Preftakes Block

[Kerry]

I'd see that as a pretty short-sighted historic view there Kerry. I thought you were such a preservation proponent. I can't remember then name of the building with the green awning, but I would compare that much the same to the Montgomery. That building is a jewel, and you wouldn't want to see it go would you? That block is filled with mostly boring blah brick-faced buildings that have seen more neglect than care over the last 20 years. I would just say that we can't use a broad tipped brush when we look at it, it's got to be a fine point. Something like the city building is also a jem...id hate to lose it....which happens to be across the street from the Montgomery.

What's so weird here is that normally I would think that if someone was buying up land like that, they would have a plan for something to take up the whole block. BUUUUUT, with all the class A space opening up from Devon moving, there isn't really a need for new office space right now. So unless it's going to be built for a specific company, I don't get it. Otherwise, why would someone buy up land in a block like this.....the properties aren't all good investments....unless he thinks he's buying them for no other reason than to grow the value and sell them off later. In which case....borrrrring.

Bomber - as Metro pointed out, the building with the green awning is not on the same block. Also, I am not a preservationist, I am a new urbanist (I think). If tearing down old buildings and replacing them with new buildings increases urban density then I am all for it. If density can be increased while re-using exisiting buildings I am all for that as well. My goal is increasing urban density.

The City office building is really cool but Preftakes doesn't own it and I don't see the city giving up ownership. The bus station would make a cool Johnny Rockets.

[Pete]

One idea is to move the Lunch Box to a renovated bus station. It's a perfect spot for a diner and the Lunch Box building is right in the middle of all his properties.

Then, he could develop condos/offices between the bus station and One North Hudson along Sheridan. He could also do the same along Main Street (I'm afraid all those small buildings are going to come down) and use the big parking garage to service both new developments.

[Kerry]

... and use the big parking garage to service both new developments.

What is the current condition of the auto-hotel. Is it currently being used a parking garage? If not, how bad a shape is it in?

[Pete]

The American Motor Hotel is currently used as a parking garage but could be easily adapted for other uses:

[Pete]

Here are the properties along Main, moving east to west:

#8 Carpenter Square



#7 408 W. Main


#6 412 W. Main


#5 416 W. Main (I believe this is currently used as apartment(s)


#1 434 W. Main

[Pete]

And for good measure, here are the properties along Sheridan, again moving east to west:

#15 One North Hudson


#14 407 W. Sheridan


#13 Lunch Box


#12 Demolished


#11 Bus Station

[metro]

Great pics Pete. To clarify, #13 barely shows the lunch box and #15 is he old Hotel Black in case anyone is wondering.

[shane453]

I would really, really hate to see 1 N Hudson, Auto Hotel, or the City Office building come down. As far as I am concerned there is no development that could EVER warrant the demolition of either building. Along with Hightower, these buildings are the most beautiful concentrated set of large historic buildings we have left.

Plus, all three buildings are in good shape and currently being used. The Auto Hotel is the only one that should even be debatable.

[earlywinegareth]

Tear it down and build an awesome high-end retail shopping place a la City Creek in Salt Lake. That my $.02. http://www.downtownrising.com/index.php/retail

[Kerry]

I would really, really hate to see 1 N Hudson, Auto Hotel, or the City Office building come down. As far as I am concerned there is no development that could EVER warrant the demolition of either building. Along with Hightower, these buildings are the most beautiful concentrated set of large historic buildings we have left.

Plus, all three buildings are in good shape and currently being used. The Auto Hotel is the only one that should even be debatable.

I can think of thousands of developments from around the world that would warrant the destruction of every brick on that block.

[MIKELS129]

Tear it down and build an awesome high-end retail shopping place a la City Creek in Salt Lake. That my $.02. http://www.downtownrising.com/index.php/retail

Wow I hope not, we tried that along time ago

[Kerry]

Wow I hope not, we tried that along time ago

No. What OKC tried before was 'tear it down and they will come". That is how we ended up with more acres of grass than any downtown in America.

[Chicken In The Rough]

He's got to at least preserve the bus station's sign. The station itself is not all that great (at least in the picture above).

[betts]

I love the bus station, and the Carpenter Square building. The bus station would make a great restaurant, with outdoor dining under the awnings. The other buildings, rehabbed, would be great for retail and/or restaurants. We've got all the Core to Shore land to build developments. Let's keep a small piece of our past, and create a great little destination area.

[BDP]

No. What OKC tried before was 'tear it down and they will come". That is how we ended up with more acres of grass than any downtown in America.

Which is really why we shouldn't tear anything else down until the market at least dictates it. We have SOOOOO much room with real estate committed to nothing or to surface parking. We are in a great position going forward to preserve what's left of our urban heritage AND create a totally new one. We don't have to give up anything for new development and it's totally foolish to do so. What we probably really need is a complete moratorium on demolition for at least a decade. We should at least try and build on what was torn down first.

Now if we were a city with limited space, then I would agree, but we're the complete opposite. The worst thing we could do is tear down buildings in order to leave other lots sitting empty. Doing so does nothing to help the current lack of density problem and really slows down the property appreciation of all of downtown. It won't really start improving until its built out and denser to achieve the synergies that are the whole point of city centers to begin with.

[leprechaun]

I have a horrible feeling about this. The thought of this whole block coming down is extremely depressing, especially when some of the buildings are currently being used, with others that could most likely be rehabbed. Unless he simply plans to resell for profit, I can't imagine any other reason to buy these buildings than to tear them down. That block has the best urban character in the city in my opinion. With all of the development nearby, these buildings would fill with tenants in no time, even if they had to be rehabbed. This block has amazing mixed use potential. In ten years I could picture this block filled with pedestrians. Let's preserve what character we have left, and build on one of the MANY empty lots in the downtown area, because tearing down these great buildings makes little sense. Oh wait I forgot, Preftakes could care less what some random urban enthusiast desires, as a business man he is probably just trying to make a profit.

If I am going to accept that these buildings are going to be demolished, not only does the new development have to have equal or more density in terms of building height and width, it would have to create a mixed use environment that is built for pedestrian use. For example, using this site for the convention center would be an absolute failure and disaster.

[leprechaun]

What is 15 One North Hudson being used for? That building is prime for condos or apartments. This block reminds me of Seinfeld's neighborhood in Manhattan.

[Kerry]

lep - I don't think he will be tearing down the significant structures on that block. I agree with Pete - all the one and two story buildings are not long for this world.

[ZYX2]

Kerry, I will have to disagree with you. An enjoyable urban city has more than just population density. You have to have some character and history mixed in with all of that. Also, your statement about why we can't build something with just as much character is completely wrong in my opinion. No matter how much I like the design of any new building, it does not match the character of most historic buildings. I think buildings, if well kept, can only increase in character. They will have more character because 50 years from now we will have a completely different architectural style. A new modern. And since today's new "modern" building would no longer be modern 50 years from now, it would have more character because that style of building would no longer be constructed. I hope that makes sense.

But, this is only my opinion on the matter, and it may be completely different from yours.

[stlokc]

No, no, no. Mr. Preftakes: Please don't demolish those buildings! Look at that street-level retail space, reiminiscent of Automobile Alley and not much else in OKC. Look at the character of several small buildings of varying heights and styles, most of which looks to be in good shape. There is precious little of this kind of thing anywhere in town. Even if we could be assured of a 40-story skyscraper on that entire block, it still would be a poor substitute. Don't get rid of this history! There are so many vacant lots where another brand-new structure could be built.

[Doug Loudenback]

Huh? Please explain.

[Doug Loudenback]

One idea is to move the Lunch Box to a renovated bus station. It's a perfect spot for a diner and the Lunch Box building is right in the middle of all his properties.

Then, he could develop condos/offices between the bus station and One North Hudson along Sheridan. He could also do the same along Main Street (I'm afraid all those small buildings are going to come down) and use the big parking garage to service both new developments.

Lest we forget, the Coney's place on Main Street could go into such a project, too ... but I fear that the charm of the rustic old but great place to get a hot dog would be forever lost in a more modern building. Part of its present charm is its très trashy mystique (plus having some of the best dogs in Oklahoma City).

[Reno and Walker]

Doug coney island is holding out for more $ I talked with him yesterday. Bus Station is also holding out for more $

[Pete]

R&W, is Preftakes interested in buying Main Place (owned by the City of OKC)?

[Reno and Walker]

I do not think so, I believe he is going to work something out with Devon