Oklahoma Turnpike Authority

[Rover]

OTA has their financial reports, budgets, average daily traffic, bondholders report, and other information available on their website. You can also attend their public meetings.

Nah. That's too hard to actually read and digest it. Let's just stay with our faux outrage. LOL

[bombermwc]

Nah. That's too hard to actually read and digest it. Let's just stay with our faux outrage. LOL

People don't attend meetings, at least generally speaking. Good or bad, that's just how it is.

I'll admit that I didn't know that the report was there, so thank you for pointing it out MagzOK. Maybe we could spread the word on that to more people that have these feelings (there are plenty on this thread alone). You do, however, need to know financial tables to make sense of the multiple break outs they have of the same data. So I'd say for an average Joe, it doesn't tell them what they are looking for in a way they understand. How much did you take in? How much did you spend? What's the delta?
https://oklahoma.gov/content/dam/ok/...nualReport.pdf

Now, that report does seem to go along with my previous question though. If they are spending 32m a year on toll operations, how does that break out in terms of toll salaries and the back-office staff that support them? If you remove toll operators, then you'll reduce HR/Accounting/Payroll/Electrical Utility (ac/heater in the booths and break rooms/etc)/Maintenance/etc staff that are needed to keep that team going (unless you only have 1 in each role already). Of course, at first we won't have 32M to spend because they aren't converting everything at once, but I still question the logic on raising the tolls so much for the non pike-passers to cover the tagless deployment. That also tells you how many people use the roads and are not pike pass holders. That was me until this week, driven by them making that decision. I rarely use the turnpikes, but it's worth it to not pay over like that. There's an ROI there for even regular drivers with that new plan. If more people make the decision I did, are we looking at a request to raise the toll for everyone?

And to the point made by others about the rate, you are comparing apples to oranges if you're looking at North Texas Toll. Most of the NTA roads are express lanes for commuters in an extremely congested urban area. Most of Oklahoma turnpikes are in very rural areas, connecting the cities. The Creek and Kilpatrick are an exception, but are still mostly in less populated areas. It's not as though they are running an express lane downtown. We don't need dynamic rates because we dont have the roads in the areas that warrant them.

[jn1780]

I noticed there is zero pricing information on the Kilpatrick turnpike now. You would think that's something out of state drivers or even Pikepass customers would want to know. I wonder how long before the OTA installs message signs that allow them to show current pricing like they do in Texas? They could also make it variable pricing based on demand.

[scottk]

I noticed there is zero pricing information on the Kilpatrick turnpike now. You would think that's something out of state drivers or even Pikepass customers would want to know. I wonder how long before the OTA installs message signs that allow them to show current pricing like they do in Texas? They could also make it variable pricing based on demand.

I noticed the pricing information on signage just before the old toll booth at Western. If you went the entire length of the Kilpatrick in a standard vehicle, Pikepass would $3.20, Platepay would be $6.65.

The long term plan I am guessing is to get as many people on PikePass as possible since it much more automatic than mailing someone a physical bill. While initially cheaper, I imagine OTA has data somewhere that shows that current PikePass holders use the turnpike system more frequently than non-PikePass holders. (especially in the metro areas) Most probably don't even think about it if they have their PikePass account auto drafted.

One of the other nice things about PikePass is the interoperability between the North Texas Tollways, TX Tag, and Kansas Turnpike. There are times we use our PikePass more in DFW in a month than in Oklahoma.

[Snowman]

I noticed the pricing information on signage just before the old toll booth at Western. If you went the entire length of the Kilpatrick in a standard vehicle, Pikepass would $3.20, Platepay would be $6.65.

The long term plan I am guessing is to get as many people on PikePass as possible since it much more automatic than mailing someone a physical bill. While initially cheaper, I imagine OTA has data somewhere that shows that current PikePass holders use the turnpike system more frequently than non-PikePass holders. (especially in the metro areas) Most probably don't even think about it if they have their PikePass account auto drafted.

One of the other nice things about PikePass is the interoperability between the North Texas Tollways, TX Tag, and Kansas Turnpike. There are times we use our PikePass more in DFW in a month than in Oklahoma.

It seem like they generally have quoted PikePass users as around 90% of turnpike traffic, but it would not be a surprise if the long routes and the suburban routes had noticeably different numbers.

[Laramie]

Understand the various arguments about toll roads. Our sister city of Tulsa is encircled by toll roads: https://tulsaworld.com/opinion/lette...cd96dc08c.html

Sure the toll roads make money and secure future funds for expansion, upgrades & maintenance.

When visiting the Tulsa area in the mid 90s, had to get enough cash and coins to cover a litany of tolls. Do you realize how many toll roads connect to the Tulsa metropolitan area...

Tulsa is Oklahoma's second largest city with a lot of potential being on an inland canal waterway.

Let's give Tulsa a break and eliminate at least two those toll roads; eliminate the toll on the H. E. Bailey Turnpike to Oklahoma City.

1 Oklahoma turnpikes: https://tollguru.com/toll-wiki/oklah...ike-toll-roads

1.1 Cherokee Turnpike
1.2 Chickasaw Turnpike
1.3 Cimarron Turnpike
1.4 H.E. Bailey Turnpike
1.5 Indian Nation Turnpike
1.6 John Kilpatrick Turnpike
1.7 Muskogee Turnpike
1.8 Turner Turnpike
1.9 Creek Turnpike
1.10 Will Rogers Turnpike
1.11 Kickapoo Turnpike

[Plutonic Panda]

Eliminate all of the toll roads.

[catch22]

ODOT doesn’t have the funding to keep up with current infrastructure needs, and you want to dump hundreds or even thousands of additional lane miles in their lap?

[Plutonic Panda]

Yes.

[MagzOK]

ODOT doesn’t have the funding to keep up with current infrastructure needs, and you want to dump hundreds or even thousands of additional lane miles in their lap?

No way! I gladly pay tolls all the time for a very smooth and nice ride. Of course if ODOT had correct and effective funding I'd like to not have the tolls, but the way the state is now I'm thankful for generally pothole-free and overall better facilities. I frequently use the Kilpatrick and Turner and am very pleased with them. Frequent trips to Dallas on I-35 remind me why I enjoy paying the tolls.

[Plutonic Panda]

Well I never said they shouldn’t have their funding increased. Somehow, just somehow states like California, Utah, Arizona, Texas, etc manage to build tons of higher quality roads with little to no tolls. Oklahoma can do the same. Get rid of the tolls.

[MagzOK]

Well I never said they shouldn’t have their funding increased. Somehow, just somehow states like California, Utah, Arizona, Texas, etc manage to build tons of higher quality roads with little to no tolls. Oklahoma can do the same. Get rid of the tolls.

It may have something to do with population and tax dollars, not sure. OK can't compete with Texas in terms of funding. Texas highways are incredible, and I'm including their FM highways also. Actually, their FM highways generally are better than most of our federally marked highways! The way the funding is set up now, there's now way that ODOT can keep up the maintenance on the pikes as they can't keep up with what they have now. I know there are a lot of folks that absolutely loathe them, but IMO turnpikes are better facilities.

[Plutonic Panda]

Because they’re properly funded. If we did the same other facilities would be just as good.

[Richard at Remax]

I'm pretty sure almost all of the new highways I've seen built in Dallas the past decade have some sort of toll running down the middle. I do not support getting rid of toll roads.

[Plutonic Panda]

Toll lanes are completely different than having direct interstate connections between cities being tolled.

[khook]

You Are Here NTTA > Roads & Projects > Existing Roadways
overpassesday.jpg

The NTTA is a crucial component of the transportation system in North Texas, operating more than 1,089 toll miles in the region including the Dallas North Tollway, President George Bush Turnpike, Chisholm Trail Parkway, Addison Airport Toll Tunnel, Mountain Creek Lake Bridge, Sam Rayburn Tollway, Lewisville Lake Toll Bridge and 360 Tollway. All of these roadways serve as key connectors for people throughout the region.

Texas Hi Ways are not what they use to be..... Texas is building tons of Toll Roads for the same reason as Oklahoma. The funding is not what it use to be...

[Plutonic Panda]

Texas has actually been building very little toll roads lately and has become very anti toll making planned toll roads actually non-tolled facilities. Anyone who keeps up with the slightest of Highway building news in Texas would know this.

What major cities across Texas are connected by toll roads? I’ll give you a hint: none. The only toll roads exists in certain segments in DFW, Austin, and Houston. SA has a massive toll free network. Not one interstate connecting cities in Texas is tolled. Virtually every new freeway project/expansion in the last several years has been toll free with few exceptions.

Texas funds it’s roads above and beyond what Oklahoma even comes close to. There are plenty of expansions of the freeway/interstate system in Oklahoma that are justified and can’t be built at all or won’t without toll that would be built without tolls in Texas, Utah, Arizona, etc. because they properly fund their roads.

[mugofbeer]

Texas has gone into deep debt since about 2003 to fund highway construction. Right now, their debt is around $23 billion. Some of these roadways have toll lanes to help pay the debt but in essence, Texas sold bonds to build a lot of mostly free roads. Their toll road binge has mostly stopped for the time being.

[Bunty]

Well I never said they shouldn’t have their funding increased. Somehow, just somehow states like California, Utah, Arizona, Texas, etc manage to build tons of higher quality roads with little to no tolls. Oklahoma can do the same. Get rid of the tolls.

Years ago, Oklahoma voters nixed a proposal to raise gas tax for better roads. Other states, like California have better highways, because the people there are willing to pay higher taxes for them. Ironic how a few years ago, Oklahoma raised gas tax by 3 cents not to fix the roads, but rather to pay teachers more. But it shows to me how many Oklahomans, including state legislators, aren't all that unhappy with the state highway system.

[Plutonic Panda]

Well another day another new proposed freeway in Arizona that won’t be tolled.

https://azdot.gov/adot-news/adot-sel...e-pinal-county

lol but Oklahoma with some of the fastest growing cities can’t build anything without tolls.

[catch22]

Arizona GDP: 320 billion
Oklahoma GDP: 185 billion

Arizona Population: 7.8 million
Oklahoma Population: 4.0 million

Why do you think they can afford to build more? We have half the population and half the economic production. OK’s roads are proportional to that fact.

[Plutonic Panda]

Right so that must mean Oklahoma can’t even build any road at all for free because Arizona was never Oklahoma’s size with non tolled freeways facilities. That’s it. There’s no way to do it even though I’ve provided numerous examples. Every state like Arizona and Utah just hit some magic number in their population where all of their toll roads were removed.

[catch22]

I don’t know what explanation you are looking for. Oklahoma has a low tax rate, very conservative spending, and a constitution that forbids odot from borrowing money. Contact your legislators and ask for higher taxes, more spending, and a constitutional anendment to allow the borrowing of dollars for transportation infrastructure. There is only so many tax dollars to go around - this is evident in every facet of Oklahoma’s public domain. In the meantime toll roads are the financially responsible way to add highways that are otherwise not feasible in Oklahoma’s current state.

[Plutonic Panda]

That’s my point, Catch. I’m not saying that we need a freeway network as expansion as Phoenix or all roads need to be made free with no increase in funding for ODOT. Quite the contrary.

[BoulderSooner]

Right so that must mean Oklahoma can’t even build any road at all for free because Arizona was never Oklahoma’s size with non tolled freeways facilities. That’s it. There’s no way to do it even though I’ve provided numerous examples. Every state like Arizona and Utah just hit some magic number in their population where all of their toll roads were removed.

Arizona has 1,168.64 "free" miles of interstate

Oklahoma has 930.16 "free" miles of interstate ...

so again what are you talking about ..