University Town Center

[PhiAlpha]

HA! Yeah, OSU with Gallagher-Iba Arena is really jealous of this proposed arena development. How will the "have nots" ever compete with OU in basketball.... Quick, someone call KU and the other have nots and tell them the news hot off the press in Norman.

Gallagher-Iba is really cool or was before it was expanded. Now it's just half empty all the time.

[FighttheGoodFight]

No. You are seeing a non-resident of Norman and an OSU fan raise strawman points to try to be a contrarian. This wouldn't have been announce so publicly after thr debacle of 2017 unless the finer points have been pretty much agreed to.

I live in Norman. Just from groups for my ward on social media and nextdoor people are skeptical again. Obviously we don't have final numbers or any long term projections on anything yet so I am a wait and see type person.

[Pete]

I live in Norman. Just from groups for my ward on social media and nextdoor people are skeptical again. Obviously we don't have final numbers or any long term projections on anything yet so I am a wait and see type person.

The only vote that may be involved would be if public revenue bonds are to be used, but that just requires a simple majority and they almost always pass.

TIF is never put to a public vote, it's up to the City Council and/or the County.

[FighttheGoodFight]

The only vote that may be involved would be if public revenue bonds are to be used, but that just requires a simple majority and they almost always pass.

TIF is never put to a public vote, it's up to the City Council and/or the County.

Yes I am sure you keep up with some of the Norman "politics" and the city council. People get up in a roar and send out recalls when something doesn't go their way. I could see that happening if the vote is remotely close. If it is all yes votes on the city council then it is a done deal for sure.

Sounds closer to a done deal to me but again nothing has been formally brought up to the council as far as I am aware (and could be wrong on that!)

[Pete]

^

No, nothing has been formalized as yet.

But it shouldn't be much longer and that's why they had this press release today.

[jedicurt]

OU couldn't raise money for one on campus but there's a mile long list of donors to build one at UTC with "private dollars"... got it. OU will not be helping at all.

because it's not just an arena... they are investing in something that couldn't be built on campus, they are investing in the full project. this isn't difficult to understand, but you sure are trying everything you can to make it where you don't listen.

[chssooner]

I live in Norman. Just from groups for my ward on social media and nextdoor people are skeptical again. Obviously we don't have final numbers or any long term projections on anything yet so I am a wait and see type person.

I know. But on this forum, the person raising the most cane about it has Poke us his name, signifying his bias, and ignorance any the true financial state of affairs at OU.

[Decious]

So, I'm guessing that Urbanist Poke is an OSU grad who lives in Tulsa? Same guy who said that the Olympics being in OKC was no big deal? If so... why are we spending so much time talking to him about this?

[jedicurt]

If they wanted to do it right and they're buying up Campus Corner too - do it there. .

who is they? these are all separate investment groups and plans, that are not related. and i know this will be hard for you to believe, but OU isn't involved in the Campus Corner project either.

[UrbanistPoke]

Dude. Did you watch your game on Saturday? Don't yall have enough to deal with between being in the middle of nowhere and struggling to compete in football in what's about to be a second tier conference? The Pokes might not win a conference game this season if Gunnar Gundy is the best QB on the roster. It's a little nuts/obsessive that you're hate typing paragraphs about OU's supposed debt problem that only OSU and Texas fans seem to think is a real issue.

Only a slightly unhinged reply haha. I don't think you understand OSU alumni and where did I say anything about football? If OSU proposed an idea like this I would frankly be even more harsh, as would most OSU people. OU fans, especially non alumni, have a really difficult time with reality.

[Pete]

Only a slightly unhinged reply haha. I don't think you understand OSU alumni and where did I say anything about football? If OSU proposed an idea like this I would frankly be even more harsh, as would most OSU people. OU fans, especially non alumni, have a really difficult time with reality.

Ah, the old 'didn't-go-to-school-there' trope.

The entire list of OSU Greatest Hits is now complete.

[Shortsyeararound]

He is just "poke-ing" us into squabbling with someone that is not going to benefit from said project. Do I like the idea of an arena off campus- meh, but if it is better than LNC then yes. The last time I saw the LNC packed was for a Norman North High School graduation before Covid. Something needs to be done. The renderings, while not final, show a top flight facility and look great imo.

[UrbanistPoke]

Do you not realize that UT was able to build their entire 300 mil arena with all private funds from an outside group (Oak View Group) which keeps all the revenue from non UT events for the first 35 years of existence (Opened 2022). UT owns the land (same as OU).

The dorm lawsuit, you really need to read more as your understanding of things OU is exactly what your name insinuates.

Do you realize that what Texas did was actually a great model that OU should try to copy? No? What exactly is your point.

The arena they built is also within walking distance to campus and was built to accommodate music/concerts, etc. They also built it to a size that is realistic to get concerts.

Want to know a reason why arenas under 10,000 seats have a hard time financially? There are pretty limited traveling tours that play in venues of that size where they have to bring their own stage, equipment, etc. That's why they play in PAC's, Casinos, etc. where there's a stage and A/V etc. The costs don't make sense to have an independent tour and only go to venues under 10,000 seats that not are purpose built for music, theater, etc.

OU needs and could support an arena. Doing it at UTC and thinking OU isn't going to be supporting this in some way is just make believe. There are plenty of examples on how to do something like this right and this proposal isn't it. It will ultimately either stick OU with the costs or shift a massive burden on to Norman residents and the city. Either of those are bad. People need to take a breath and think about this a bit more and how crazy this idea really is that's being proposed. Good luck to OU lol.

[jedicurt]

Ah, the old 'didn't-go-to-school-there' trope.

The entire list of OSU Greatest Hits is now complete.

i finally just decided it wasn't worth it and added to ignore list. lol

[chssooner]

We might as well end the discussion. The Poke knows all, and is omniscient, and is able to move goal posts, so we don't stand a chance.

[Anonymous.]

I noticed the FAQ mentions there is no proposed timeline for this project. Since the Campus Corner "leveling" project is also pending in the background, to me it makes sense that these projects could coordinate. So I don't understand why the campus corner area isn't considered for the arena location. Especially with $800MM in private investment is planned (which is for profit sharing from the entertainment district). Isn't that exactly what the new campus corner is supposed to be? Bars, restaurants, hotels, housing. LNC is 3k more capacity than this proposed arena, it could fit somewhere in CC no problem.

Seems like a missed opportunity to do some really cool urban integration for campus corner with the arena as an anchor piece.

[UrbanistPoke]

Ah, the old 'didn't-go-to-school-there' trope.

The entire list of OSU Greatest Hits is now complete.

Again, it's not wrong.

It was an unhinged post, where did I mention football at all or the fact that our football program couldn't use a new coach, etc. I'm not exactly thrilled with our football program.

[jedicurt]

I noticed the FAQ mentions there is no proposed timeline for this project. Since the Campus Corner "leveling" project is also pending in the background, to me it makes sense that these projects could coordinate. So I don't understand why the campus corner area isn't considered for the arena location. Especially with $800MM in private investment is planned (which is for profit sharing from the entertainment district). Isn't that exactly what the new campus corner is supposed to be? Bars, restaurants, hotels, housing. LNC is 3k more capacity than this proposed arena, it could fit somewhere in CC no problem.

Seems like a missed opportunity to do some really cool urban integration for campus corner with the arena as an anchor piece.

because we have two different project groups that have their own ideas of what to do with each. might it be a missed oppotunity, sure, but the group who has been buying up Campus Corner, has their own plan and what they are best at producing. the group with the arena, have different plans for what they want to do. you can't force two different groups of developers to just work together.

[UrbanistPoke]

We might as well end the discussion. The Poke knows all, and is omniscient, and is able to move goal posts, so we don't stand a chance.

The amount of pearl clutching by OU fans here is comical. Good luck with all your debt, university certainly doesn't have any issues with it at all. You will have the #1 basketball program soon, don't worry.

I have not moved the goal posts at all and no one has proved anything I've brought up wrong either. Maybe you all know better than Fitch and other credit rating agencies. Just start your own maybe? Lol

Just poking holes into a dumb proposal. OU fans should expect better, because they could have better. I know, I'm just horrible for saying it and thinking it.

[Pete]

Again, it's not wrong.

Not that it matters, but it is completely wrong in reference to most the people you are arguing with here.

[chssooner]

I noticed the FAQ mentions there is no proposed timeline for this project. Since the Campus Corner "leveling" project is also pending in the background, to me it makes sense that these projects could coordinate. So I don't understand why the campus corner area isn't considered for the arena location. Especially with $800MM in private investment is planned (which is for profit sharing from the entertainment district). Isn't that exactly what the new campus corner is supposed to be? Bars, restaurants, hotels, housing. LNC is 3k more capacity than this proposed arena, it could fit somewhere in CC no problem.

Seems like a missed opportunity to do some really cool urban integration for campus corner with the arena as an anchor piece.

The arena would take up all of CC. There would be minimal mixed-use space available. Plus, I doubt the houses nearby would want an arena there (likely would have more pushback from citizens than this proposed location).

[UrbanistPoke]

The arena would take up all of CC. There would be minimal mixed-use space available. Plus, I doubt the houses nearby would want an arena there (likely would have more pushback from citizens than this proposed location).

You could easily fit an arena north of Rickos Tacos if you clear out some of those older buildings to the north and utilized the parking lots up to Apache. Over 60% of that is parking already and an arena with a parking structure and ground floor retail (look how the Verizon Center was built in DC as a good example) could easily go there.

Another option slightly further north would be the parking lot south of First Baptist.

Or even the parking lot south of Noun along University. That is plenty big enough for an arena to go on and would be 1,000 X better for OU and could be done in a similar private-public partnership. Building out a mixed-use 'urban center' would be 1,000 x more viable there than in a suburban wasteland like UTC.

[warreng88]

i finally just decided it wasn't worth it and added to ignore list. lol

Agreed. Getting dangerously close to OKVision4U territory...

[UrbanistPoke]

Agreed. Getting dangerously close to OKVision4U territory...

LOL - Sooner fans... if a few critiques on a dumb proposal hurts your feelings that much put me on ignore now. Just bury your head in the sand that OU can't do better and doesn't deserve better of a new arena proposal than some dumb faux entertainment strip mall in UTC when they could do something way better around Campus Corner or elsewhere. Especially if the university is acquiring land and planning a redevelopment of Campus Corner this is just a massive, massive miss. Only endless sunshine pumpers allowed on OKCTalk, I forget.

[Anonymous.]

The arena would take up all of CC. There would be minimal mixed-use space available. Plus, I doubt the houses nearby would want an arena there (likely would have more pushback from citizens than this proposed location).

I just used Google to measure square footage of all of [the main part] of campus corner (minus NOUN hotel and Boyd House for obvious reasons). The total land sq ft is over 500K.

Using the same thing, I took the square footage of the current LNC (Which is 3K more capacity than this proposed arena) and the total land sq ft is under 190K.

Obviously you will need parking for the arena, but the entire campus corner area needs structured parking anyways. To me, it doesn't seem like such a crazy idea.