very on board at that point.



Here Chad also mentions the mixed-income and affordability of the housing options.



What we talked about back then and what has been delivered to this point are very different things. Which is fine. They are a private company and allowed to do what they want. Doesn't mean they haven't delivered to this point. There is not a house in that development listed <$230/sqft.

seems like they are following their plan

[LocoAko]

Agree that there were several comments that were totally out of line. But for everyone here to just dismiss legitimate criticism of the development as trolls and jealous suburbanites is not a good look.

FWIW I agree that some of the criticism is warranted and your revival of older posts promising a range of affordable housing is dismaying given what we now see happening. My main discomfort (if you can call it that) was the groundswell and fever pitch it suddenly reached on social media yesterday after construction has been ongoing for months. That kind of led to the perception of a group of people just trying to one-up each other with critical hot takes.

[SuburbanNation]

Wheeler District a 15-20 year development built out in multiple phases. The first residents only moved in 18 months ago. This is only Phase 1. The argument that Wheeler doesn't have affordable product is absolutely false. Take a look at 46 of 60 total sales in phase 1 (so far) based on county assessor records:

26% of the homes sold (12) were between $148,000 and $250,000----- based on today's rate of 3% on a 30 year mortgage with minium 10% down- The P&I payment would be between $600/month - $950 per month

28% of homes sold (13) were between $300,000 and $370,000---- based on today's rate of 3% on a 30 year mortgage with minium 10% down- The P&I payment would be between $1140/month - $1400 per month

Looking at current available product on the Wheeler Website, 7 homes are available under $320,000 and 5 homes are under $430,000.


It's comical that people make blank statements without doing any research. This is a HUGE development and already has had outstanding success. The residents of OKC should be proud of this. This area was nothing but an abandoned airfield with overgrown grass just 24 months ago. People don't understand how difficult this type of development is to pull off. Kudos to the Wheeler team to push forward in the face of diversity. With great risk comes great reward. I believe we will look back many years down the road and see the Wheeler District as one of the greatest developments in the US. Having 150 acres of undeveloped land within 1 mile of the CBD is unheard of. Wheeler Phase 1 has been a huge success.

[Richard at Remax]

Can you post the Sold data of the homes that didn't make the MLS?

Here are the lifetime MLS numbers

[SuburbanNation]

Yes, it appears that very few homes sold within Wheeler ever hit the MLS, Zillow, or any other other marketing site. A quick Oklahoma county record search shows that all of the homes on Pedaler's Lane sold for under $250,000 and 13 homes on Runway BLVD sold under $370,000.

[Richard at Remax]

Very true. 6 of the 60 sold so far have been under $200K. Only 2 have sold since May 2019 under $250K. 1004 PEDALERS LN Is one of those, which is already on it's 2nd owner after selling for $195,5K in May 2019 and sold again for $215K in August 2020. The other being 932 PEDALERS LN for $169K for 671 sq ft(!).

I guess the point I am trying to make is all the "affordable" ones are long gone and it's only big prices from now on. The cheapest one I see being offered now is $299K on the website. I'm all for them making money trust me and I think it will be a success. That being said you are going to have to open your wallet moving forward.

[AP]

Yes, it appears that very few homes sold within Wheeler ever hit the MLS, Zillow, or any other other marketing site. A quick Oklahoma county record search shows that all of the homes on Pedaler's Lane sold for under $250,000 and 13 homes on Runway BLVD sold under $370,000.

It is good to know and informs the discussion that you believe a $370K house is considered affordable. I'm not being facetious at all. Maybe I genuinely have an outdated view of what is considered affordable in OKC.

[SuburbanNation]

Is your statement, "That being said you are going to have to open your wallet moving forward." based on any factual information or simply conjecture? Phase 2 is currently under construction. Will you please share information that backs up your claim that there will be no affordable product moving forward? 54% of the homes sold so far in Phase 1 were under $370,000. I don't see any reason why the Wheeler team isn't intelligent enough to know that the market demand is for all different types of products at different price points. From what I can tell, the 10-15 3 story shop homes that recently sold out and are currently under construction were all under $350,000 as well.

[SuburbanNation]

$150,000-$350,000 house prices for brand new high-end construction in the downtown OKC Urban core is extremely competitive pricing. Less monthly outlay than downtown 2 or 3 bedroom apartment rental pricing. Not to mention these homes are all geothermal HVAC, metal roofs (4-5 times the price of a traditional asphalt roof), high-end interior finishes, etc. Take a look at the standard features on the Wheeler website. A very impressive list that very few new home builders match as a standard offering.