OKC Retail Update

[Spartan]

L.A. fitness seems like a good thing. OKC needs more than Golds Gym for fitness centers.

Definitely a good thing for another strip mall, like any of this stuff.

[bchris02]

I'm not really seeing anything that suggests an actual upgrade in the retail scene. But good for Quail Springs..

Von Maur is a step above the current department stores in OKC. It's not Nordstrom or Saks but it will be a welcome addition. My hopes is it is just the start of more upscale offerings coming to Quail Springs Mall. I would eventually like to see H&M at Quail Springs as well as some of the other stores mentioned in this thread.

[Spartan]

And why exactly do you want upscale offerings at Quail Springs?

Why don't we just bring back Crossroads and not have any new development ever again

[bchris02]

And why exactly do you want upscale offerings at Quail Springs?

Why don't we just bring back Crossroads and not have any new development ever again

Quail Springs has to go more upscale or it will become Crossroads.

As much as I would like to see Crossroads revived, its not going to happen given the demographics of the surrounding area. If anything, the Southside could use a new mall or lifestyle center between Moore and Norman.

[ljbab728]

Quail Springs has to go more upscale or it will become Crossroads.

As much as I would like to see Crossroads revived, its not going to happen given the demographics of the surrounding area. If anything, the Southside could use a new mall or lifestyle center between Moore and Norman.

I don't want to turn this into another Crossroads Mall thread but the demographics of the surrounding area was only incidental in it's demise. It was mismanaged and allowed to die by it's owners.

[bchris02]

I don't want to turn this into another Crossroads Mall thread but the demographics of the surrounding area was only incidental in it's demise. It was mismanaged and allowed to die by it's owners.

Agreed. It was allowed to die, but the problem now is I don't see anybody worthwhile making the kind of investment in the mall it would take to revive it given the surrounding demographics.

What anchors would move in? I highly doubt Dillard's or Macy's would re-open, and JC Penney has two nearby stores to replace the one that was at Crossroads.

[ljbab728]

Agreed. It was allowed to die, but the problem now is I don't see anybody worthwhile making the kind of investment in the mall it would take to revive it given the surrounding demographics.

What anchors would move in? I highly doubt Dillard's or Macy's would re-open, and JC Penney has two nearby stores to replace the one that was at Crossroads.

It may mean nothing because things have been proposed before but please note this quote from the article.

Owners of Crossroads Mall, a sore spot in the Oklahoma City retail market, are expected to make a big announcement in 2013 about the direction of the property at Interstates 35 and 240, both Parrack and Williams said.

In September 2011, Raptor Properties LLC, which consists of two local investors, purchased Crossroads Mall, which still contains about two dozen retailers, including Victoria’s Secret, Bath & Body Works and Journeys.

They intend to keep it open as a mall, despite the departure of surrounding retailers like Best Buy, which relocated to the I-240 Penn Park shopping center at I-240 and Pennsylvania Avenue. Williams said Crossroads Mall’s owners want to redevelop the property with an emphasis on family entertainment.

The demographics in the areas surrounding the Outlet Shops is hardly better and it was been wildly successful.

[bchris02]

It may mean nothing because things have been proposed before but please note this quote from the article.



The demographics in the areas surrounding the Outlet Shops is hardly better and it was been wildly successful.

As far as a Crossroads revival, I am not going to believe it until I see it, but there are options.

Anybody think a mall catering to Hispanic businesses would work in OKC? They have one in Fort Worth. That would be a perfect use for Crossroads in my opinion.

CENTER STAGE: LA GRAN PLAZA

[ljbab728]

As far as a Crossroads revival, I am not going to believe it until I see it, but there are options.

Anybody think a mall catering to Hispanic businesses would work in OKC? They have one in Fort Worth. That would be a perfect use for Crossroads in my opinion.

CENTER STAGE: LA GRAN PLAZA

I would prefer that hispanic businesses be concentrated in an area like Capitol Hill instead, which would make it a special area for OKC. I'm not saying it couldn't work at Crossroads but I think OKC has better options for something like that.

[GaryOKC6]

I would prefer that hispanic businesses be concentrated in an area like Capitol Hill instead, which would make it a special area for OKC. I'm not saying it couldn't work at Crossroads but I think OKC has better options for something like that.

There are still rumblings of turning Crossroads into an entertainment venue like Great Wolf in Dallas. I think that would work well as an attraction.

[vaflyer]

If anything, the Southside could use a new mall or lifestyle center between Moore and Norman.

Isn't this what Sooner Investment is trying to do in University North Park?

I read recently that someone in Norman (maybe at the NEDC, I don't recall for sure) said if the economy does not go into a downtown then maybe they will be able to announce the first (major?) lifestyle tenant this year.

[Plutonic Panda]

Definitely a good thing for another strip mall, like any of this stuff.

They have stand alone LA fitness centers. They also have urban ones too. I don't think these are bad. I for one am glad to see OKC getting these new stores even if it isn't what I wanted it to be, it is something.

[Spartan]

Quail Springs has to go more upscale or it will become Crossroads.

As much as I would like to see Crossroads revived, its not going to happen given the demographics of the surrounding area. If anything, the Southside could use a new mall or lifestyle center between Moore and Norman.

You WANT to see Crossroads revived???

I know you're from somewhere else, but what is your affinity with indoor shopping malls when we don't have a single meaningful lifestyle center anywhere in the metro?

We need the malls to die off already like elsewhere.

[Spartan]

Isn't this what Sooner Investment is trying to do in University North Park?

No, what Sooner Investments is trying to do is build the cheapest possible strip mall surrounded by public investments that they can quickly cash out of at a huge profit. Leave it to rot under new ownership after they goaded the public into believing there were high standards.

It's just 19th Street but in a city that's stupid enough to pass a TIF for a strip mall.

[vaflyer]

No, what Sooner Investments is trying to do is build the cheapest possible strip mall surrounded by public investments that they can quickly cash out of at a huge profit. Leave it to rot under new ownership after they goaded the public into believing there were high standards.

It's just 19th Street but in a city that's stupid enough to pass a TIF for a strip mall.

I do not believe the UNP is a cheap strip mall. Yes, the Academy Sports building is an eyesore but everyone involved with the project admits that. The most recent developments, Mathis Brothers and the strip center with Starbucks, are very nice buildings. I do agree that the city needs to watch this development closely. With most of the strip mall part of the development getting to close to filling out, the focus will be on the lifestyle center. I am sure, you are like me, and hope this component is done with high standards. I guess we will know soon.

I know that the TIF has been very controversial, but it is instructive to remember where most of the TIF funds have been spent so far. The main source of TIF spending has been on road projects that most everyone agrees needed to be done. They include intersection work in the TIF, the I-35 access road, the Rock Creek overpass, and the northbound I-35 interchange with Robinson. The next major area of TIF spending is on Legacy Park. I am actually quite skeptical of the value of this component, but most people on city council believe Legacy Park will be the crown jewel of the development. I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt, but I hope they keep the cost of the park under control. (So far they have.)

[bchris02]

You WANT to see Crossroads revived???

I know you're from somewhere else, but what is your affinity with indoor shopping malls when we don't have a single meaningful lifestyle center anywhere in the metro?

We need the malls to die off already like elsewhere.

I would like to see a lifestyle center built but not at the cost of the remaining indoor malls. Dead malls are a blight and not something any city should hope for.

I've already said there is little hope for Crossroads are a regular mall and that a lifestyle center should be built on the Southside as meaningful replacement.

Plus, I know lifestyle centers are trendy, but I don't really see the appeal in a climate such as OKC's with cold winters and hot summers. It makes perfect sense in SoCal but the indoor mall more convenient in colder climates despite what the trends say. However, a nice lifestyle center would be good for the city nonetheless.

[Just the facts]

It may mean nothing because things have been proposed before but please note this quote from the article.

They intend to keep it open as a mall, despite the departure of surrounding retailers like Best Buy, which relocated to the I-240 Penn Park shopping center at I-240 and Pennsylvania Avenue. Williams said Crossroads Mall’s owners want to redevelop the property with an emphasis on family entertainment.

The demographics in the areas surrounding the Outlet Shops is hardly better and it was been wildly successful.

I wonder if they are going to try turning it into a Mills mall.

[Soonerman]

I wonder if they are going to try turning it into a Mills mall.

Isn't Mills now owned by Simon??

[mcca7596]

Plus, I know lifestyle centers are trendy, but I don't really see the appeal in a climate such as OKC's with cold winters and hot summers. It makes perfect sense in SoCal but the indoor mall more convenient in colder climates despite what the trends say. However, a nice lifestyle center would be good for the city nonetheless.

There are places with weather worse than OKC's that have successful lifestyle centers: Phoenix and Minneapolis come immediately to mind. It seems that many Oklahomans have a strange aversion to doing anything outdoors other than watching/playing sports or hunting/fishing.

[Just the facts]

There are places with weather worse than OKC's that have successful lifestyle centers: Phoenix and Minneapolis come immediately to mind. It seems that many Oklahomans have a strange aversion to doing anything outdoors other than watching/playing sports or hunting/fishing.

This is one of the most disappointing things OKCTalk has brought to light. When I lived in Oklahoma people weren't afraid of the weather. What happened? When did Oklahomans become such wussus?

Lest there be any confussion:

Wuss: person regarded as weak or timid and especially as unmanly

At this rate OU and OSU will have to build dome stadiums.

[RadicalModerate]

I agree about the confussion of wussiness, yet I draw the line at the sexist implication connected with the term "unmanly" within the context of the Quote Block . . .
When I was a child, in Colorado, where it gets and stays cold for a long time--especially while waiting for the school bus--I often wondered how the girls could stand to go out in that weather wearing skirts.

[Just the facts]

I agree about the confussion of wussiness, yet I draw the line at the sexist implication connected with the term "unmanly" within the context of the Quote Block . . .
When I was a child, in Colorado, where it gets and stays cold for a long time--especially while waiting for the school bus--I often wondered how the girls could stand to go out in that weather wearing skirts.

The problem in Oklahoma seems to be that even the boys are now wearing skirts, so maybe I do need to find a gender-neutral term. Maybe all the 'men' are now shopping at WalMart because they have outdoor 20 acre parking lot and people seem to be able to make that walk.

[RadicalModerate]

I think it must be a cultural de-evolutionary thing . . . or sumpin' . . .
Note the abandoned shopping cart in the lower right corner of the photo: laziness rulz, eh? =)
(or possibly it's just "Bubbles' Bait" . . . seen The Canadian Triumph "Trailer Park Boys" yet?)

I hear tell someone wearin' their Sunday Go T' Walmart pajammers trapped a squirrel in that tree to the left.
Not to mention them Noodlers who got popped fer fishin' in the storm drain when the ice started t' melt.

(or is that really a photo from an Arkansas location . . ? they all look the same . . .)

[progressiveboy]

There are still rumblings of turning Crossroads into an entertainment venue like Great Wolf in Dallas. I think that would work well as an attraction.

In Real Estate, it is all about location, location, location........I just do not see this dinosaur of a mall being converted into a Great Wolf venue unless private developers or the city invests millions and millions in cleaning up that area. If their goal is to attract tourist and vacationers, then they are going to have to seriously clean up this area. It is quite scary.

[bluedogok]

I would like to see a lifestyle center built but not at the cost of the remaining indoor malls. Dead malls are a blight and not something any city should hope for.

I've already said there is little hope for Crossroads are a regular mall and that a lifestyle center should be built on the Southside as meaningful replacement.

Plus, I know lifestyle centers are trendy, but I don't really see the appeal in a climate such as OKC's with cold winters and hot summers. It makes perfect sense in SoCal but the indoor mall more convenient in colder climates despite what the trends say. However, a nice lifestyle center would be good for the city nonetheless.

Austin is miserable hot for 6 months of the year but yet The Domain is busy even on the hottest of days and is utterly packed on weekends, I saw it every workday for 3+ years from the time right after it opened when our office moved in there above Z Gallerie (second company in the office space). The outdoor malls here in the Denver area don't seem to have any trouble attracting a ton of traffic even with snow on the ground. Utica Square and Country Club Plaza in KC have been around a long time, well before "lifestyle center" became a type of shopping district and it seems like they have no problems attracting clientele. The thing that most "indoor mall people" seem to forget that the big box shopping centers are really nothing more than another outdoor mall and those seem to be busy no matter the weather and most don't have parking right at the front door.