Lake Hefner at record low water levels, when will city buy Canton water?

[HangryHippo]

The doomsday predictions are really getting old. Remember the 70s? The earth was freezing, population was growing too fast, and we were going to run out of food. None of that happened. The invisible hand guides us. Technology has the potential to fix any problem.

Is charging more for water not a better solution?

There's a huge difference between the government telling a farmer this land you've been making a living on for generations (in most cases) you can no longer use because we the brilliant government, who screw up almost everything we touch, have decided farming here is no longer allowed.

Or the water you are using that is public utility is now going to be 15% more expensive?

JTF isn't a republican, the thought process isn't a republican line of thinking it's a leftist.

BTW the second is a better solution because now demand has been created to maintain yield with less water. Make a GMO seed that is more drought resistant and viola. Problem solved. Innovation takes hold, but it can't if the shortsighted iron fist of government crushes it first. Nearly everything, and with very few exceptions, the government touches creates more problems not less.

So your proposal is to come up with GMO seeds and charge more for water? And your logic of "we've always done it, so we should be able to continue doing it" is awfully weak. What if these technological innovations take time and the aquifer ends up drained while we wait for drought resistant seeds?

[ou48A]

Are they not hurting others (or at least limiting their resources) if they drain the aquifer?

When you look at a map of the aquifer in question (The Oglala aquifer ) this is the area where the vast majority of crops are irrigated and the only aquifer in Oklahoma being depleted by agriculture….

But as it can clearly be seen there is a vast area west of I-35 in Oklahoma that is almost entirely dry land farming or pasture lands.

The first 100 miles or so west of I-35 is generally very productive ground where farming occurs. But this area is not depleting The Oglala aquifer and the thoughts that it is would be completely false!.... because the Oglala aquifer doesn’t even exist in this area!

There are places in north central Oklahoma, but west of I-35 that are some of the very best wheat grounds in the entire world….

For every person being harmed by these farmers there are a million more that have their lives helped with more abundant cheaper food, fiber and sometimes jobs.

http://gulfofmexicooilspillblog.file...05ogallala.jpg

[Paseofreak]

Aquifer.

[Just the facts]

It's comments like this that make laugh when you say you are a Republican. Yeah the government should totally be allowed to tell people what to do with their land even if they aren't hurting others.

How about this then, just deny government subsidies to industrial farmers west of I-35?

[Bellaboo]

I think you missed the context of the post based on what Lake Optima was designed for.

Believe it or not I know a lot about Optima.

One flood helped make it happen ?

[Just the facts]

JTF isn't a republican, the thought process isn't a republican line of thinking it's a leftist.

Just to clarify, you're correct, I am not a practicing Republican. However, I am NOT a left-winger, I am an New Urbanist Teapartier Christian Austrian School of Economics: NUTCASE (I just made that up and am claiming credit for creating it).

[Urban Pioneer]

A few more rains this spring like the one Canton just got would go a long ways. The conservation pool is close to 29% full after these rains.

It was suggested on Channel 4 that seven more similar rains would end the drought. Sure would be nice. I looked at Lake Optima pics on Abandoned Oklahoma. One word... eerie.

[Just the facts]

That’s not even close to the truth^… While living in Guymon I have personally seen Lake Optima nearly full on one occasion and I have been told that it’s been near full on one other time.

I was going to say I stand corrected, but I guess I won't be doing that now. It has never reached more than 10% of its designed depth or 20% of its surface area.

Optima Lake State Park | Abandoned Oklahoma

[Bellaboo]

I was going to say I stand corrected, but I guess I won't be doing that now. It has never reached more than 10% of its designed depth or 20% of its surface area.

Optima Lake State Park | Abandoned Oklahoma

There's actually pictures of it with quite a bit of water, not saying it was full but better than it was 10 years ago.

[ou48A]

I was going to say I stand corrected, but I guess I won't be doing that now. It has never reached more than 10% of its designed depth or 20% of its surface area.

Optima Lake State Park | Abandoned Oklahoma

Sorry but when they talk about the lake level the information on that link is not correct no matter what it or says or anything else for that matter…. I live in that area in the 80’s and last drove by Optima in the early 90’s…..and was very familiar with the are at the time and knew people who spent time there hunting. One guy even fished the lake without much success.

What we saw didn’t last long but it was a nearly full lake…..Anyone working at that site has probably long since retired… What you have said about Optima lake levels is still wrong.... But what I’m talking about is only a very rare case.

[ou48A]

There's actually pictures of it with quite a bit of water, not saying it was full but better than it was 10 years ago.

FYI

The date I saw it nearly full would have been about May of 1990 after 6+ inch rains occurred well up stream.

[mkjeeves]

I camped out there about year 2000. There was water in it but not much.

Optima Dam was completed in 1978 and the water level
has never risen to the bottom of the conservation pool. The
highest water level recorded was May 31, 1980, but it fell a
few feet short of conservation pool level. A flood event in May
1996 raised the elevation to a few feet below the conservation
pool and the project operated as designed. There were no
water releases made from the dam

http://www.swt.usace.army.mil/Portal...sl-2010-11.pdf

That sounds like a little more water than the wiki entry says, however short lived.

[Just the facts]

The item I linked to was a story in the Oklahoman. Maximum depth ever recorded - 15 feet. Anyhow, it doesn't matter because the point was that expanding capacity won't help because there is no water to go in it. It's like opening a second bank account because you don't have any money in your first account.

[Stickman]

The item I linked to was a story in the Oklahoman. Maximum depth ever recorded - 15 feet. Anyhow, it doesn't matter because the point was that expanding capacity won't help because there is no water to go in it. It's like opening a second bank account because you don't have any money in your first account.

Your not really comparing Optima to Hefner or Overholser for the sake of your argument......................

ARE YOU?

[Just the facts]

If Hefner was 20x larger would there be more water in it right now?

[Stickman]

If they built it 5 years ago, of course. Water has been let out before...several times. Not saying we don't need to conserve, but we are a long way off (precipitation wise) from Altus or the panhandle.

[Just the facts]

That is the root of the problem though. Average demand has exceeded average supply and now there is a reliance on above average supply. That isn't a problem that can be solved by storage capacity indefinitely.

[Jersey Boss]

Oklahoma ranked third worst out of 50 states in running out of water. Texas is #9

> Pct. severe drought: 51.7%
> Pct. extreme drought: 39.7% (3rd highest)
> Pct. exceptional drought: 10.7% (3rd highest)

While the periods of peak precipitation have passed in the Western U.S., the wet season in Oklahoma has not quite arrived and therefore there may be hope to restore water supplies there. With severe to exceptional drought conditions affecting more than half of Oklahoma as of the week ended April 14, however, the state’s current water shortage is quite dire. Almost 11% of the state’s land area was experiencing exceptional drought, nearly the highest such share in the nation. Oklahoma is also one of a handful of Great Plains states relying heavily on the Ogallala Aquifer, which supplies water for about one-fifth of all U.S. wheat, corn, cotton, and cattle production. The Aquifer, which contains water thousands of years old, is currently being depleted faster than it is being replenished. 9 States Running Out of Water - 24/7 Wall St.

[Stickman]

indefinitely no, Dallas is having to figure out the problem too. I have a 34K gallon swimming pool, not looking forward to paying more but understand its part of it. Conservation to a degree, with more capacity and availability of water East of us is the only answer.

[Just the facts]

So not filling your swimming pool isn't a viable answer?

[HangryHippo]

indefinitely no, Dallas is having to figure out the problem too. I have a 34K gallon swimming pool, not looking forward to paying more but understand its part of it. Conservation to a degree, with more capacity and availability of water East of us is the only answer.

Why is it only conservation to a degree? Is there really not enough evidence to convince you that we need to be doing all we can to conserve our resources and utilize them cautiously?

[Just the facts]

I don't get it either. Conservation is the only solution that works every time.

[Architect2010]

I have a 34K gallon swimming pool, not looking forward to paying more but understand its part of it..

I'm looking forward to you paying more! That or you better invite all of OKCtalk to use your pool this summer. It's only fair. ;P

[Just the facts]

I have a 34K gallon swimming pool, not looking forward to paying more but understand its part of it.

Just for giggles, how much would it have to cost before you decided not to fill your pool?

[SOONER8693]

I don't get it either. Conservation is the only solution that works every time.

So, basically, you are asking/requesting that people that have worked hard and achieved enough in life to have a pool at their home, to not fill the pool and use it. That sounds like communistic thinking. And you expect people to take you seriously? You must be a communist. That has already been tried in eastern Europe. Didn't work.