LA Clippers

[zookeeper]

The "hey, everyone is a little racist!" defense says more about the people making those claims than it does anything else IMO.

You are too smart to actually believe this. When reality and truth (and being human) gets smeared as a character fault, that shows only that racism is apparently racism when it's a one-way street. This isn't true in any way. I don't believe that "everyone is a little racist," but I do believe there's a little defense of one's own race in all of us. That's natural in the most scientific and evolutionary sense. And no, I'm not talking about specific cases like Donald Sterling, but in general. It's a defense mechanism that is hardwired and proven, but alas, it's politically incorrect to talk about for reasons we are seeing in this thread. No, this isn't a perfect world with perfect people. Of any race.

[Rover]

You are too smart to actually believe this. When reality and truth (and being human) gets smeared as a character fault, that shows only that racism is apparently racism when it's a one-way street. This isn't true in any way. I don't believe that "everyone is a little racist," but I do believe there's a little defense of one's own race in all of us. That's natural in the most scientific and evolutionary sense. And no, I'm not talking about specific cases like Donald Sterling, but in general. It's a defense mechanism that is hardwired and proven, but alas, it's politically incorrect to talk about for reasons we are seeing in this thread. No, this isn't a perfect world with perfect people. Of any race.

So, you take a "oh well" attitude that he actually has a history of breaking laws to discriminate against a whole race? Because he is genetically wired to be a bigot? That is "defending my race" defense? There are lots of things we might have an animal urge to do but that doesn't make it right. If I have an evolutionary urge to shoot someone because they triggered something in me that angered me, is that okay too? This is a lazy defense that excuses persons who are ignorant and bigoted.

[zookeeper]

So, you take a "oh well" attitude that he actually has a history of breaking laws to discriminate against a whole race? Because he is genetically wired to be a bigot? That is "defending my race" defense? There are lots of things we might have an animal urge to do but that doesn't make it right. If I have an evolutionary urge to shoot someone because they triggered something in me that angered me, is that okay too? This is a lazy defense that excuses persons who are ignorant and bigoted.

I think you missed the part where I wrote that I wasn't thinking of the Sterling case specifically. I think denying what I wrote is denying a truth that everybody knows. And NO, I do not believe that it could or should ever be used as a defense in any criminal wrongdoing. It's a defense of the human race for our sometimes dysfunctional views on others race.

[Pete]

If you ever want to read an interesting book, I'd highly recommend "The End of Racism" by Dinesh D'Souza.

Yes, D'Souza is very far right but he is also from India and as he says in the book "whites are more or less excommunicated from talking about race in America, so I'll do it for them".

I don't agree with all his points or most of his politics, but he's very sharp and makes you think. He's participated in several affirmative action debates (taking the con side, of course) and usually shreds his opponent. Of course, most people get that affirmative action is a pretty bad idea and it's been pretty much abolished.

[RadicalModerate]

Nobody with the last name D'Souza can possibly be authentically Indian, even if he is allegedly from there.
Seems to me that it is more likely that he is one of those "wise guys" who a member of "The Family".
No . . . not that "Family" . . . The Family of Mankind (or Human Beings, if one wants to be less "GenderSexualist".)

[Pete]

From wikipedia:

Sousa (European Portuguese: [ˈsozɐ]) or de Sousa (literally, from Sousa) is a common Portuguese language surname, especially in Portugal, Brazil, and India (among Catholics in Bombay, Mangalore and Goa)

One of my good friends from graduate school is from Bombay and has DeSousa as his surname.

[dankrutka]

White people can and do talk about race in America. I'm in the field of education and this is a frequent topic. However, for most white people you have to start with some humility about your own privilege that exists by being in the majority (just as we can be privileged by speaking English, having use of our legs, or being straight). When you take stock of privileges (which almost everyone is privileged in some way), speak with humility, and engage in dialogue (not debate) then it's not that hard to have discussions about race. I lead classes about race all the time with high school, college students and adults. Rarely are the discussions combative or oppressive.

However, without humility (which is a rare commodity on many message boards), it's not even worth discussing...

[AP]

The issue is that most people can't admit to their privilege, because they are ignorant to it's existence.

[Stew]

The issue is that most people can't admit to their privilege, because they are ignorant to it's existence.

Hey now it ain't privilege. I worked really hard to come out of the right womb.

[adaniel]

White people can and do talk about race in America. I'm in the field of education and this is a frequent topic. However, for most white people you have to start with some humility about your own privilege that exists by being in the majority (just as we can be privileged by speaking English, having use of our legs, or being straight). When you take stock of privileges (which almost everyone is privileged in some way), speak with humility, and engage in dialogue (not debate) then it's not that hard to have discussions about race. I lead classes about race all the time with high school, college students and adults. Rarely are the discussions combative or oppressive.

However, without humility (which is a rare commodity on many message boards), it's not even worth discussing...

All good points. Hope you don't get flamed for stating the truth.

I, as a minority, have had no problem discussing race with my caucasian friends. I have had several admit to me their long standing biases, some very sharp and hurtful, but I have never gotten angry with them, and if anything I appreciate their honesty.

[zookeeper]

White people can and do talk about race in America. I'm in the field of education and this is a frequent topic. However, for most white people you have to start with some humility about your own privilege that exists by being in the majority (just as we can be privileged by speaking English, having use of our legs, or being straight). When you take stock of privileges (which almost everyone is privileged in some way), speak with humility, and engage in dialogue (not debate) then it's not that hard to have discussions about race. I lead classes about race all the time with high school, college students and adults. Rarely are the discussions combative or oppressive.

However, without humility (which is a rare commodity on many message boards), it's not even worth discussing...

No flames, here. But, you are assuming that this "white privilege" taught in all these university "critical race theory" classes is true. In fact, it is nothing more than manufactured excuses to blame all the problems in the black community on "white privilege" and therefore create this huge vacuum of needless self-hatred we know as White Guilt.

I'm sorry, dankrutka, I may agree with you on a lot of things, but I don't buy this mantra of "white privilege" from the professional race-baiting industry. In fact, dare I say it? It's a racist and slanderous ideology made up by academics.

We should be united by class in the war against the .01%, which is not Rich versus Poor, it's the richest of the rich versus everybody else no matter their color. We shouldn't buy into phony, made-up social problems that lie somewhere other than where they actually are.

In other words, I don't believe in "white privilege" and find it racist and offensive.

[ylouder]

Zoo...stop embarrassing yourself.

The only guilt i ever feel is that is when other wasp christians b*tch about how much of a victim they are.

[zookeeper]

Zoo...stop embarrassing yourself.

Well then, a lot of others are confused as well. Many people don't buy into this newfangled concept of "white privilege." I tend to agree with the black conservatives on this issue, that you don't fight racism with more racism. It's offensive. It assumes all whites are suburban-dwelling, SUV driving, white collar workers. Talk to the poor whites who can't find work, and face much the same thing as do poor blacks, about "privilege." If anything, they find themselves on the losing end because of trying to "level the playing field." I'm sorry I don't buy it. It's just another excuse to point the finger somewhere OTHER than the AA community itself for its own problems. They always can say, "Well, you don't understand how it is. White privilege and all..." You've sipped too much of the professional race baiters Kool-Aid if you really believe society should just "see" some kind of blanket privilege for all white people.

[zookeeper]

Zoo...stop embarrassing yourself.

The only guilt i ever feel is that is when other lighter skinned christens b*tch about how much of a victim they are.

I'm not a Christian. I don't believe it. The guilt is in you saying I am "embarrassing myself" because I don't feel guilty for being what I am. Sorry.

You've been brainwashed by popular culture which glorifies a decadent culture that is all-encompassing in the AA community, but can't be called out on it because they just give excuses - of which "white privilege" is just one. If you don't see the real problem is the coddling of one particular race who can't be held accountable for anything in the discussion of social/race relations - we need a new system of education.

[Plutonic Panda]

Debate as UCLA rejects Donald Sterling's $3 million gift

[ylouder]

I'm not a Christian. I don't believe it. The guilt is in you saying I am "embarrassing myself" because I don't feel guilty for being what I am. Sorry.

You've been brainwashed by popular culture who glorify a culture that is all-encompassing in the AA community, but can't be called out on it because they just give excuses. Of which "white privilege" is just one. If you don't see the real problem is the coddling of one particular race who can't be held accountable for anything in the discussion of social/race relations - we need a new system of education.

You convinced me to change my mind about modern society and the last, o thousand years of european and american history. They really are the problem.

Please teach me more about how I am a victim and how society is out to get me.

[zookeeper]

You convinced me to change my mind about modern society and the last, o thousand years of european and american history. They really are the problem.

Please teach me more about how I am a victim and how society is out to get me.

Let's just agree to disagree. We can agree that Donald Sterling is obviously a jerk and he's only part of the story here.

[ylouder]

But i agree with you - They constructed an entire civilization based on their superiority and our exploitation and have at almost every corner tried to hold us back through violence and oppression of their laws. Its not like you and I cant search the internet and find thousands of historical events where they massacred, lynched, and terrorized our communities(and others) any time we tried to be viewed as equals. Heck, some of those events have even happened during our lifetime.

Now they are mad that they cant even flippantly remark that they don't want us to be brought to their establishments.

You are right - maybe we are just being big ol cry babies and wanting them to coddle us.

------------------

I'm smart enough to read a book or two and realize that i got dealt a pretty fair hand and that i shouldnt walk around going out of my way to be a dick to entire other groups of people i dont know. Since your not a church guy and wwjd doesnt apply, chalk it up to giving out good karma instead of bad.

Back on subject - Don Sterling was a jerk, theres quite a bit of background of him going out of his way to be one. I chalk this up to karma.

[Teo9969]

Yep. This was as much as a business decision as doing the right thing. Its sad it take the loss of cash for people to do the right thing but that's America for you.

This guy is not a victim of circumstance. Why anyone would pity a billionaire is beyond me. He CHOSE do date a girl that could be his granddaughter, he CHOSE to behave and say the things his did. Case closed. How it was extracted from him is a question a civil court can decide but the fact is the cat is out of the bag and he would not be in this situation if not for the decisions he made.

True, lots of people say terrible things in private. Some get caught, some don't. His number came up this time and others may one day as well. God/fate/karma/etc. work in funny ways. That certainly doesn't excuse what he did. The "hey, everyone is a little racist!" defense says more about the people making those claims than it does anything else IMO.

Yes he is. He absolutely deserves what's coming, but victims can deserve really bad s*^* happening to them as well. It's both. It's not okay nor will it ever be okay to record someone else in a private setting and release that to a website like TMZ. He was a victim. He's also a dick who fully deserves what's coming to him.

Don't obfuscate the issue by making it less complicated than it is.

[Achilleslastand]

I find it funny that......
13% of the population commits 40-50% of violent crime.
Unemployment in same said group is at an all time high.
Broken fractured and not functioning family units.

But there is outrage over what someone said behind closed doors which is surely worse then the aforementioned.

Ya id say our priorities are straight........

[dankrutka]

No flames, here. But, you are assuming that this "white privilege" taught in all these university "critical race theory" classes is true. In fact, it is nothing more than manufactured excuses to blame all the problems in the black community on "white privilege" and therefore create this huge vacuum of needless self-hatred we know as White Guilt.

I'm sorry, dankrutka, I may agree with you on a lot of things, but I don't buy this mantra of "white privilege" from the professional race-baiting industry. In fact, dare I say it? It's a racist and slanderous ideology made up by academics.

We should be united by class in the war against the .01%, which is not Rich versus Poor, it's the richest of the rich versus everybody else no matter their color. We shouldn't buy into phony, made-up social problems that lie somewhere other than where they actually are.

In other words, I don't believe in "white privilege" and find it racist and offensive.

You couldn't be further off from how I discuss race and I think you have a pretty warped understanding of critical race theory and privilege. Discussions I've led and participate in never are meant to incite guilt in white people or anyone else. I certainly don't feel guilt or think that would be a healthy place to start a dialogue. There's a huge difference between guilt and privilege. No point in carrying on the discussion here, particularly because you seem interested in a debate, not a dialogue... But I'd be happy to discuss it in person anytime I'm in town. Just DM me. I bet we could have a good discussion face-to-face. Best.

[Dubya61]

... However, for most white people you have to start with some humility about your own privilege that exists by being in the majority (just as we can be privileged by speaking English, having use of our legs, or being straight). When you take stock of privileges (which almost everyone is privileged in some way), speak with humility, and engage in dialogue (not debate) then it's not that hard to have discussions ...

In fact, [white privilege] is nothing more than manufactured excuses to ...
We should be united by class in the war against the .01%, which is not Rich versus Poor, it's the richest of the rich versus everybody else no matter their color. We shouldn't buy into phony, made-up social problems that lie somewhere other than where they actually are.

... 13% of the population commits 40-50% of violent crime.
Unemployment in same said group is at an all time high.
Broken fractured and not functioning family units. ...

I wanted to bring these three posts together to say something.
I think dan's got it right. Whether institutionalized or subtly societal, some privilege exists in almost every relationship and if there's to be an honest discussion about that relationship, the privilege must be acknowledged.
zoo, you don't have to have guilt to acknowledge privilege and I think you're spot on in pointing out where the real divide is in today's society. It's a much more tangible privilege, but the other privileges that dan mention still exist.
achilles, you're right, but only when you see race as the right way to slice and dice the data. Household income is a much better correlation.

[Laramie]

'Good luck' to the NBA in the tug-of-war battle to get the Los Angeles Clippers from:

The Donald!



Is that Trump or Sterling?

"Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.

[ylouder]

Excellent post dubya.

[Pete]

As I predicted, now that Sterling has become a complete pariah, all types of things are starting to come out. As is typical in these types of situations, it's only once a rich person or company hits bottom and money stops flowing does the real truth start to emerge.

Today, there was an article in the LA Times (subscription only) that started to dig into the Donald Sterling Foundation. As I had mentioned, Sterling very frequently takes out huge ads in the Times promoting some honor he is to receive or some charity he is helping. They all look very similar with the same picture of him; clearly put together and paid for by Sterling. All of this started after the large settlement he paid over discriminatory housing practices.

The garish ads claim things like $20 million in charitable gifts, but the LA Times reports it's more like $1.4 million. Several big things announced and promoted over and over that never got done at all, like a ranch for underprivileged kids and new shelters on Skid Row.

They also interviewed some of the organizations featured in these ads and all said they did not authorize the advertisements and some not only asked him to stop using their name and logos, they actually sent cease and desist orders. And this all before the recent crapstorm of horrible publicity.


The guy is just a world-class sleazeball. Virtually anyone who has come in contact with him has been saying this for years.

Particularly if he puts up a fight against the NBA, there is going to be an absolute parade of people who will step forward. His only defenders will be his wife and mistress who both still have a big financial interest.