Pedestrian Bridge planned accross Northwest Expressway & Wilshire Boulevard

[shartel_ave]

The Oklahoman lets you have x number of free articles. After the bridge one l have 1 left.

thats why I say clear your history and cookies and flush the dns if you know how

cmd line ipconfig /flushdns

[Plutonic Panda]

It's a professional opinion but go off I guess, since you know better.

Okay so at grade crossings are safer than grade separated ones. Hmmmm, or maybe these “professional opinions” just don’t like the fact it also does allow automobile traffic to benefit as well so more of the same “cars bad” type crap.

[Bellaboo]

I drove that section for 23 years. Multiple issues with pedestrians, bicyclist and other cars. It makes good sense to separate.

And with the growth to the Northwest, I don't think the traffic counts are going down unless the Kilpatrick gets extended use.

[Bored UCO Student]

Trying to argue against traffic counts here seems very silly. It may be around 50,000 now but this bridge is in the fastest growing part of the city and the state? Being from Piedmont, I can say almost the entire population of that city/town use NW Expressway daily. On almost any listicle you look at in the last 5 years about the fastest growing cities in the state, Piedmont is listed at or near the top. That's not taking into account the almost 7 mile outstretch of OKC along the Expressway from Morgan Rd which reaches 2-4 miles N/S towards Yukon/Piedmont that is growing just as fast.

So, even if the traffic counts aren't extravagant now, who's to say they won't be in 10-15 years? This is a good project.

[shartel_ave]

Okay so at grade crossings are safer than grade separated ones. Hmmmm, or maybe these “professional opinions” just don’t like the fact it also does allow automobile traffic to benefit as well so more of the same “cars bad” type crap.

Not an opinion did you not read the articles backed up with facts?

https://www.itdp.org/2019/10/01/pede...building-them/

https://usa.streetsblog.org/2018/03/...g-and-transit/

[Plutonic Panda]

Not an opinion did you not read the articles backed up with facts?

https://www.itdp.org/2019/10/01/pede...building-them/

https://usa.streetsblog.org/2018/03/...g-and-transit/

Streetsblog, what a source

the bridge collapse was a failure of street design and transportation planning by Miami Dade County and Florida DOT.

lol no it was a result of an engineering flaw from the same firm that had contracts with Texas to build two massive bridges and are now removed and the bridges are likely going to have to be demoed and started from scratch. You used a very rare and isolated event.

So let’s look at how many pedestrians die from crossing at grade versus a dedicated bridge to separate them from automobile and other traffic. Let’s look at those facts. Are we really trying to make the argument that if Las Vegas removed all of its pedestrian bridges and converted them back to at grade crossings it would be safer? Because that’s the argument you and the others here against the NWE bike/ped bridge are making.

Grade separated crossings are safer every singe time. It isn’t an opinion. Reduction in conflict points is the number one key to reducing accidents.

I mean here is article after article about how grade separation is safer:

https://policy.tti.tamu.edu/strategy/grade-separation/

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grade_separation

https://sanjosespotlight.com/philbri...s-people-safe/

It’s amazing to me we even have to have this discussion. Anti car publications like strongtowns, curbed, streetsblog, etc. repeat the same nonsense about induced demand so don’t widen freeways, cars don’t belong in cities because they make them unlivable, skyscrapers are bad because cities should be more human scale(which is a stupid POV), blah blah blah and of course anything like sky bridges or underground pedestrian corridors are bad because they contribute to a reduction in street activity. Yeah right, let’s make pedestrians suffer heat, cold, rain, snow, etc. just so we can them on the streets walking and feel better about the street being busy because that’s what most important.

And of course this grade separation will make crossing NWE safer for cyclists and pedestrians ten fold since they won’t need to rely on drivers following the law not running red lights or paying attention which many often don’t. But hey, since this will *also* benefit car drivers it must be bad. Give me a break.

[shartel_ave]

Streetsblog, what a source



lol no it was a result of an engineering flaw from the same firm that had contracts with Texas to build two massive bridges and are now removed and the bridges are likely going to have to be demoed and started from scratch. You used a very rare and isolated event.

So let’s look at how many pedestrians die from crossing at grade versus a dedicated bridge to separate them from automobile and other traffic. Let’s look at those facts. Are we really trying to make the argument that if Las Vegas removed all of its pedestrian bridges and converted them back to at grade crossings it would be safer? Because that’s the argument you and the others here against the NWE bike/ped bridge are making.

Grade separated crossings are safer every singe time. It isn’t an opinion. Reduction in conflict points is the number one key to reducing accidents.

I mean here is article after article about how grade separation is safer:

https://policy.tti.tamu.edu/strategy/grade-separation/

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grade_separation

https://sanjosespotlight.com/philbri...s-people-safe/

It’s amazing to me we even have to have this discussion. Anti car publications like strongtowns, curbed, streetsblog, etc. repeat the same nonsense about induced demand so don’t widen freeways, cars don’t belong in cities because they make them unlivable, skyscrapers are bad because cities should be more human scale(which is a stupid POV), blah blah blah and of course anything like sky bridges or underground pedestrian corridors are bad because they contribute to a reduction in street activity. Yeah right, let’s make pedestrians suffer heat, cold, rain, snow, etc. just so we can them on the streets walking and feel better about the street being busy because that’s what most important.

And of course this grade separation will make crossing NWE safer for cyclists and pedestrians ten fold since they won’t need to rely on drivers following the law not running red lights or paying attention which many often don’t. But hey, since this will *also* benefit car drivers it must be bad. Give me a break.

You act like the articles don’t show the stats concerning the subject

NW Expressway is not a highway

Using Las Vegas as an example is not the same

The strip is not bike path it is completely full of pedestrians all year around

And the stats show most people don’t use the pedestrian bridges

[Plutonic Panda]

You act like the articles don’t show the stats concerning the subject

NW Expressway is not a highway

Using Las Vegas as an example is not the same

The strip is not bike path it is completely full of pedestrians all year around

And the stats show most people don’t use the pedestrian bridges

Okay you’re trying to move the goalpost. The topic is what is safer, grade crossing or grade separation. I told you the answer. You asked me to back it up. Not only did I do that, but I also gave you examples to think about like Las Vegas not to compare this bridge to it but factor in the safety of grade separations.

At this point we’re going in circles. The bridge is going to be built. These are very common in other cities and it’s nice to see OKC get on the ball with it. I’ve made my points and have nothing further to say at this time.

[jn1780]

If I were still riding I would not be a fan of that design. Or any on grade design on a street as crazy as NW Expressway. Way too many drivers on NW Expressway that pay zero attention to where they're supposed to stop at intersections. And some that believe red isn't really red until it's been red for a second or two. I've been across that intersection a thousand times and it was bad. That design would be an improvement but still not a fraction as safe as the bridge.

Yeah, Arjan Jager's designs have to be applied EVERYWHERE not just one intersection and its a culture mindset that has to exist in the entire community The key point aspect in his designs are that they slow traffic down. NW expressway is not an urban area. Might as well be suggesting that some trees and a pedestrian cross walk on I-40 is good enough to make it safer for pedestrians to cross.

[baralheia]

You act like the articles don’t show the stats concerning the subject

NW Expressway is not a highway

It literally is though. NW Expressway is Oklahoma State Highway 3.

[LakeEffect]

Yeah and their opinion is utterly ridiculous. I’ve read the same thing from other urbanists who don’t like grade separations for stuff like this. It’s a ridiculous argument. It’s safer to separate the grades by modes of transport.

Even the Dutch do stuff like this now and then... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hovenring

Grade separation of a 45 mph (speed limited) intersection is good. To do an at-grade crossing safely, you'd need to spend millions more redoing car lanes, slowing traffic, etc. You'd also really need to just reconfigure the land uses in the adjacent 10 square miles... it's a long term goal, but it's not a good fix for this spot. Let's stop debating the need and start watching them finally finish construction...

[citywokchinesefood]

Okay so at grade crossings are safer than grade separated ones. Hmmmm, or maybe these “professional opinions” just don’t like the fact it also does allow automobile traffic to benefit as well so more of the same “cars bad” type crap.

An at grade crossing can positively benefit both sides for less capital investment if it is done properly. Northwest expressway has enough additional room for barrier protected bike lanes and a separate barrier protected walkway. With properly designed intersections and light signaling we could create a safer bicycle and pedestrian infrastructure covering more area and providing help for more people with the money we have invested into this bridge. This bridge is a barrier for the physically disabled and elderly and has no lifts to help mitigate that. In a fantasy world yeah we could have a network of bicycle paths and sidewalks elevated above traffic, but the political will and capital is never going to be available. I think as a city we should try to do the most we can with our tax dollars.

[Plutonic Panda]

Update:

OKLAHOMA CITY (Free Press) — Overnight delivery drivers and early shift workers will have to find a different way through the always-busy intersection of Northwest Expressway and Wilshire from midnight to 5 a.m. Wednesday, Sept. 14.

The span across the expressway will be hoisted into place for a massive pedestrian-bike bridge, a project that has snarled traffic in the area for months already.

- https://freepressokc.com/nw-expy-to-...ight-to-5-a-m/

[KayneMo]

Took these today:

[Bill Robertson]

My wife usually goes by there on the way to work about 5:00AM. She went another way today thinking the schedule might have been held up a bit.

[mugofbeer]

An at grade crossing can positively benefit both sides for less capital investment if it is done properly. Northwest expressway has enough additional room for barrier protected bike lanes and a separate barrier protected walkway. With properly designed intersections and light signaling we could create a safer bicycle and pedestrian infrastructure covering more area and providing help for more people with the money we have invested into this bridge. This bridge is a barrier for the physically disabled and elderly and has no lifts to help mitigate that. In a fantasy world yeah we could have a network of bicycle paths and sidewalks elevated above traffic, but the political will and capital is never going to be available. I think as a city we should try to do the most we can with our tax dollars.

Smh......

[DowntownMan]

Took these today:

That driveway exit from CDR that goes underneath the bridge seems very dangerous. Seems like cars will be turning out onto NW expressway blindly as the concrete wall blocks the view. They shouldn’t have allowed that driveway to continue and forced them to utilize the light.

[shartel_ave]

I drove under this bridge yesterday and it’s a train wreck!

I’ve lived in several countries including 3rd world and seen better pedestrian bridges.

I’d bet everything I have that this bridge will get very little to no traffic it’s a complete waste of money

As a bike rider I’d never use the bridge the south side is a zigzag design

The engineers that designed this need to be terminated

[shartel_ave]

An at grade crossing can positively benefit both sides for less capital investment if it is done properly. Northwest expressway has enough additional room for barrier protected bike lanes and a separate barrier protected walkway. With properly designed intersections and light signaling we could create a safer bicycle and pedestrian infrastructure covering more area and providing help for more people with the money we have invested into this bridge. This bridge is a barrier for the physically disabled and elderly and has no lifts to help mitigate that. In a fantasy world yeah we could have a network of bicycle paths and sidewalks elevated above traffic, but the political will and capital is never going to be available. I think as a city we should try to do the most we can with our tax dollars.

I agree with everything said in this comment

OKC has no clue about proper pedestrian planning

NW EXPRESSWAY is not a highway in the city it is a 6 lane road with a ton of stop lights and does not need a pedestrian bridge at any intersection as there is very little pedestrian traffic

[gjl]

I drove under it a few days ago for the first time. Approaching it, it doesn't even appear to be level. It makes the wing decoration on it look peculiar.

[LocoAko]

I agree with everything said in this comment

OKC has no clue about proper pedestrian planning

NW EXPRESSWAY is not a highway in the city it is a 6 lane road with a ton of stop lights and does not need a pedestrian bridge at any intersection as there is very little pedestrian traffic

I don't like the design either but has it ever occurred to you that there's no pedestrian traffic because it is so unsafe? I mean, it will never be 5th Ave, nor should it, but I've seen plenty of people walking in the road/grass down Northwest Expressway, including one man in a wheelchair who was rolling down the street in the road. Safe access like this doesn't need to be bustling with people at all times to make it valuable and an alternative option to the deathtrap that NW Expwy currently is...

[ChaseDweller]

I don't like the design either but has it ever occurred to you that there's no pedestrian traffic because it is so unsafe? I mean, it will never be 5th Ave, nor should it, but I've seen plenty of people walking in the road/grass down Northwest Expressway, including one man in a wheelchair who was rolling down the street in the road. Safe access like this doesn't need to be bustling with people at all times to make it valuable and an alternative option to the deathtrap that NW Expwy currently is...

This bridge is not designed for folks walking or biking on NWE. It's designed to get the existing Hefner-Overholser trail over the road. That's really it. So, while I share everyone's concerns about walkability in OKC, this bridge does what it was designed to do. Was it necessary or worth the money? I don't know. I run that trail on occasion and waiting for a light to cross was really no big deal, but having this bridge will be nice.

[Bellaboo]

I don't like the design either but has it ever occurred to you that there's no pedestrian traffic because it is so unsafe? I mean, it will never be 5th Ave, nor should it, but I've seen plenty of people walking in the road/grass down Northwest Expressway, including one man in a wheelchair who was rolling down the street in the road. Safe access like this doesn't need to be bustling with people at all times to make it valuable and an alternative option to the deathtrap that NW Expwy currently is...

Agree with this 100 percent. Over the years I've seen lots of people walking in the median. Crazy to think this is a bad idea for whatever reason.

[tzshaner]

They have opened all the lanes of traffic on NWE and removed the barricades on that were closing off the right most turn lane of Wilshire. The ramps to the bridge are still blocked off, but the streets are now back to their normal configuration.

[tzshaner]

Does any one know what is currently holding up this bridge from opening? It has been 4 months since they opened up the streets below the bridge but so far it still has tape/boards across the ramps leading up to the bridge.