Live music venue proposed for NW 23rd

[gracefor24]

The key is that the ones who are making a fuss are almost all 18th street and south. Mostly 14th streeters. The likelihood of them having their streets fill up with cars is just silly. Jefferson Park on the other hand...

[PhiAlpha]

I live in Heritage Hills.

Do you live on 21st or 22nd between Robinson and walker?

[LakeEffect]

It's like the cherry on top of his inexcusable reluctance to develop the tower theater.

I heard through the grapevine that he is one of the people leading the complaints on this. Is that considered irony?

[PhiAlpha]

I heard through the grapevine that he is one of the people leading the complaints on this. Is that considered irony?

Sounds like he wants to have his cake and eat it too.

[Urbanized]

Nope. I also actually agree with you. I was funnin. This is more of a real problem, certainly, than The Edge.

[PhiAlpha]

Nope. I also actually agree with you. I was funnin. This is more of a real problem, certainly, than The Edge.

Haha it's hard to tell sometimes. I live on 17th so I'm pretty insulated from everything but I would be pretty concerned if I lived in that area. It's just annoying sometimes when people act like heritage hills/mesta park is such a hindrance to everything when the area is a lot of the reason that anything historic downtown was preserved and was a fairly important piece of bringing back the core. People have paid a lot for their homes here and continue to pay a lot for up keep, their concerns shouldn't just be ignored. Again it's easy to say when you aren't affected

But at any rate, glad we're on the same page.

[Plutonic Panda]

I really don't think they should worry about parking. If people start parking where they shouldn't, just send the parking patrol out there and let the city make some cash. People will learn eventually. Maybe give some of the money the get from the issued citations to the neighborhood board(do they have that for HH?) and let them use the money on improvements for the area.

[Urbanized]

You can't have selective parking enforcement. If you ban on-street parking the homeowners will also lose their ability to park in front of their own houses. It's a legitimate concern.

[Plutonic Panda]

You can't have selective parking enforcement. If you ban on-street parking the homeowners will also lose their ability to park in front of their own houses. It's a legitimate concern.

Put out parking passes specifically for the homeowners. Anyone who doesn't have a pass, which will only be held by the homeowners, gets ticketed. If you forget to put your pass out or something, you just prove you live in the neighborhood and it is dropped. Give the homeowners a few of them actually for guests.

[Urbanized]

Like I said, you can't do that. It is strictly illegal. In OKC on-street parking is by definition public. You can restrict its use (to ALL users, by time frame or by limiting to commercial or passenger loading) but you can't make it private. And I know you can cite examples, such as Native Roots, but those signs are a bluff and have no actual teeth. Find the right bureaucrat and they'll have them removed.

[dankrutka]

Put out parking passes specifically for the homeowners. Anyone who doesn't have a pass, which will only be held by the homeowners, gets ticketed. If you forget to put your pass out or something, you just prove you live in the neighborhood and it is dropped. Give the homeowners a few of them actually for guests.

You can't have preferential passes on public streets, right? Homeowners could use their property to add personal angled spaces if they chose (maybe there are regulations that prevent this???), but the street is for anyone in the public, right?

[Plutonic Panda]

Like I said, you can't do that. It is strictly illegal. In OKC on-street parking is by definition public. You can restrict its use (to ALL users, by time frame or by limiting to commercial or passenger loading) but you can't make it private. And I know you can cite examples, such as Native Roots, but those signs are a bluff and have no actual teeth. Find the right bureaucrat and they'll have them removed.

I'm just trying to figure this thing here, is there no way they can declare the streets of HH private residential streets and only allow the homeowners and their guests to park there? I personally wouldn't mind having cars parked outside my house as long as I had a driveway.

[Plutonic Panda]

You can't have preferential passes on public streets, right? Homeowners could use their property to add personal angled spaces if they chose (maybe there are regulations that prevent this???), but the street is for anyone in the public, right?

Not really sure. Never realized there were laws against this.

[Pete]

I'm not suggesting they do this because I don't believe there is going to be a huge problem, but lots of cities require parking passes to park in certain neighborhoods.

Extremely common here in LA, particularly where residential neighborhoods abut big commercial strips -- which is almost everywhere.




Frankly, I don't see the big deal of people parking on side streets. It's not like they will be parking in a driveway... Who cares if they are parking in the street?

The reason they have those permits in LA is to reserve the on-street parking for residents who don't have any other options. This would hardly be a problem anywhere in OKC.


I used to live in Manhattan Beach and my home was only a block from the main part of town, where there were about 40 bars and restaurants. So of course, people were parking down my street and coming and going at late hours. It wasn't a big deal and I actually loved having so many places so close.

[Urbanized]

Crown Heights definitely sees Western Ave bar parkers, and Gatewood sees tons from Plaza District. I really do believe mist of the would encourage up in Jeff Park. But I wouldn't really like it in front of my house either, to be honest with you. When I lived in Gatewood pre-Plaza greatness I was still always picking broken bottles out of my lawn, fixing ruts and broken sprinklers from when cars drove through. The two AM yelling and yard pissing/barfing likely driven by this place would probably be a bummer, too. I'm not sure there is a simple answer.

[Urbanized]

I'm just trying to figure this thing here, is there no way they can declare the streets of HH private residential streets and only allow the homeowners and their guests to park there? I personally wouldn't mind having cars parked outside my house as long as I had a driveway.

Not the way ordinances are currently written. Would require a change to the law such as the one Pete mentioned.

[Plutonic Panda]

So of course, people were parking down my street and coming and going at late hours. It wasn't a big deal and I actually loved having so many places so close.

That is kind of what I am thinking. Wouldn't it be exciting having all the life coming and going? I suppose they want the quite life, but being with the proximity of downtown, it is hard to have sympathy. There is Nichols Hills, Edmond, NW OKC etc. When you live that close the city and life, you ought to kind of expect fast ever changing city life and excitement that comes with it.

[Urbanized]

That is kind of what I am thinking. Wouldn't it be exciting having all the life coming and going? I suppose they want the quite life, but being with the proximity of downtown, it is hard to have sympathy. There is Nichols Hills, Edmond, NW OKC etc. When you live that close the city and life, you ought to kind of expect fast ever changing city life and excitement that comes with it.

It just hasn't been that way for them, ever. I agree, a more dynamic surrounding, IMO, makes for a better neighborhood. Also drives property values. Ask the people in Gatewood. But when many of the folks in HH bought, they were buying into decades-worth of quiet, elegant neighborhood that happened to be convenient to downtown. Change is difficult.

[Pete]

I would say the way to deal with this is through the Updtown/23rd Association and the homeowners.

The district could pitch in for extra security and try to be responsible to the homeowners. Most places here have signs that say "Be be respectful of our neighbors as you leave".

This situation exists times a thousand in every large city, it's just that a lot of these people living in historical neighborhoods in OKC have just never had to deal with it before.

But times are changing... The City is growing up and adding density. Better get used to more cars on your street no matter where you may live in the city core.

[GoThunder]

It just hasn't been that way for them, ever. I agree, a more dynamic surrounding, IMO, makes for a better neighborhood. Also drives property values. Ask the people in Gatewood. But when many of the folks in HH bought, they were buying into decades-worth of quiet, elegant neighborhood that happened to be convenient to downtown. Change is difficult.

I'm 23, so I would love to live in this neighborhood and have all the action right around me. However, I don't have 300k-500k to spend on a home and those who do have that money want a little quieter area to live in. There is definitely a balance to strike with nice neighborhoods and entertainment districts. Have there been any parking issues with the Friday night "Live on the Plaza" events?

[Urbanized]

Well, not sure if anyone in the neighborhood has rebelled. Hopefully they have seen the bigger picture and been tolerant of it. But yeah, on street parking is a bit of a mess radiating a couple of blocks out on busy Plaza nights, including right where my old house is. Maybe I should ask my ex-wife!

[Steve]

Pete is right; the city could create resident permit parking only for Heritage Hills and that would work. But here's the rub on that - what if a Heritage Hills resident has a holiday party? This would, in effect, make it very, very difficult for them to have more than a couple of visitors who can park in the driveway.

[Plutonic Panda]

Pete is right; the city could create resident permit parking only for Heritage Hills and that would work. But here's the rub on that - what if a Heritage Hills resident has a holiday party? This would, in effect, make it very, very difficult for them to have more than a couple of visitors who can park in the driveway.

Could they not implement some sort of system that would work as, if you're a resident of HH, you can call and request x amount of temporary parking permits for your guests? Surely there are other cities that have done that.

[soonerguru]

I'm still confused as to why Marty Dillon won't simply lease the parking lot he owns to the folks doing the music venue.

I'm simply confused what Marty Dillon is trying to accomplish. It's bizarre.

[soonerguru]

Do you live on 21st or 22nd between Robinson and walker?

nm.