OKC Chamber now supporting grocery store wine/beer sales

[mugofbeer]

Are these guys for real? That is bat**** crazy. How do they think the other states manage to pull it off?

They aren't crazy Kerry, they're simply exercising their roles as elected leaders. You and I may severely disagree and that last quote is simply stupidity. There's already individuals too young to drink ringing up beer sales all over town.

[bluedogok]

They aren't crazy Kerry, they're simply exercising their roles as elected leaders. You and I may severely disagree and that last quote is simply stupidity. There's already individuals too young to drink ringing up beer sales all over town.

...and serving drinks in restaurants.

[Kerry]

Here is the thing mugofbeer - If they are concerned about enforcement then why make it illegal in the first place. They are arguing the wrong side of the fence. The easiest thing to enforce is something that isn't illegal. However, the very idea that people under 21 don't drink is laughable at best; devoid of all senses of reality at worst. How do they keep grocery stores from selling wine or liquor stores from selling cork screws now?

[mugofbeer]

Kerry, I apologize. I reread what I wrote and it is misleading. I mean, you and I may severely disagree with certain legislators and those who want to make liquor essentially go away. I dont disagree with you - other than to say these guys are elected by the people. They need to NOT be elected.

CO has very similar laws now and everyone does fine.

[Kerry]

Kerry, I apologize. I reread what I wrote and it is misleading. I mean, you and I may severely disagree with certain legislators...

LOL - I was thinking how could we disagree - your screen name is mugofbeer.

[progressiveboy]

It is still quite perplexing how the liquor laws in Oklahoma are quite draconian and antiquated? Until recently, Dallas had certain areas in town that were wet and then you could go 3 blocks North and be in a completly dry area of Dallas. Not any more. Dallas voters approved that all of Dallas County will now be wet so that ends their era of antiquated law. Question? Does Oklahoma want to settle for less in having their elected officials telling them you have no choice in the matter and the will of the people does not apply because we know what is in the best interest for all people in Oklahoma? At what cost does it bear? Is Oklahoma losing out on economic development? What if Costco wanted to build in Oklahoma but the stipulation was we need to be able to sell wine and liquor in our stores in order to maximize economic profit. What if the state leaders told Costco, too bad, so sad it is not going to happen? What message does this send?

[soonerguru]

It is sad that these dumb motherf&&&ers receive enough votes to "represent" us. These are the people the people of this state apparently want representing them. What does that say about this state?

[Soonerman]

This Beer and Wine issue should be left up for the people of Oklahoma to decide not the politicians who are obviously bought and paid for. Thats the biggest reason stores like World Market and Costco haven't entered the Oklahoma market. For a conservative state Oklahoma doesn't seem to be in favor of a free market system when it comes to this issue. Like others on said if the package stores have a problem with it. They need to expand thier product line.

[progressiveboy]

This Beer and Wine issue should be left up for the people of Oklahoma to decide not the politicians who are obviously bought and paid for. Thats the biggest reason stores like World Market and Costco haven't entered the Oklahoma market. For a conservative state Oklahoma doesn't seem to be in favor of a free market system when it comes to this issue. Like others on said if the package stores have a problem with it. They need to expand thier product line.

Your right about the politicians being bought and paid for just like a prostitute. Sold to the highest buyer. The free market system is quite weak in Oklahoma, but then again, maybe "most" of Oklahoman's want it that way?

[bluedogok]

Your right about the politicians being bought and paid for just like a prostitute. Sold to the highest buyer. The free market system is quite weak in Oklahoma, but then again, maybe "most" of Oklahoman's want it that way?

Yep, it's the "KEEP THE GOVERNMENT OUT OF MY BUSINESS" mindset...unless I can use you to my advantage then I have a proposition for you. But that is no different with any other city, county, state of federal government, they can all be bought.

[Soonerman]

Bluedog you are 100% correct. It's all about following the money for them.

[Bunty]

It is still quite perplexing how the liquor laws in Oklahoma are quite draconian and antiquated?

Probably because the majority of people don't care much about the issue of alcohol, or even drink. I seldom drink anything stronger than 3.2 beer.

[stlokc]

Bunty: The majority of people don't care much...or even drink? I don't know you, or your world and I'm not going to criticize. We all have our own experiences. But I bet I know -conservatively - 1000 people and I bet I don't know 10 people that don't drink at all, maybe 50 or so stick solely to light beer. The vast majority of people I know drink responsibly, but they do drink wine, or mixed drinks at a party, a margarita on a patio, etc. etc. Oklahoma's liquor laws are antiquated. Is this by itself causing people to move or economic development not to happen? Of course not. But it's one of those minor annoyances that give certain people a touch more ammunition to roll their eyes and make further generalizations about the state.

[soonerguru]

Probably because the majority of people don't care much about the issue of alcohol, or even drink. I seldom drink anything stronger than 3.2 beer.

So does that mean that everyone should do as you and this "majority?" Why deny others the freedom of choice?

[Kerry]

Here in Jax we have Total Wine and Liquor. Not only can you buy liquor and corkscrews in the same store, if you want to have a Mexican fiesta you can buy the whole party in one big box - tequila, ice, margarita mix, glasses, blender, chips, salsa, salt, limes, etc. One. Big. Box.

[okcpulse]

It is still quite perplexing how the liquor laws in Oklahoma are quite draconian and antiquated? Until recently, Dallas had certain areas in town that were wet and then you could go 3 blocks North and be in a completly dry area of Dallas. Not any more. Dallas voters approved that all of Dallas County will now be wet so that ends their era of antiquated law. Question? Does Oklahoma want to settle for less in having their elected officials telling them you have no choice in the matter and the will of the people does not apply because we know what is in the best interest for all people in Oklahoma? At what cost does it bear? Is Oklahoma losing out on economic development? What if Costco wanted to build in Oklahoma but the stipulation was we need to be able to sell wine and liquor in our stores in order to maximize economic profit. What if the state leaders told Costco, too bad, so sad it is not going to happen? What message does this send?

Okay, it's time to put the Costco argument to rest. Costco has locations in Utah, Colorado and Kansas. Utah has the most stringent retail liquor laws in the country. Colorado and Kansas are both 3.2 states. Please do your homework before claiming that Costco won't come to Oklahoma because of antiquated liquor laws.

I support beer and wine sales in grocery stores. But let's not support a change just to get a warehouse market that has locations in states with liquor laws similar to Oklahoma. Let's support a change so we can enjor a better quality of selection. I will say it is also a quality of life issue. When consumed in moderation, beer and wine are healthy beverages.

[okcpulse]

Are these guys for real? That is bat**** crazy. How do they think the other states manage to pull it off?

What is amazing Kerry, is that such two-bit remarks from officials are concrete evidence that they have the inability to problem-solve.

[ljbab728]

It is sad that these dumb motherf&&&ers receive enough votes to "represent" us. These are the people the people of this state apparently want representing them. What does that say about this state?

Language, soonerguru!!!!!!

[TheTravellers]

They aren't crazy Kerry, they're simply exercising their roles as elected leaders. You and I may severely disagree and that last quote is simply stupidity. There's already individuals too young to drink ringing up beer sales all over town.

That's interesting, since in Chicagoland and Seattleland, the cashier had to call someone over 21 to ring the alcohol up if the cashier wasn't 21. They just set it aside and let the over-21 drag it over the scanner.

[TheTravellers]

It is sad that these dumb motherf&&&ers receive enough votes to "represent" us. These are the people the people of this state apparently want representing them. What does that say about this state?

Ah, a little bit of vindication for my viewpoints.

[kevinpate]

Language, ... !!!!!!

FWIW to anyone, over the years I've often utilized a term learned from a friend of mine ... legilizards

[okcpulse]

That's interesting, since in Chicagoland and Seattleland, the cashier had to call someone over 21 to ring the alcohol up if the cashier wasn't 21. They just set it aside and let the over-21 drag it over the scanner.

In Texas, I was refused a wine sale at a Kroger supermarket because my brother (who is of age) didn't bring his ID. So if ABLE and the fear-mongers think that we are giving up control and making alcohol more accessible, they are full of hot air.

[Bunty]

Okay, it's time to put the Costco argument to rest. Costco has locations in Utah, Colorado and Kansas. Utah has the most stringent retail liquor laws in the country. Colorado and Kansas are both 3.2 states. Please do your homework before claiming that Costco won't come to Oklahoma because of antiquated liquor laws.

I support beer and wine sales in grocery stores. But let's not support a change just to get a warehouse market that has locations in states with liquor laws similar to Oklahoma. Let's support a change so we can enjor a better quality of selection. I will say it is also a quality of life issue. When consumed in moderation, beer and wine are healthy beverages.

Then what is stalling Costco from coming to Oklahoma? The income isn't high enough? Too much competition from Sam's?

[Jethrol]

I'm convinced that most people in OK are just against any sort of changes....PERIOD.

I remember the weeping and gnashing of teeth that occurred over MAPS1. I heard things like, "Boo tax increase" and "Why do we need a ditch in bricktown...that won't do anything. We need better ideas." and other similar comments.

Then when we were talking about a lottery....we heard numerous arguments like, "It will bring in a criminal element" or "that's just a tax on the poor who can't afford it" or "we're doing fine without it"

Now we're hearing similar arguments about something as silly as whether or not to sell wine and strong beer in grocery stores.

Look...the sky isn't falling. Change can be good and when some stupid law has been in existence for too long, remove it and go on with your life.

Oklahoma's current liquor laws didn't stop me from drinking on a regular basis from the time I was 16 on and it won't prevent future kids that want to drink from doing so either. When someone wants to drink, they will find ways to do so.

No....this is all about the liquor store mafia holding out govt hostage. ok yeah that's a bit dramatic but that's what it seems like to me. The liquor store owners have a monopoly in this state and it's time it should end.....past time if you ask me.

[Larry OKC]

Jethrol:

There is a lot to what you posted, the other side is true as well. Particularly regarding the Lottery and expanded Casino Gambling issue. While I don't think we have seen a dramatic increase in crime, there has been increases in gambling addiction and the associated crimes that stem from it. It IS a voluntary tax payed mainly by those people who can least afford it. And it doesn't seem to have made much difference in academic results. Have to remember, as originally proposed by then Senator Brad Henry, the Lottery was supposed to bring in $500M/year and according to the recent Lottery commercials, it has only brought in just over $350M TOTAL in the 5 years it has been around (their website shows $369M). Even during the vote, they had lowered the projections to $350M/year. Same was true from both sides on HB1804 (the anti-illegal immigration bill). Both sides claimed, if passed, there would be a mass exodus of Latinos (both legal & illegal) from the state. The numbers don't seem to support it. Funny thing was, many claimed it was anti-Mexican but I read the bill in its final form and couldn't find a single word, phrase, sentence etc that was anti any ethnic group or nationality. Challenged those to point out if it existed. Nothing but the chirping of crickets. Anyway, we now return you to your regularly scheduled program...