Sunset Amphitheater

[Zuplar]

Yeah, the widening of Sara Rd actually goes much further than 29th. I think down to 59th Street.

Sara Road is(has) being widened all the way to SH 152 (SW 74th). Mustang just finished their one mile portion of the project. Only took them 6 years!

[HangryHippo]

Sara Road is(has) being widened all the way to SH 152 (SW 74th). Mustang just finished their one mile portion of the project. Only took them 6 years!

Felt like more, tbh.

[yukong]

Yeah, the widening of Sara Rd actually goes much further than 29th. I think down to 59th Street.

It goes all the way to Hwy 152 in Mustang.

[Pete]

Broken Arrow to be site of $93M amphitheater project
By: Jeff Elkins//The Journal Record//October 4, 2023//

A Colorado Springs-based hospitality company continues its expansion with a second Oklahoma music venue planned for the largest suburb in the Tulsa metro.

Notes Live announced Wednesday it will build its next amphitheater in Broken Arrow. The company expects the 12,500-capacity, state-of-the-art amphitheater to transform the area’s nightlife and music scene.

The venue, named the Sunset Amphitheatre until a naming rights deal is completed, will be located on a large lot north of Broken Arrow Events Park, just east of the Creek Turnpike.

It’s modeled after the company’s food and music center in Colorado Springs and will feature luxury fire pit suites available for one-time purchase, traditionally reserved seating in the upper and lower bowls, a landscaped grass berm and custom-built owners club suites.

The $93 million project is a public-private partnership between Notes Live and the city of Broken Arrow. It’s the next venue in Notes Live founder J.W. Roth’s effort to invest $1 billion, expanding to 10 markets with close to 1 million people, which also includes Oklahoma City. The Tulsa metro area has 1,033,157 residents, according to recent census data.

Roth said Broken Arrow is a place that has everything except for a venue to attract national acts to play music outdoors.

“We can’t wait to really dig in, working with the city and its residents to create the region’s most vibrant, world-class entertainment experience at our upcoming outdoor amphitheater,” Roth said in a statement.

City leaders also expressed excitement Wednesday. Broken Arrow Mayor Debra Wimpee called Events Park the perfect location for an amphitheater, which coincidentally was included in its master plan.

“The park is equipped with an abundance of land and opportunity while having a successful record of accommodating many different types of events and activities in the past,” Wimpee said in a statement. “I look forward to the day when Events Park is a shared home for amazing concerts on one end and community events and celebrations on the other side.”

Broken Arrow City Manager Michael Spurgeon said municipalities should strive to bring options for passive and recreational activity to their communities, and this is an example of an effort to bring not only entertainment, but also considerable economic development to the area.

According to a release, the Sunset development will support more than 630 direct and indirect jobs and generate an annual economic impact that exceeds $211 million. The Sunset Amphitheatre’s construction is projected to begin in 2024, and Notes Live looks to open the outdoor venue in summer 2025.

“There is much work to do, including providing the public infrastructure – roads, parking, water, etc. – and the construction of the venue itself, before our community can revel in the amazing atmosphere the amphitheater will eventually afford its guests,” Spurgeon said.

[Pete]

City of Broken Arrow press release:

**************

Council approves amphitheater agreement
Post Date:10/03/2023 8:13 p.m.

The Broken Arrow City Council authorized an economic development agreement between the City of Broken Arrow and Sunset at Broken Arrow, LLC, to bring a large-scale outdoor entertainment venue to the city’s southeast side.

The agreement was approved during the Council’s public meeting on Oct. 3.

The public/private partnership includes a 12,500-seat capacity outdoor amphitheater for live, major musical acts on 13 acres near Events Park.

“Live music venues have long been a desire of Broken Arrow citizens, and this public/private partnership to bring a world-class entertainment complex to Events Park, will generate experiences that become life-long memories for residents and visitors of BA,” said Broken Arrow Mayor Debra Wimpee.

Sunset at Broken Arrow, LLC is a subsidiary of Notes Live, one of the fastest-growing entertainment and hospitality companies in the United States. Sunset has committed a $70 million capital investment on the entertainment complex and a minimum of 45 scheduled events that are projected to generate nearly $4 million in city sales tax and $934,000 in ad valorem tax revenues annually. The estimated annual economic impact is $211 million.

The City of Broken Arrow has agreed to perform approximately $20 million in public infrastructure improvements at Events Park including:

A new on-site parking lot with a minimum of 2,360 parking spaces (the city is working with NSU-BA on a lease agreement for an additional 1,000 parking spots)
Stormwater detention facilities improvements
Road improvements within Events Park
Road improvements to connect access to State Highway 51 to provide more entry and exit points at Events Park
Road improvements on New Orleans Street (101st Street)
Waterline improvements serving the amphitheater
Engineering firm Kimley Horn has been retained to begin the design work of the public infrastructure improvements.

The City is working on the creation of a sales tax only Tax Increment Finance (TIF) District to fund its share of the project.

City leaders are negotiating the purchase of an adjacent 41 acres of private property north of Events Park for the proposed location of the amphitheater. At least 13 acres are expected to be sold to Sunset.

“Sunset’s intention to build a state-of-the-art amphitheater in Broken Arrow to bring live entertainment for citizens and visitors, proves yet again, our city is an environment that supports private investment,” said Broken Arrow City Manager Michael Spurgeon.

The construction of the amphitheater will likely begin in 2024 and is projected to be completed by Dec. 31, 2025. It is expected to provide Broken Arrow with a significant attraction that will expand employment, enhance the tax base, and attract major investment. According to the agreement, the complex will provide approximately 80 to 90 full-time positions, an additional 150 indirect jobs, and generate approximately $85 million in annual sales.

“This public/private partnership is the latest example of Broken Arrow’s commitment to seek out and attract economic development opportunities that enhance BA’s profile as the best community in Oklahoma to live, work, and play,” Spurgeon said. “There is a lot of work to do, including providing the public infrastructure – roads, parking, water, etc. – and the construction of the venue itself, before our community benefits from the amphitheater opening to the public sometime in 2026.”

[chssooner]

I just hope the OKC one gets built first! Get it established as a venue before undercutting it with one 100 miles away.

[SEMIweather]

Well, they are both going to be managed by the same company (if either/both of them actually get built), so ultimately I'd expect that it will come down to which location can get better attendance figures. This might actually be better for OKC given that both amphitheaters are now going to be in a nondescript location right off of a turnpike, whereas the original Tulsa location was objectively better than the OKC location, IMO.

[victorparknews]

Notes Live CEO says they'll be able to drop the temperature in the amphitheater by 20 degrees.
He addressed concerns about traffic and road conditions.
OKC and OTA is working on improving the area...

https://okcfox.com/news/fox-25-inves...ox-25-jw-roth-

[Plutonic Panda]

They want to build an underpass connecting both sides of the development here.

[warreng88]

An article in the oklahoman today about this. Things I noticed:

"Each buyer (investor) is provided a prospectus with detailed contract terms, and one was provided to The Oklahoman. The prospectus shows firepit buyers not only own the firepit seating suites, but also will get $7 for each ticket sold for shows at the amphitheater. Depending on investment level and ticket use, buyers are told they can expect a targeted return of up to 19%."

"Oklahoma City officials confirmed they already had plans funded to widen SW 15 at the Kilpatrick Turnpike, which is needed to accommodate traffic generated by the amphitheater. Roth said “ample parking” for 12,000 music fans has been secured with developers of the adjoining Mustang Creek Crossing shopping center."

"Roth said the Notes Live amphitheaters also are being spaced out to ensure they support concert tours without cannibalizing each market. “Let’s say Van Morrison is playing Broken Arrow,” Roth said. “Two days later Van Morrison is playing Oklahoma City. And two days after that he is playing at my amphitheater in the DFW metroplex. Fifty percent of the way between Broken Arrow and Oklahoma City is my market.”

"Easy access was another issue, and the location chosen in Oklahoma City is along an abandoned stretch of the Kilpatric Turnpike that is in close proximity to the toll road and Interstate 40. The site was chosen, Worth said, because the amphitheater can be designed to keep noise directed to the highway and at a volume no greater than what is produced by passing traffic. He said sound studies are being done by New York City-based LSTN Consultants. "

https://www.oklahoman.com/story/news...e/70833377007/

[TheTravellers]

Every single firepit owner will get $7 from every single ticket sold? Seems unsustainable to me, or else the wording is off and that's not what they mean...

[warreng88]

Every single firepit owner will get $7 from every single ticket sold? Seems unsustainable to me, or else the wording is off and that's not what they mean...

Yeah, if every firepit owner got $7 per ticket and it seats 12,000, that would be $84,000 per concert. If the memberships/suites are from $125,000 to $650,000 (which is what the ownership states), the lower area would pay off in two shows... Something has to be off here or I don't understand it.

[Urbanized]

^^^^^^
I suspect that the actual deal is that they get $7 from every ticket sold in their suite. Meaning if they decline to buy the tickets for their suite on any given show, they'll get $7 of the proceeds per ticket when the venue sells their suite. And, depending on what the suiteholder deal is for shows - they probably still have to buy tickets, at the very least maybe after they hit a base number of shows in their own suite - they would get a $7/ticket discount on face.

[warreng88]

^^^^^^
I suspect that the actual deal is that they get $7 from every ticket sold in their suite. Meaning if they decline to buy the tickets for their suite on any given show, they'll get $7 of the proceeds per ticket when the venue sells their suite. And, depending on what the suiteholder deal is for shows - they probably still have to buy tickets, at the very least maybe after they hit a base number of shows in their own suite - they would get a $7/ticket discount on face.

Yeah, I didn't read it that way at all... If that is the deal, that makes a lot more sense.

[Urbanized]

^^^^^^^
Yeah, total supposition on my part but would make sense. Clearly something was lost in translation.

[Pete]

An article in the oklahoman today about this. Things I noticed:

"Each buyer (investor) is provided a prospectus with detailed contract terms, and one was provided to The Oklahoman. The prospectus shows firepit buyers not only own the firepit seating suites, but also will get $7 for each ticket sold for shows at the amphitheater. Depending on investment level and ticket use, buyers are told they can expect a targeted return of up to 19%."

"Oklahoma City officials confirmed they already had plans funded to widen SW 15 at the Kilpatrick Turnpike, which is needed to accommodate traffic generated by the amphitheater. Roth said “ample parking” for 12,000 music fans has been secured with developers of the adjoining Mustang Creek Crossing shopping center."

"Roth said the Notes Live amphitheaters also are being spaced out to ensure they support concert tours without cannibalizing each market. “Let’s say Van Morrison is playing Broken Arrow,” Roth said. “Two days later Van Morrison is playing Oklahoma City. And two days after that he is playing at my amphitheater in the DFW metroplex. Fifty percent of the way between Broken Arrow and Oklahoma City is my market.”

"Easy access was another issue, and the location chosen in Oklahoma City is along an abandoned stretch of the Kilpatric Turnpike that is in close proximity to the toll road and Interstate 40. The site was chosen, Worth said, because the amphitheater can be designed to keep noise directed to the highway and at a volume no greater than what is produced by passing traffic. He said sound studies are being done by New York City-based LSTN Consultants. "

https://www.oklahoman.com/story/news...e/70833377007/

Complete infomercial in regards to a company that has bought at least 20 full-page ads in the Oklahoman and is still very much trying to find investors.

Just printing what this guy wants out there. No research, context, or fact-checking. Super irresponsible and plenty of con men have played Lackmeyer in a similar way while defrauding people in the process. Not saying this project or person are frauds, but the whole thing is very strange.

In the splashy front-page article in the print version that was delivered this morning, the writer incorrectly called the CEO "Worth" rather than "Roth" 14 different times. Was posted online with the same glaring error before being corrected.

Also, a little bit of digging reveals Roth declared bankruptcy (2001) as have two of his companies.

[TheTravellers]

^^^^^^^
Yeah, total supposition on my part but would make sense. Clearly something was lost in translation.

Yep, your explanation makes sense, and I was kind of thinking along those lines, but didn't have the time to do much more thinking about it, thx...

[shavethewhales]

Am I still the only one that thinks the design is terrible? Aside from all the red flags about the developers, I am still questioning the basic economic logic behind this development. What bands are they bringing in? If it's going to be mostly country/gospel/christian etc I can kind of get it, but for most rock shows this ampitheatre setup would suck. Too much open space dedicated to the "fireplace pits". Most of the crowd is set back way far away from the stage. It would create a weird vibe for everything that isn't low-energy music to begin with. Seems like they are going to compete with the Casino circuit more than anything...

Will those acts really sell 12,000 tickets? Will lots of people want to shell out for the pits/drink and food service/etc. to make this place work? I'm just scratching my head to think of WHO would be coming so many times a year that would fit this venue. A lot of the major acts would rather play at Paycom if it's available. Not many acts are big enough for this venue yet low energy enough for the ambiance they are going for.

Admittedly, I don't go to many shows at amphitheaters, but I do go to a lot of shows and festivals and I don't see this seating arrangement being appealing for any band I would want to see.

Comparing to the Walmart Amp, they have an area of seating near the front that is more high end/exclusive, but beyond that the tiers aren't as overtly obvious. Most other famous ampitheatre venues don't have major sections broken up like this one. Maybe Hollywood Bowl in LA, but it's a bit different and they don't have a ton of high energy concerts there from what I've seen - mostly singers and orchestra.

[chssooner]

Am I still the only one that thinks the design is terrible? Aside from all the red flags about the developers, I am still questioning the basic economic logic behind this development. What bands are they bringing in? If it's going to be mostly country/gospel/christian etc I can kind of get it, but for most rock shows this ampitheatre setup would suck. Too much open space dedicated to the "fireplace pits". Most of the crowd is set back way far away from the stage. It would create a weird vibe for everything that isn't low-energy music to begin with. Seems like they are going to compete with the Casino circuit more than anything...

Will those acts really sell 12,000 tickets? Will lots of people want to shell out for the pits/drink and food service/etc. to make this place work? I'm just scratching my head to think of WHO would be coming so many times a year that would fit this venue. A lot of the major acts would rather play at Paycom if it's available. Not many acts are big enough for this venue yet low energy enough for the ambiance they are going for.

Admittedly, I don't go to many shows at amphitheaters, but I do go to a lot of shows and festivals and I don't see this seating arrangement being appealing for any band I would want to see.

Comparing to the Walmart Amp, they have an area of seating near the front that is more high end/exclusive, but beyond that the tiers aren't as overtly obvious. Most other famous ampitheatre venues don't have major sections broken up like this one. Maybe Hollywood Bowl in LA, but it's a bit different and they don't have a ton of high energy concerts there from what I've seen - mostly singers and orchestra.

Are you new? Look at all the rock shows thst go to amphitheater over the summer. Dozens of large traveling rock festivals and tours go every year.

And yes, they will. OKC gets passed over by bands and tours in the 10-12k range that go to amphitheaters, because we have the Zoo Amp at 7k.

I mean, seriously, just look at the acts who play at Walmart Amp. All genres, not just country or gospel. At least look and see what these amphitheaters provide, show-wise.

Not bashing you, but you bashed this based off amphitheaters not getting an eclectic mix of shows, when thst is, at its core, factually incorrect.

[Pete]

I don't think OKC gets passed over due to not having a venue that seats 12,000 for a concert.

Many/most at Paycom are that size; unless they sell tickets behind the stage, which is rare.

[shavethewhales]

Are you new? Look at all the rock shows thst go to amphitheater over the summer. Dozens of large traveling rock festivals and tours go every year.

And yes, they will. OKC gets passed over by bands and tours in the 10-12k range that go to amphitheaters, because we have the Zoo Amp at 7k.

I mean, seriously, just look at the acts who play at Walmart Amp. All genres, not just country or gospel. At least look and see what these amphitheaters provide, show-wise.

Not bashing you, but you bashed this based off amphitheaters not getting an eclectic mix of shows, when thst is, at its core, factually incorrect.

I don't think you understood what I was getting at, at all. It's not the amphitheater being an amphitheater that is the problem, it's the weird segmentation in its specific design. I compared the Walmart Amp because it doesn't have a design that very similar. The Zoo Amp is another example of an amphitheater that doesn't have this design or reliance on food/drink service to the pits. The Zoo amp does well, but it's a completely different economic logic that doesn't rely on the investment in these fireplace pits.

Both the Zoo and Walmart Amp get good mixes of music, but they are more or less open amphitheaters where the vibe could work with anything. Would you want to go see a punk rock show at a place where you had to sit way back and look out over the high rollers in their fancy pits?

[Pete]

^

The better question is: Why would someone prefer to sit out in completely uncovered elements with a large number of seats very far away from the stage and vastly inferior acoustics vs. Paycom?

Apart from California, most newish amphitheaters have a good portion of the seats covered both to protect from the elements and provide much better acoustics. What happens if it's raining or blistering hot or freezing cold or the typical Oklahoma wind is blowing the sound around or nearly away? Acts and their booking agents care very much about these things as they obviously want to sell as many tickets as possible.

The $1 billion+ new arena will be even better in about 5-6 years.

This place and Paycom will have a similar capacity and if you want a suite experience, you can get a real suite at Paycom. Not exactly sure what need this facility will be filling, other than a money grab by the developers.

[Pete]

One more big thing no one has mentioned: this amphitheater is very flat.

Most are built into large hillsides to provide slope and better sight lines, bring the audience closer to the stage, and aid acoustics by helping to trap the sound. Or, they are built in a stadium-type structure to provide all these things.

You can see from the rendering that there isn't much grade change anywhere on this project. Not a huge deal in a smaller venue but at this scale a lot of the seats will be very far from the stage.

It reminds me of the Shoreline Amphitheater in the Bay Area. I saw the B-52s there and we were out on the grass which was very far away and we spent the whole night watching the video screens. It completely sucked, even in the gorgeous California weather.

[warreng88]

One more big thing no one has mentioned: this amphitheater is very flat.

Most are built into large hillsides to provide slope and better sight lines, bring the audience closer to the stage, and aid acoustics by helping to trap the sound. Or, they are built in a stadium-type structure to provide all these things.

You can see from the rendering that there isn't much grade change anywhere on this project. Not a huge deal in a smaller venue but at this scale a lot of the seats will be very far from the stage.

It reminds me of the Shoreline Amphitheater in the Bay Area. I saw the B-52s there and we were out on the grass which was very far away and we spent the whole night watching the video screens. It completely sucked, even in the gorgeous California weather.

The rendering you posted on the first post of this thread make it seem like a normal amphitheater with the stage lower than the audience. Unless I am missing an updated rendering somewhere.

They are trying to raise investment funds for this site but also Tulsa and a bunch of others around the country:

https://noteslive.vip/properties/okcsunset/

[Paule4ou]

The rendering you posted on the first post of this thread make it seem like a normal amphitheater with the stage lower than the audience. Unless I am missing an updated rendering somewhere.

Indeed. I’ve seen some early stage civil plans and there will be a tremendous amount of dirtwork there. The stage will be well ‘below ground level’ so to speak.