The American Heartland Theme Park and Resort

[BDP]

So, to recap, the difference between what we know between Epic Universe and American Heartland= American Heartland will have roughly 250 more acres and an RV park for only $1 billion more.

From what I can find, the theme parks would be very similar in size, Epic at around 110 acres and Heartland at 125.

So far, the campground is by far the biggest part of this and schedule to be complete first.

There's just a lot of this that isn't very clear at this point. especially in terms of how much is going to spend on what.

[BDP]

FYI the land acquisition costs were $7 million or slightly more than that if you include other associated costs. They have around 1700 acres, given that there’s an in owned tract in the middle of their acreage leads me to believe they aren’t finished but time will tell if they spend more. Either way, a drop in the $2 Billion bucket but also not insignificant.

Thanks for the info.

In context of $2 billion, I think it's okay to call 7 million insignificant. lol

[BDP]

Universal has the big rides and big IP names

Which is very significant.

They are pitching this as "Americana themed". Most people live within a days drive of an amusement park that incorporates at least some sort of Americana themes. In fact, this one will be 135 miles from one that's pretty much all Americana themed, too.

Big rides will probably be the most important factor for it to draw beyond the region / driving distance. I don't think we know the scale or mix of rides it will have at this point.

[Urbanized]

^^^^^^
The YouTube video linked upthread has quite a bit of reasonable speculation on the rides, based upon a scale model presented at the kickoff media event.

The one issue I take with the YouTuber has to do with assumptions he is making regarding financing. He is apparently taking it at face value that, essentially, Bicknell will be writing a $2 billion check and self-financing everything. He is saying this based on the fact that at the media event they stated that they are not looking for investors. As I have (also) pointed out upthread, nobody has said that there aren't ALREADY other (more silent) investors. They also haven't said that there would be no financing involved. They've only just played it close to the vest.

I think that the guy (Bicknell) is quite possibly a billionaire with a "B." Again, he owned over 1,000 Pizza Huts and sold them just a few years ago. He owns media companies, entertainment companies, film and television production companies, and on and on. He is real.

That said, none of that means he is writing a check for all of this. And he has a proven ability to finance big things. He has also already clearly spent millions to get to this point on this park plan. I think he is quite serious about this development. And again, I think he/they may have enough horsepower. But the idea that he is personally writing a check for $2 billion is a bit silly on the surface. It's not something he will have to do if he doesn't want to.

[catch22]

I believe it to be true that most very wealthy people use other people's money for risks, and they pocket the profits. Aside from a few of the more "in-your-face" rich people like Musk, Bezos, etc. they keep their personal wealth by avoiding risk while reaping the profits. They will borrow money or get investors. I'm not saying he won't put any money towards it, but let's for argument's sake say he is worth $4 billion, would he risk 50% of his net wealth on this? If he was worth $2 billion would he risk 100%? doubtful. If he was worth 10 billion (doubtful) even gambling 20% of your net wealth on one single thing is insane.

The logic for me says he will take investors, financing or already has both. It doesn't work, the company files bankruptcy and he didn't just force himself to move into one of the RV lots on the site.

[PhiAlpha]

Thanks for the info.

In context of $2 billion, I think it's okay to call 7 million insignificant. lol

lol, it’s only significant in that it’s not a small sum of money in general and that it has been spent on land in an area intended for the park that’s not undergoing any kind of land speculation renaissance.

[Mr. Blue Sky]

Just an aside here, but using Heartland in the name is a home run. I hear more and more people on the coasts using that name. As in, “I’ve never been much off the west or east coast, but I’d really like to make a trip into the heartland. Smaller cities, slower way of life. I’d like to see all that.” I hear some variation on this theme a lot more than I used to.

[shavethewhales]

^^^^^^
...
I think that the guy (Bicknell) is quite possibly a billionaire with a "B." Again, he owned over 1,000 Pizza Huts and sold them just a few years ago. He owns media companies, entertainment companies, film and television production companies, and on and on. He is real.

That said, none of that means he is writing a check for all of this. And he has a proven ability to finance big things. He has also already clearly spent millions to get to this point on this park plan. I think he is quite serious about this development. And again, I think he/they may have enough horsepower. But the idea that he is personally writing a check for $2 billion is a bit silly on the surface. It's not something he will have to do if he doesn't want to.

Possibly. Within his family I can believe they have a billion if all the info about his various franchises and his son's business is accurate. His "media companies" do not impress me in the slightest, so I don't understand why people even bring them up. They look like placeholders to me. The animation arm of Mansion has produced one movie that I can see, and it's about Gene himself, LOL. Their television division has apparently created one show, and it was a live recording of a symphony that aired on public TV. What artists do they represent in their "sound" division? What do they distribute in their "distribution" arm, and where to? Where is their supposed movie studio?

Maybe some of this $2 billion is about building some of those things, particularly the studios. That would make more sense, especially if they are dipping into the "pureflix" line of business in creating a Christian media ecosystem.

[Urbanized]

^^^^^^^^^^^
"Media companies" referred to his radio stations.

[Pete]

83-year-old Gene Bicknell had a very outspoken podcast and social media accounts and as of a few months ago, all the content has been deleted. I suspect a great deal of what he has said and posted would not reflect well on this project.

GeneBicknell.com From a humble start in Baxter Springs, Kansas to becoming a multi-millionaire and the largest Pizza Hut franchisee in the world, Gene Bicknell made his own path through life. His journey has allowed him to see many sides of life and given him decades of business and life experience providing a unique perspective on political and social events of today.

Some of his podcast thumbnails, all from the last year and a half:

"I'm tired of this racist crap!"
Gene proclaims on his podcast today, "I'm Tired of this Racist Crap!" Listen why he feels this way, his own family history regarding racism, and how he feels this nation needs to move forward.

"Fake News Teaches Hate"
If you think Fake News is harmless, think again. It's more than just bad information, it plants seeds of division and hate. It paints a darker picture of our world that everyone is a bad person in disguise, rigging the systems so you can't succeed. But what is really going on?

"You Can't Create UNITY With DIVISION"
In today's Patriot Podcast Gene touches on a several issues and events taking place in our nation today that on the surface seem like nothing to warrant alarm. Is there an attack on our food supply? Are some of the policies that appear to encourage diversity actually creating more division?

"Our Country Has Gone Crazy!"
In today's Patriot Podcast with Gene Bicknell, Gene talks about the the status of our country. Our country has gone crazy! The social issues we're facing, the political choices being made, the level of unrest and economic problems and the lack of logic, reasoning and common sense just doesn't make any sense.

"The Academy Awards Are Dying - So Is The Nation"
Our outspoken patriot, Gene Bicknell, weighs in on his feelings about the Academy Awards and the Hollywood elite and their political correctness. The Academy Awards are dying and so is the nation. We have to return to the values and character that made this a great nation.

[PhiAlpha]

83-year-old Gene Bicknell had a very outspoken podcast and social media accounts and as of a few months ago, all the content has been deleted. I suspect a great deal of what he has said and posted would not reflect well on this project.




Some of his podcast thumbnails, all from the last year and a half:

"I'm tired of this racist crap!"
Gene proclaims on his podcast today, "I'm Tired of this Racist Crap!" Listen why he feels this way, his own family history regarding racism, and how he feels this nation needs to move forward.

"Fake News Teaches Hate"
If you think Fake News is harmless, think again. It's more than just bad information, it plants seeds of division and hate. It paints a darker picture of our world that everyone is a bad person in disguise, rigging the systems so you can't succeed. But what is really going on?

"You Can't Create UNITY With DIVISION"
In today's Patriot Podcast Gene touches on a several issues and events taking place in our nation today that on the surface seem like nothing to warrant alarm. Is there an attack on our food supply? Are some of the policies that appear to encourage diversity actually creating more division?

"Our Country Has Gone Crazy!"
In today's Patriot Podcast with Gene Bicknell, Gene talks about the the status of our country. Our country has gone crazy! The social issues we're facing, the political choices being made, the level of unrest and economic problems and the lack of logic, reasoning and common sense just doesn't make any sense.

"The Academy Awards Are Dying - So Is The Nation"
Our outspoken patriot, Gene Bicknell, weighs in on his feelings about the Academy Awards and the Hollywood elite and their political correctness. The Academy Awards are dying and so is the nation. We have to return to the values and character that made this a great nation.

Definite old guy yelling at the clouds vibes LOL.

[Bunty]

Bicknell is 91, not 83.

[Bowser214]

TexasLand theme park planned! Lmao
https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/te...ibextid=Zxz2cZ

[Pete]

Definite old guy yelling at the clouds vibes LOL.

Judging by his deleted Twitter account, it's more like old guy yelling at Antifa, Black Lives Matter, and George Soros with a healthy amount of conspiracy theories mixed in.

[Urbanized]

I met some folks verifiably connected to both the political field and the tourism industry in northeast Oklahoma, folks who also do much business with the Osage AND with the Cherokee. They told me they also know the developers involved in this project and that they are as real as real gets. Take that for what it’s worth.

[UrbanistPoke]

I met some folks verifiably connected to both the political field and the tourism industry in northeast Oklahoma, folks who also do much business with the Osage AND with the Cherokee. They told me they also know the developers involved in this project and that they are as real as real gets. Take that for what it’s worth.

I've heard the same along with rides being worked on already which is why they feel like the 2026 date is realistic to accomplish. I wouldn't be surprised if they are looking at the Disney tax district model as well and is my guess to why we haven't seen much discussion about TIF, etc. Frankly, that's where the conservative vibes could help them get legislation through too. I had heard there was something possibly going to be thrown into the special session but ultimately it was too fast and didn't want to pollute it with the fact the session was about veto override. That's likely the point of bring Cathy onboard as a consultant to deal with how that would all work and they've been working with the Vinita state rep who was at the announcement. My guess is there will be legislation introduced next regular session.

So let's say a very modest estimate of 2 million visitors and they spend $50 average for entry pass and food/drink each - mostly likely the spend amount per person would be way higher than that, like probably $100/person or more - but that is $100,000,000 in sales and say they can set up a district that recovers nearly all city, county, state sales taxes with maybe a bit carved out to go back to the school district or city. So let's say 7% tax rate (with 0.50% to 1.0% carved out) goes back to American Heartland in the taxing district that is $7,000,000 a year in sales taxes alone. That's $175,000,000 over 25 years. Also, if the taxing district is set up where they don't have to pay any property taxes - you can easily see where this could all start adding up pretty quickly to allow them to leverage that to subsidize a big portion of the park and future developments. Add in them being able to recoup sales tax on the hotel/resort, RV camp ground, etc. etc. and all of that adds up really quick. Not hard to see how they can see $500 million or so in 'savings' in sales taxes alone over 25 years. If a special taxing district is set up then they can bond it just like a city government could, obviously with a dude and other family members combined wealth of $1 billion + I bet they'll get some banks interested in that pretty quickly.

[Thunderbolt]

TexasLand theme park planned! Lmao
https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/te...ibextid=Zxz2cZ

LOL - a kickstarter by a college student.

[Jake]

https://www.fox23.com/news/local/gro...f323ec0f7.html

According to this, construction on the RV park is slated to start within a few months.

[warreng88]

My wife and I had this discussion several months ago and genuinely think the RV Park will be built as presented and then there will be budget concerns that will sideline the rest of the development.

The video interviews the Mayor of Vinita and says this, "He says work on theme park will likely begin in the spring, and the city is also helping other developers expedite the permitting process to build the necessary homes, restaurants, hotels and other infrastructure to support the town’s surge in population."

So, there will be an expedited process for building housing in the area for this development. I am in lending and would be hard pressed to find someone that would lend money on spec rental or for sale homes in an area with a potential theme park and really nothing else. The LTV would have to be pretty low, at least to start, until they started selling and then go from there. That is unless it is very close to Grand Lake and then it might be easier.

[Swake]

My wife and I had this discussion several months ago and genuinely think the RV Park will be built as presented and then there will be budget concerns that will sideline the rest of the development.

The video interviews the Mayor of Vinita and says this, "He says work on theme park will likely begin in the spring, and the city is also helping other developers expedite the permitting process to build the necessary homes, restaurants, hotels and other infrastructure to support the town’s surge in population."

So, there will be an expedited process for building housing in the area for this development. I am in lending and would be hard pressed to find someone that would lend money on spec rental or for sale homes in an area with a potential theme park and really nothing else. The LTV would have to be pretty low, at least to start, until they started selling and then go from there. That is unless it is very close to Grand Lake and then it might be easier.

Grand Lake?

[fortpatches]

Did you finish reading warreng88's comment? Because that is what he mentioned.

[warreng88]

Did you finish reading warreng88's comment? Because that is what he mentioned.

[warreng88]

This is the area it will be built in. Running the mileage, it is 6 miles from Vinita (Population 5,189 as of 2021) and 10 miles from Bernice, OK, which is the westernmost part of Grand Lake.
American Heartland.jpg

Looking at the area, Three Ponies RV Park and Campground already has a pin dropped and a website: https://www.threeponiesrvparkandcampground.com/

I am also curious where the people who are doing the construction are going to come from or live? Will temp housing be built or will they have to commute in?

[Jesseda]

they are having ground breaking ceremony OCT 30th for the three ponies resort.

[shavethewhales]

Very intriguing how this has pushed forward. They are apparently the real deal after all. Still a LONG ways to go before they get to a $2 billion resort, but I honestly expected little to come from all this. The plans that have been shown on social media are ambitious, but they seem to have done their homework and are talking to the right consultants at least. The descriptions of rides list the proper industry manufacturers at least, so they aren't just throwing out random concepts.

I am still pessimistic that the theme park will be anything like what was originally described, but I do feel confident they will build something. Should be something to rival SDC at least. Personally, I think it will be hard to beat SDC's charm and historic appeal, but this will be closer and I'll visit both.