HUGE NEWS! Clay Bennett & Co. buy Supersonics!

[Kerry]

Don't believe everything you read on a web site. Follow the money. The people of Seattle won't even pay $5 per game to watch the Sonics. Don't expect Seattle companys to jump on the band wagon with the tax on hotels and rental cars. Many of the people who stay in Seattle hotels and rent cars are there on business. The "visitors" get reimbursed for spending that money which mean local companies like Boeing, Amazon, Microsoft have to pick up those costs.

Somehow people read the funding plan on the web site and they think the money just appears like magic. I especially like the part that claims the funding mechanism are already in place so the people should support it. Big deal, there is already an income tax mechanism in place - it doesn't make me want to pay more income tax.

This web site is just part of the Bennett plan. Atleast he can tell the NBA Directors in May that he did everything he could.

BTW - that areana would look cool in downtown OKC and would make a nice addition to MAPS4 in 7 years

[dcsooner]

Kerry, again I wish I could get excited about the prospects of a Seattle relocation, however, at this time, my gut tells me not to. Way too much money in the region to count the stadium deal out

[mranderson]

It's amazing how guillible we have become. I want a team as much as anyone but to believe Seattle will not fund a new stadium is setting yourselves up for a big disappointment. These minor setbacks early in this process are not indicative of failure, Bennett has gotten alot further than previous owners in a very short period of time and he will get this stadium funded. OKC I believe will get an NBA franchise, however, I'm not kidding myself no matter what one or two natives post to this board.

It seems to me that the people who LIVE in Seattle should know what they are saying. Afterall, they have voted there, know the trends, and most of all, know the people.

[Easy180]

Seven out of 10 Washington voters turn thumbs down to spending public money on pro sports facilities,

The Elway Poll, published Friday by independent pollster Stuart Elway, also showed support for simple-majority approval of school levies and backing for paid family medical leave.

The telephone poll was conducted among 405 registered voters Feb. 8-12, with a margin of error of plus or minus 5 percentage points.

Some highlights:


SPORTS ARENAS. Lawmakers are considering plans for partial public financing for sports venues for NASCAR, the Seattle Sonics, minor league baseball teams and a rodeo and equestrian center. Asked a general question about whether pro sports owners should pay for their own facilities without taxpayer subsidies, 71 percent agreed, while 23 percent called subsidies a good investment.

About 77 percent opposed use of public dollars for major sports facilities such as the Sonics' Renton proposal. Public financing for a NASCAR racetrack was opposed by 79 percent.

[Kerry]

There you have it - the people of Seattle love their taxes, but only if it goes to the "poor".

[PUGalicious]

There you have it - the people of Seattle love their taxes, but only if it goes to the "poor".

Good for them!

[Bobby H]

The idea of making taxpayers foot the bill to construct a professional sports stadium makes about as much sense as forcing taxpayers to pay the construction cost of movie theaters, bars, dance clubs or any other private entertainment business venue.

Basically, the taxpayer bailout operates as a huge government subsidy. It's fairly certain that many of the sports franchise owners who demand these giant sums of money from taxpayers are the same kind of guys who gripe about any sort of "socialism" while playing golf on courses with green fees of better than $1000 a pop. Aren't government subsidies a big part of socialism? Doesn't that make these venues "socialized arenas?"

One of the chief reasons why 77% of taxpayers in that poll say "no," is many of them know the high costs of attending a professional sports event.

$5 ticket? Yeah, sure. And that's watching the game in the back row nearly at the roof top. Want something closer to court side, get out your wallet. Better yet...bend over.

The taxpayers are also put off a great deal by all the conspicuous consumption going on in professional sports. They see how much the athletes are getting paid in salaries and endorsements along with how much the owners are raking in via TV revenue and other sources. Athletes are constantly making headlines from acts of violence and drug abuse.

I don't think regular people would care so much about high ticket prices, bad athlete behavior and all sorts of other controversies surrounding professional sports if they, the taxpayers, weren't made to put in a big stake into the operation with their tax dollars. IMHO, if no tax dollars went into funding a stadium, let the team owner charge whatever he wants.

Putting it another way: the government didn't pay for the building where I work, why should it pay for a building where some professional jock works either? Professional sports is a private entertainment business. I don't think any of it anywhere ought to be supported with tax dollars. It should be 100% privatized.

BTW - that areana would look cool in downtown OKC and would make a nice addition to MAPS4 in 7 years

The Ford Center is still a brand new facility. There is no need at all to build another arena that size in downtown OKC anytime soon.

[Saberman]

The problem is that you have to look at this as a business arrangement.

When a large concern like an NBA team, or any other pro team, come into an area they tend to generate allot of money outside the team. Jobs from venders, suppliers, plumbers, carpenters, etc. All of the things add to the tax paying base of the community. Not to mention, all the jobs and commerce outside the arena, transportation, hotel, it could even be a factor of some groups bring their convention or meeting here because we have a team.

It's like a ripple in a pond.

Bottom line is that any large venture such as this brings many new assets to the community.

So, I can understand why a team owner might ask the community to invest itself in the venture. The team gets a facility that it can use, and pay rent, and the community has a venue for events that can bring even more to the area.

Even some smaller business ventures get incentives from the State, and the City.
As a city, we actively go out and offer deals to large businesses to locate in OKC.
That isn't always fair to smaller businesses, of which I'm one, and doesn't always seem fair, but I know that when a large business comes into OKC, it will help my business in the long run. New people, business travelers, tourist, and new businesses.

As a City and community we are all inter-connected, we rely on each other in more ways then we might think, And that is why OKC is so great, we are willing to discuss the possibilities and invest in our city.

[CCOKC]

An arena is much more than a place for a sports team to play their games. If you are relying on a tenant that plays 41 regular season games and 2-3 pre-season games it does not make sense. Look at the month of March for example. The Ford center was idle for only 8 days. And the Cox Center held a concert on one of those days. This is an investment in our city. Do we want big concerts? Big XII and NCAA events Bullnanza, rodeos etc? How many acts came to town after the Ford Center was built that had not been here before? How many times do we have to drive to Dallas to see an act now that the FC is here. If this is a priority then we have to pay for this luxury. If it is not (as the people of Seattle are apparently saying) then don't pay for it. And don't be fooled that the FC will last 20 years. The updates will be needed whether we have a NBA team or not.

[mranderson]

"The idea of making taxpayers foot the bill to construct a professional sports stadium makes about as much sense as forcing taxpayers to pay the construction cost of movie theaters, bars, dance clubs or any other private entertainment business venue."

If you expect every sports team to actually OWN the arena or stadium (depending on what the sport plays in), and that team leaves the city, then what do you do with an empty building? The city would not be allowed to accept leases because they do not own it.

No. Government bodies must own the venue to keep it alive.

[HOT ROD]

Hey, my 1000 post!!1

Anyways, I appreciate the cautious approach taken by a few on the forum. It is true that it is best not to count your chickens before the eggs hatch.

However, Oklahoma City is in a different position - say instead of :JUST having a nest to lay our eggs (IE FORD CENTRE), we have an incubator - in that an OKC businessman (and consortium) has purchased a failing NBA team that over 3/4 of its existing community does not desire to have.

I am a Seattle area resident and I have discussed this with many coharts and this has been the focus much on the media here. In ALL honesty, MOST people here do not care about the SONICS enough to support this "tax extension". Further, most do not support the building of the "most expensive arena in American History" in the POOR southern suburb of Seattle - Renton, WA.

I had a discussion about this yesterday - and clearly OKC is the biggest winner here. Wanna know why?

Shin is the true idiot - he had OKC all to himself and was making bank for two years now. Bennett approached Shin about purchasing the team so it could be permanently located in the city, he even offered to give Shin minority holding so he could still see some of the profit. Shin refused, because AT THAT TIME - he was holding a "carat" over OKC and N.O. and the NBA and everyone else was eating his BS Katrina story out of his hands. As long as he owns the Hornets - he can cry to the NBA that he won't be successful in NO and that OKC is a money pot and everybody would keep letting him split the franchise.

AND LOW AND BEHOLD - BENNETT PURCHASES THE SEATTLE SONICS. ... This is the END OF SHIN IN OKC, because surely OKC would make Bennett an offer instead of giving SHIN the arena rent free. Shin realized that Bennett beat him and dropped his "pursuit" to avoid returning to N.O. He LOST the prize - surely Bennett WILL move the SONICS TO OKC.

The number one rule in business - is to maximize your marginal revenue when your marginal cost is equivalent. In other words, he should have sold the Hornets or at least majority interest to Bennett - then Bennett could have fought to keep the Hornets in OKC, since HE is an Oklahoma Citian and NOW owns the team. Shin could have just hung on for the ride and got filthy rich.

But now, Shin has to tuck his tail between his legs and be forced to lose all of his OKC cash by returning "home" to New Orleans. Everyone knows this and knew it would happen, its just too bad for Shin and die hard OKC Hornets fans that Shin is NOT a businessman and LET A PRO-MASTER BUSINESSMAN in Bennett "beat his a** to the prize".

Bennett can now play two markets - he can't lose. If Seattle bites - he gets filthy rich. If Seattle doesn't, he moves the teams HOME and gets richer.

And, given the POLITICS up here - and the fact that in 3 weeks the legislative session will be over, the SONICS ARE AS GOOD AS GONE - everybody knows it. This is why no one is going to the games anymore, aside from die hard SONICS fans.

As for the comments that there's too much $$ here not to build the arena - well you may not know that Seattle is a VERY conservative place when it comes to fiscal spending. We dont even have a light rail or transit system yet (although we do have a 14 mile train to the airport from downtown u/c at a cost of over $2B and overbudget!!!). We have crumbling infrastructure here that will cost taxpayers BILLIONS!!! to fix. We have a "second rate" pre and secondary education system that needs funding. Yet we have some of the richest people in the world live in our metro.

You tell me what needs to be addressed? A $560M arena in of all places, RENTON for the losing has been SONICS or the issues I spoke of above.

Also, you should understand that this is THE FIRST TIME in history that the SONICS are not locally owned!!! Past owners (Seattle and area residents/corporations) tried and FAILED to get a new arena built in downtown Seattle. The SONICS lose MILLIONS playing here - since there are no luxury suites available in the NBA's smallest (but one of the most expensive due to upgrades/corruption) arena - KEY ARENA (aka Seattle Center Coluseum). If those PAST LOCAL OWNERS could not get an arena built or the coluseum/key arena re-upgraded... how the HECK do you think Bennett will be with an arena proposal more than DOUBLE!!! what past owner Howard Schults (CEO of Starbucks) asked for and was denied??????

While it may be SAFE for OKC not to get too excited until 3 weeks from now - I think there should be some hidden enthusiasm in the populous ready to support your new teams AND there should be some hidden deal-making so that a "smooth" transition could be QUICKLY made in case it is necessary.

We (on this forum) have mentioned - that Bennett has done his due diligence - there is NO WAY the NBA wants to drop its BRAND by allowing two losing franchises. N.O. Hornets will be a losing franchise in N.O. They were successful for the last 2 years ONLY because of OKC. And given that OKC has shown that it could assemble support for a major league team very quickly - Bennett could ask for relocation by March 2008 and lose tons of cash in 2007 OR he could ask for an emergency hearing with the NBA board AFTER his bill dies in the WA legislature in 3 weeks - because if that doesn't get WA approval, there is NO WAY his arena will get built here plain and simple.

Many of us on this forum think the latter will happen, so OKC needs to get ready - and quick!!!

[MikeLucky]

Do you think that the name should be the "Oklahoma City Sonics" or the "Oklahoma Sonics"?

I am thinking "Oklahoma Sonics" would mean the states NBA team, much like the Minnesota Timberwolves, Vikings and Twins.

This could be another marketing strategy.

Personally I hope they leave the Sonics name and branding in Seattle in case they decide they want a team back later.... And we can start new here in OKC with a new image that is our own..... make our own history.....

Look at the NFL...... How much better is it that we have the Baltimore Ravens instead of the Baltimore Browns and some other team in Cleveland.....

The idea of making taxpayers foot the bill to construct a professional sports stadium makes about as much sense as forcing taxpayers to pay the construction cost of movie theaters, bars, dance clubs or any other private entertainment business venue.

Show me the single privately owned movie theater, bar, dance club or any other private entertainment business venue that brings $40-$50 million dollars in fiscal growth to the city in any given year..... and I will agree with you.....

The city stands to gain unprecedented revenue, economy growth, and recognition because of the NBA..... it is absolutely appropriate for them (almost necessary) to not only be involved, but use their assets to create that growth and development in their city......

[Pete]

This is a pretty interesting perspective and one that is probably on the mark. I like the idea of converting the Cox Center to pure convention space and having the Ford Center as the back-arena -- that is, at some point down the road.

******************************
Ford Center could be too old for any NBA team to call home


By Berry Tramel
Staff Writer

The Seattle SuperSonics want a new arena, and if they don't get one, they almost surely will move to Oklahoma City.

And want a new arena.

That's right. The clock already ticks on the 5-year-old Ford Center.

Bank on it. Be it Clay Bennett's Sonics, or George Shinn's Hornets, or whatever franchise we might try to lure to town, new digs will be part of the demand. Bennett said this week the Ford Center is fine for the immediate future, but the city eventually will need a new building.

You want the NBA, Oklahoma City? This goes with the territory. Almost new isn't new enough, even for native sons like Bennett and his OKC pals, whose Sonics play the Hornets tonight.

The Ford Center is a decent coliseum, and at $89 million, it cost us a song.

If it burns down tonight — not that the shooting of the Sonics or Hornets are capable of lighting such a spark — we'll still have gotten our money out of the deal. The Hornets, the Big 12 Tournament, Paul McCartney. That's getting close to $89 million right there.

Oklahoma City mayor Mick Cornett calls the Ford Center middle-of-the-road among NBA homes, and that's probably fair.

But no way will that be sufficient in a year or 10, should the Sonics drive in soon.

Let's say the Sonics come in the next couple of seasons. They spend a year or two bartering over arena plans. Spend a two or three years in construction. Suddenly it's 2013, and the Ford Center is 11 years old. Seattle's KeyArena, the bane of the NBA's existence, was renovated to appease the Sonics 11 years ago.

If it builds a new arena, what would OKC do with the Ford Center?

Well, it could turn the Cox Center into straight convention space and use the Ford Center as the backup coliseum.

Or it could raze the Ford Center; like I said, by then we'd have long gotten our money out of it.

What's wrong with the Ford Center? It lacks many of the money-making streams of 21st-century arenas. Hospitality areas. Concourse amenities beyond the routine concessions. Club and restaurant.

Sounds scurrilous for a franchise to need such opulence, but that's the real NBA. That's how you meet payrolls that go north of $50 million, or even higher if you want to win.

Cornett declined to much discuss the Ford Center's status, figuring he might soon have to negotiate such topics with the Sonics.

Everyone admits some upgrades are in order, and a practice facility is a must for a franchise.

Assistant city manager Tom Anderson, who oversees city facilities, is a big defender of the Ford Center.

"It can serve Oklahoma City for many, many years to come,” Anderson said. "We've got the meat and potatoes. We're talking about the gravy now.

"Here's the bottom line. Can we improve the appearance of the concourses, the appearances of the bathrooms? Sure we can. But as it is now, when the Hornets tip off, or The Who hits that first note, nobody cares if there's terrazzo on the floor or marble in the bathrooms.”

The Ford Center is fine with the fans. It is not fine with NBA owners. In a market like Oklahoma City, every red-dirt cent that can be squeezed out of an arena must be, so that a franchise can compete with American metropolises.

Bennett's laying low these days, working to get a new arena in Seattle that would exalt his group's $350 million investment.

Bennett plans to be at the Ford Center tonight, wearing Sonic green and sitting in his baseline seats where he's cheered on Chris Paul for the better part of two seasons.

Bennett offers a couple of innocuous quotes on the ironic matchup tonight.

"We're doing all we can to be successful in Seattle.”

And "At some point in time, the NBA will be in Oklahoma City.”

When the NBA gets here, it will start talking about a new building. Get ready.

[Easy180]

Hope they do build a new one once an NBA team comes to town...Would be great to somehow have one of the top arena's in the league...Would help in trying to get free agents to take an honest look at coming to OKC w/o asking for a premium over other teams in more exciting cities

If we do land our first big time team we should shell out some big time money to celebrate our accomplishment...Having money for school's and social services is overrated anyway

[Easy180]

Link to another newsok story detailing the different sonic's scenarios

User Registration

[Flatlander]

Im all for a new building if a team comes to our fine city,I vote yes

[okclee]

Let Okc get a team first, and then worry about a new arena.

[venture]

Build a new arena on the river once I-40 is moved...but this time build a facility that will blow everyone away. A large mix of steal, brick and glass...with plenty of water features on and around the building. Also make it large enough to where hosting an NCAA regional or even a Final Four down the road would be possible - not that it would happen. Also move to get the AFL back in town to replace the A2 team here.

I agree with making the Cox Center a full fledge convention area. The Ford Center would then get some upgrades and then home to WNBA, Blazers, and other events.

A new arena would be a great anchor to help get development moving on the north banks of the river.

[ETL]

And this new arena will be built next to the merry-go-round right? lol No, seriously I like the idea of a new arena next to the river.

[mranderson]

Why should we build a new arena now? We have one that is less than five years old. A new arena now is one of the rare times I would vote no.

In 15 to 20 years, yes, however, the one we have now meets NBA requirements. Plus, the city has agreed to upgade it to the Sonics' requirements.

[PUGalicious]

Why should we build a new arena now? We have one that is less than five years old. A new arena now is one of the rare times I would vote no.

In 15 to 20 years, yes, however, the one we have now meets NBA requirements. Plus, the city has agreed to upgade it to the Sonics' requirements.

You obviously didn't read the link Easy180 left to explain why it's even being discussed.

[metro]

PUGalicious, don't worry, it's apart of mranderson's "Maps3" proposal in the right timing.

[Easy180]

More good news...Err...I mean bad news for the Sonics

Sonics arena funding bill may be doomed

Senate Democrats say they have the votes, but House isn't playing
By CHRIS McGANN
P-I CAPITOL CORRESPONDENT

OLYMPIA -- The Seattle Sonics probably have enough support in the Senate to advance legislation for a $300 million arena subsidy -- but opposition in the House may thwart a vote in either chamber.

"We have the votes to pass it in the Senate; the question is, should we take a tough vote only to see it die in the House?" said Sen. Erik Poulsen, D-West Seattle.

Poulsen supports the bill for a variety of reasons. Politically, he doesn't want Democrats to be blamed for losing one of the region's professional sports teams. Practically, he sees it as a relatively painless public subsidy.

"If we can save a pro sports franchise with 40 years of history in the Northwest without having to raise taxes, that seems like a pretty good deal," he said.

Senate Ways and Means Chairwoman Margarita Prentice, D-Renton, has been the team's biggest booster in Olympia. On Wednesday, she briefed her Democratic caucus on the legislation and the economic benefits of the proposed $500 million, multipurpose arena that would be built in Renton.

The Sonics' Oklahoma City-based ownership has said it may move the team out of state if taxpayers don't build the team a new home.

Senate Bill 5986 would allow King County to extend taxes on restaurant meals, rental cars and hotel rooms to help pay for the arena.

"I don't think it's over yet," said Sen. Brian Weinstein, D-Mercer Island. Weinstein favors the bill but said several Democrats were critical of the plan.

In the House, Speaker Frank Chopp has made it clear that his priorities are elsewhere and that if the Sonics want a new home, they're free to build it on their own dime.

Senate Majority Leader Lisa Brown, D-Spokane, said Chopp's opposition is an important factor in her decision whether to bring the bill up for a full Senate vote. Another is the level of support the Sonics have from Republicans

[y_h]

A large mix of steal, brick and glass...with plenty of water features on and around the building.

Freudian slip? I mean we are talking about a building meant to lure a relocated NBA team, right?

[Pete]

The House Speaker (Chopp) is very much against this bill and he has huge sway in that body.

I read that everything he has ever pubically opposed has failed.

The Senators know this and that's why they might not even bother with a vote.