Lake Hefner at record low water levels, when will city buy Canton water?

[Larry OKC]

Mid: I work in the am a graphic designer & work in the printing industry and while there can be some delays as you described (as in the decision that leads to the policy being approved), often these types of mailers are fast tracked ...designed, approved, printed and mailed within weeks or even days. While I am not against conservation in general and practice it myself without government telling me to do so, to have "Mandatory Odd/Even Lawn Watering" in place as the "Normal" is absurd (language in quotes if from the City flyer/flier).

Also from the flier:

Oklahoma's lakes and reservoirs are still suffering from the drought. And when water levels are down, it's time to dive into action. Oklahoma City and surrounding communities have implemented Progressive Water Conservation Stages. Mandatory odd/even watering (Stage 1) is now permanently in effect.

Emphasis added. What about when water levels are up? By the same rational, they should suspend the mandatory rules.

RadMod: not a climate change denier, just that weather is always changing, but it also goes thru cycles that are sometimes years/or decades in duration.

[mkjeeves]

Developing cities in a way that costs less should just be the standard practice. It wasn't for a long time, so now we're going to have to pay for that with higher fees.

However, this talk of we've gotten a foot of rain in May and the drought is over is just lunacy. We've gone years with below average rainfall and claiming that rains in 2013 have overcome all of that is stupid. People should be conserving water all of the time. There's no need to waste, particularly when we live in an area prone to severe droughts.

If memory serves from Ms. Slaughter's video linked quite a bit upthread, the average household in OKC uses less water than the average household in the nation. Sure, we can always do better. She spoke about the "discretionary use" water that we might capture a part of though conservation, rationing and the like as being somewhat small.

[RadicalModerate]

RadMod: not a climate change denier, just that weather is always changing, but it also goes thru cycles that are sometimes years/or decades in duration.

Exactly. It was a "trick" question. There is no perfect answer.
(if it's been extra dry for several years, then gets really wet, we still need to "conserve" water and use it rationally. right?)

(at least until Canton Lake is full to overflowing again)

(Dune . . . Stranger in a Strange Land . . . The Grapes of Wrath . . . =)

[OKCisOK4me]

At Stars & Stripes Park this evening after work:



At least we can conserve water usage by not using these sprinklers right now!


I like long walks through the water


Enjoy it while is lasts Daffys'!

[Mel]

Exactly. It was a "trick" question. There is no perfect answer.
(if it's been extra dry for several years, then gets really wet, we still need to "conserve" water and use it rationally. right?)

(at least until Canton Lake is full to overflowing again)

(Dune . . . Stranger in a Strange Land . . . The Grapes of Wrath . . . =)

I grok that last line.

[ljbab728]

Developing cities in a way that costs less should just be the standard practice. It wasn't for a long time, so now we're going to have to pay for that with higher fees.

However, this talk of we've gotten a foot of rain in May and the drought is over is just lunacy. We've gone years with below average rainfall and claiming that rains in 2013 have overcome all of that is stupid. People should be conserving water all of the time. There's no need to waste, particularly when we live in an area prone to severe droughts.

No one is advocating doing away with water conservation but saying that the drought is not over is hardly correct. We are definitely not in a drought situation in much of Oklahoma, including the OKC area. This is from before our recent heavy rains.

http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/DM_state.htm?OK,S

Much of the US is drought prone. I remember very well that New York was having a severe drought during the 1964 Worlds Fair in New York City. Oklahoma trucked water there to keep the Oklahoma exhibit nice and green.

http://www.nywf64.com/Image/oklahoma/okla06.jpg

[OKCisOK4me]

I grok that last line.

Damn good book!

[HangryHippo]

No one is advocating doing away with water conservation but saying that the drought is not over is hardly correct. We are definitely not in a drought situation in much of Oklahoma, including the OKC area. This is from before our recent heavy rains.

State Drought Monitor

Much of the US is drought prone. I remember very well that New York was having a severe drought during the 1964 Worlds Fair in New York City. Oklahoma trucked water there to keep the Oklahoma exhibit nice and green.

http://www.nywf64.com/Image/oklahoma/okla06.jpg

Oh come on, man. We'll be right back in a drought just as soon as it heats up. You're part of the problem if you think that the drought just ends like that. We're talking about a problem YEARS in the making.

[law]

Odd and even watering days is just scheduling, not rationing. Canton has had little inflow, so the level has not changed very much. The biggest rains in western OK went to the South Canadian and Cimarron Rivers, not the North Canadian. If you overlay the mesonet 30 day rainfall map with the map of the Canton Lake drainage basin, you will see not much rainfall in the basin.

[Buffalo Bill]

Latest drought monitor map. No surprise that there's significant improvement:

State Drought Monitor

[Teo9969]

Odd and even watering days is just scheduling, not rationing. Canton has had little inflow, so the level has not changed very much. The biggest rains in western OK went to the South Canadian and Cimarron Rivers, not the North Canadian. If you overlay the mesonet 30 day rainfall map with the map of the Canton Lake drainage basin, you will see not much rainfall in the basin.

Canton Acre Feet on date

52105 on 12/25

24793 on 2/21 (-52.4%)

30931 on 04/10 (+24.8%/-40.6%)

34140 on 06/04 (+10.4%/+37.7%/-34.5%)

[law]

The conservation pool only has a little over 20,000 acre feet. You have no rights to the inactive pool. 5 ft will evaporate. Canton is at 1602.41.

[ljbab728]

Oh come on, man. We'll be right back in a drought just as soon as it heats up. You're part of the problem if you think that the drought just ends like that. We're talking about a problem YEARS in the making.

What a silly comment. The drought for a lot of the state is officially over which directly contradicts what you said. As for future drought conditions, that's always a possibility and I never said it wasn't. Maybe you don't understand how being in a drought is determined. It has nothing to do with how many years it took to get there.

[HangryHippo]

What a silly comment. The drought for a lot of the state is officially over which directly contradicts what you said. As for future drought conditions, that's always a possibility and I never said it wasn't. Maybe you don't understand how being in a drought is determined. It has nothing to do with how many years it took to get there.

A lot of state is out of drought? What do you consider a lot? Because according to this article, not even half of the state is out of drought. Perhaps you're the one who doesn't understand this situation. 53.45% of Oklahoma is still in moderate to exceptional drought. Sounds like a couple of weeks of rain in May hasn't helped more than half of our state. But carry on with declaring the drought over.

[OKCTalker]

Why are you guys fighting a deathmatch over water levels & drought characterizations?

[Edgar]

For real. The lakes are full- time to water NW Expressway!

[MikeLucky]

Why are you guys fighting a deathmatch over water levels & drought characterizations?

Cause this is the internet... this is some serious stuff.

[mkjeeves]

A lot of state is out of drought? What do you consider a lot? Because according to this article, not even half of the state is out of drought. Perhaps you're the one who doesn't understand this situation. 53.45% of Oklahoma is still in moderate to exceptional drought. Sounds like a couple of weeks of rain in May hasn't helped more than half of our state. But carry on with declaring the drought over.

Howzat work out by population?

[HangryHippo]

Howzat work out by population?

I honestly don't know. I'd imagine since OKC and Tulsa aren't in those areas still in drought, then it's got to be minimal. I'll try to research this and come back with some figures.

[mkjeeves]

I honestly don't know. I'd imagine since OKC and Tulsa aren't in those areas still in drought, then it's got to be minimal. I'll try to research this and come back with some figures.

That's okay. I imagine most Oklahomans live in areas that aren't in a drought, for whatever that's worth.

[HangryHippo]

That's okay. I imagine most Oklahomans live in areas that aren't in a drought, for whatever that's worth.

Yet they (OKC at least) draw water from areas that are, so that's worth something too.

[venture]

Okay so let's start talking actual climatology here before WW3 breaks out.

So if we look statewide, we can see how we typically go through periods of drought and above normal precip - rarely do we have an average year...



We are coming off of 3 years of below average rainfall and history shows we will go back into a drought at some point...maybe even this year. I was going to show Central OK specifically but the graph is essentially the exact same, so serves no point.

So we take climatology and look at what we have...



By most accounts the drought is pretty well mitigated right now in Central and Eastern OK. However, we are still in desperate need of water in the West. The Panhandle and NW OK needs up to a foot of additional water, West Central up to 6 inches, and SW OK up to 9 inches of rainfall to break the drought.

Looking at the next 3 months...



Conclusions...Western OK is pretty well set in a continued long term drought for the hottest months of the year. We continue to see improvement here in Central OK, and Eastern OK is mostly out of it.

Hopefully we can see some complexes setup out west to get them some water or even some tropical moisture this summer to spread over that area to help out.

[OKCTalker]

Adult supervision - just in time!

[OKCisOK4me]

I like the map above that shows Oklahoma with only 9 counties ;-)

[Larry OKC]

Developing cities in a way that costs less should just be the standard practice. It wasn't for a long time, so now we're going to have to pay for that with higher fees.

However, this talk of we've gotten a foot of rain in May and the drought is over is just lunacy. We've gone years with below average rainfall and claiming that rains in 2013 have overcome all of that is stupid. People should be conserving water all of the time. There's no need to waste, particularly when we live in an area prone to severe droughts.

There is a difference between the drought being over (which it is) and making up for the years of below normal rainfall (which we haven't yet). But the thing is you don't necessarilly need to make up for the below normal years because a lot of the water would be excess and flow downstream somewhere. You need to have the amount that you use. While I agree we shuld conserve, it shouldn't be mandatory, government imposed (unless a need exists, as during a drought).

Exactly. It was a "trick" question. There is no perfect answer.
(if it's been extra dry for several years, then gets really wet, we still need to "conserve" water and use it rationally. right?)

(at least until Canton Lake is full to overflowing again)

(Dune . . . Stranger in a Strange Land . . . The Grapes of Wrath . . . =)

i saw what you did there. LOL. And the answer is NO. Certainly not government imposed when no need to conserve exists.

Venture79: Thank you for supplying the info...