Sonic Corporation

[cagoklahoma]

Are Braum’s commercials old? Yes. Are Braum’s color scheme's outdated? Yes. Is Braum’s less likely to contribute much money to community initiatives when compared to the competition? Yes. Although, the most important questions are…Is Braum’s making a profit for its owners? Yes, absolutely. Is Braum’s keeping its stores open? Yes. Does Braum’s employee a lot of people? Yes. I don’t understand why they “need” to change what’s working just because it is old. I see more restaurants lose business when they “change” what has been working for them, because they lose their identity. They know who they are, and they know who they aren’t. I appreciate that, and I think a bunch of other people do too, and that’s probably why there’s almost always a line in their stores (well, and the service is pretty slow, but so is Soinc.) For me, the Braum’s old egg nog commercial is almost as synonymous with Christmas in OKC as the B.C. Clark jingle.

Just a thought.

[OKVision4U]

The one thing that made them a success, is now a stumbling block. Yes, they still use that same commercial from 1984 ( it would be ok, if they were trying to have an "ole time" feel, but they are using it because they don't want to spend a single dollar).

Once upper management quits / stops listening, then new ideas cease to come forward & all you end up w/ is the (YES) group. Stagnant, then OB.

If they had a new HQ in Bricktown w/ a totally new campaign, they could be No. 1. ...great product no one knows about.

[Jersey Boss]

Since y'all brought it up (sort of)...how many Sonic Franchisees in OKC are from East Pakistan (is this the Bangladesh Mafia expanding into Fast-Food)?

CJ-2008-1993

I would be surprised if this kind of information is sought or recorded by the entity that grants franchise rights.

[Jersey Boss]

Are Braum’s commercials old? Yes. Are Braum’s color scheme's outdated? Yes. Is Braum’s less likely to contribute much money to community initiatives when compared to the competition? Yes. Although, the most important questions are…Is Braum’s making a profit for its owners? Yes, absolutely. Is Braum’s keeping its stores open? Yes. Does Braum’s employee a lot of people? Yes. I don’t understand why they “need” to change what’s working just because it is old. I see more restaurants lose business when they “change” what has been working for them, because they lose their identity. They know who they are, and they know who they aren’t. I appreciate that, and I think a bunch of other people do too, and that’s probably why there’s almost always a line in their stores (well, and the service is pretty slow, but so is Soinc.) For me, the Braum’s old egg nog commercial is almost as synonymous with Christmas in OKC as the B.C. Clark jingle.

Just a thought.

The folks that ran Montgomery Wards said the same thing.

[OKVision4U]

Are Braum’s commercials old? Yes. Are Braum’s color scheme's outdated? Yes. Is Braum’s less likely to contribute much money to community initiatives when compared to the competition? Yes. Although, the most important questions are…Is Braum’s making a profit for its owners? Yes, absolutely. Is Braum’s keeping its stores open? Yes. Does Braum’s employee a lot of people? Yes. I don’t understand why they “need” to change what’s working just because it is old. I see more restaurants lose business when they “change” what has been working for them, because they lose their identity. They know who they are, and they know who they aren’t. I appreciate that, and I think a bunch of other people do too, and that’s probably why there’s almost always a line in their stores (well, and the service is pretty slow, but so is Soinc.) For me, the Braum’s old egg nog commercial is almost as synonymous with Christmas in OKC as the B.C. Clark jingle.

Just a thought.

I want them to stay in business. But now, they have (5X's) the competition. Freddies / Steak & Shake / Sonic ( shakes / ice cream products ) , and with better service. The line you see at Braum's is because the service is ( well below average ). In the 80's / 90's, they could thrive with that, but now they have to compete.

[cagoklahoma]

I agree to an extent, that it’s important be able to adapt and evolve with the industry which is particularly necessary for the technology industries. However, for food service, it’s not as important, and I don’t think it’s fair to compare Braum’s to Montgomery Wards. MW’s demise was not too terribly long after Wal-Mart began building supercenters everywhere, I don’t have any proof (which is rarely necessary on OKC Talk) the two related, but it seems logical to think it is possible. We also need to consider “what do they want to be?” Maybe they are happy where they are? Maybe they want to keep their prices as low as possible? From a consumer perspective, I’d rather have an old commercial with a $5 tub of ice cream, than new commercials with $6 tub of ice cream. All this to say, I don’t eat Braum’s too often but when we stop in for a shake or banana split or gallon of milk, I’ve never thought to myself “man, this place is dead.”

[Jersey Boss]

I agree to an extent, that it’s important be able to adapt and evolve with the industry which is particularly necessary for the technology industries. However, for food service, it’s not as important, and I don’t think it’s fair to compare Braum’s to Montgomery Wards. MW’s demise was not too terribly long after Wal-Mart began building supercenters everywhere, I don’t have any proof (which is rarely necessary on OKC Talk) the two related, but it seems logical to think it is possible. We also need to consider “what do they want to be?” Maybe they are happy where they are? Maybe they want to keep their prices as low as possible? From a consumer perspective, I’d rather have an old commercial with a $5 tub of ice cream, than new commercials with $6 tub of ice cream. All this to say, I don’t eat Braum’s too often but when we stop in for a shake or banana split or gallon of milk, I’ve never thought to myself “man, this place is dead.”

I don't think MW and Wal Mart serve the same customer needs. While MW was considered a Dept. Store, don't know of many who put that moniker on Wal Mart, Super Center or not.

[cagoklahoma]

That depends on what you consider to be their competition. Freddies also has terrible service, and the food isn’t any better. Steak and Shake is a little better than Freddies. Sonic, well my wife thought I was crazy when she said she wanted a banana spilt and I pulled into a Sonic. Also, something else to consider is the Braum’s makes almost/if not all of their products in house. You won’t see a Ben E. Keith distribution truck outside a Braum’s. They have no middle man, so their margins are higher. They have the infrastructure in place the others do not, which is a real competitive advantage. I’m not saying Freddies, S&S, or Sonic are not good establishments, but their products are not superior to something you would find at Braum’s. They all employ ticked off teenagers, who move at a snail’s pace and want to be there, so service is going to be a wash. Will they be around for the next 100 years? Probably not, but not because of their commercials, or color schemes. *I do not currently, nor have I ever worked at Braum’s*

[tomokc]

I won't go to Braum's for anything except ice cream/milk shakes, and only from the drive through. The stores are dirty, the employees indifferent (and underpaid), and I can find superior products anywhere else at comparable prices. Except for the ice cream & milk shakes. But I won't go out of my way for them, and I won't go inside.

From a pure profit standpoint I wonder if Braum's wouldn't be better off closing the stores and either selling the ice cream in grocery stores, or licensing them through another channel. Closing the stores eliminates all of the management, HR, overhead, capital requirements and ancillary things required of a huge business operating in hundreds of retail locations. And for what ROI? They probably swap dollars on the retail side (they certainly do on groceries), competition is fierce, and their only category killer is ice cream.

[Mel]

Their orange juice is pretty killer with vodka.

[mugofbeer]

Monkey Wards was Sears without Kenmore and Craftsman

[MWCGuy]

Montgomery Ward died because GE Capital bought them out and they were absolutely clueless when it came to the world of retail. They turned around and shut them down just wash their hands of the mess they created. It would be like Chase buying out Best Buy. Chase is in the banking business not the retail electronics business. Had GE just let the company operate, I honestly think they would still be around today. There is a market for department stores that are in between discount retail and mall department store. Montgomery Ward filled that void and did it well. If you don't believe me just look at Kohl's. JCPenney would be doing well had they not abandoned there old business model and left so many customers out in the cold in the name of being hip and trendy.

[shawnw]

Wards also preceded Sears.

[Dubya61]

Another interesting thing that makes Braums an easier thing to make profit with: beef -- their own cattle.
I'll bet they don't buy a single cow!

[Jersey Boss]

I think JCP was losing their keister before they changed their business model and that was what prompted the change. I don't know what they need to do to survive, if they even can. Sears as well looks to be on the escalator to irrelevance.

[sgt. pepper]

I thought this thread was about Sonic, boy was I wrong. And my two cents...I love everything about Braums!

[hoya]

Braums makes a pretty good hamburger and has good ice cream. Their service is terrible and a lot of their stores look dingy. If a better store came along I would shop there instead. Braums is everywhere in Oklahoma but I don't think they've spread out too far beyond that.

The thing about family owned companies is that at some point, the person in the family with the business sense dies off.

[HangryHippo]

Braums makes a pretty good hamburger and has good ice cream. Their service is terrible and a lot of their stores look dingy. If a better store came along I would shop there instead. Braums is everywhere in Oklahoma but I don't think they've spread out too far beyond that.

The thing about family owned companies is that at some point, the person in the family with the business sense dies off.

A lot of their stores look rundown right after opening. I don't know what it is, but they're always unkempt. And the quality of their burgers has gone downhill significantly lately. I still love their ice cream but I go a lot less than I used to.

[traxx]

I buy all my milk at Braum's because I know what I'm getting and where it came from. I eat their food from time to time and their shakes and malts can't be beat. And maybe you're right about the old commercials. It comes off as cheap but I could live with it if they would just run their stores more effeciently. Clean stores and short wait times would do wonders. That's everyone's biggest complaint about Braum's. Other similar fast food places can do it with minimum wage employees. Braum's could too if they just put their mind to it. It's not a matter not hiring the right store employees. It's a matter of effeciency. They need an effeciency expert to look at the stores, implement changes at one store and then they can use that as a template.

[OKVision4U]

A lot of their stores look rundown right after opening. I don't know what it is, but they're always unkempt. And the quality of their burgers has gone downhill significantly lately. I still love their ice cream but I go a lot less than I used to.

This is a tragic reality that businesses "don't want to ever hear". The consumers that like your products, but don't enter the doors. From what I am seeing (as others on this topic have stated the same thing) most frequent consumers of Braums are now staying away. ...poor quality / customer service issues / un-clean....certainly not what you want in this business of food.

Pete, could we have this thread moved to it own ? thank you.

[traxx]

This is a tragic reality that businesses "don't want to ever hear". The consumers that like your products, but don't enter the doors. From what I am seeing (as others on this topic have stated the same thing) most frequent consumers of Braums are now staying away. ...poor quality / customer service issues / un-clean....certainly not what you want in this business of food.

Pete, could we have this thread moved to it own ? thank you.

And the sad thing is, these are fixable problems.

Back when I was married, the wife took the kids to the Braum's facility in Tuttle for a tour. A lady on the tour asked, "This place is spotless but your stores are consistantly dirty. Why is that?" The person leading the tour said that wasn't the first time they've heard that. Why not fix it then? Could the guys that here that complaint at the plant not run it up the chain to the boys at corporate?

[OKVision4U]

This is another sad point, the C-level management at Braums are 100% aware of their poor customer service rating. It would cost money for them to make "enhancements" and they are ok with today's results.

Braum's has this example to make a difference: Loves vs. QT ... Loves shares the same "ugly store" issues, but is doing well at the bank. QT is hands-down a better managed corporation ( from the top , to the bottom). and the results are evident... Look at their employees when you walk into their store... Highly trained & motivated. They are buying-into what QT is trying to accomplish.

Bruam's and Loves share the same excuse, they say the "low skilled workforce" is the reason for their POOR performance, but QT is showing you how that is not true.

[Mastyc]

This is another sad point, the C-level management at Braums are 100% aware of their poor customer service rating. It would cost money for them to make "enhancements" and they are ok with today's results.

Braum's has this example to make a difference: Loves vs. QT ... Loves shares the same "ugly store" issues, but is doing well at the bank. QT is hands-down a better managed corporation ( from the top , to the bottom). and the results are evident... Look at their employees when you walk into their store... Highly trained & motivated. They are buying-into what QT is trying to accomplish.

Bruam's and Loves share the same excuse, they say the "low skilled workforce" is the reason for their POOR performance, but QT is showing you how that is not true.

Honestly, I really think a lot of these problems exist because for what every reason, OKC patrons allow it. Every place that is listed in this thread is pretty much exactly the same. I don't eat at Sonics here because IMO the food quality and service is terrible. I don't have that problem out of town. I don't go to Braums because they are extremely dirty and downright gross. Braums, unlike sonic, has this issue outside of Oklahoma, but those locations don't do any business. I am quite shocked that the Braums in the DFW metroplex stay because I never see any customers at any of them. Taco Bueno in OKC is run down and pretty gross at most locations. But if you go to a newer one in another city they are actually pretty sought after and busy(like the south austin one that was mentioned, lived down the street from it when it opened, was very excited). Homeland and Buy4less? I feel like as long as local customers keep giving these companies money, they have no reason to set higher standards.

[ljbab728]

LOL, what a silly theory. OKC gets crap because we don't care. LOL

[jn1780]

This is another sad point, the C-level management at Braums are 100% aware of their poor customer service rating. It would cost money for them to make "enhancements" and they are ok with today's results.

Braum's has this example to make a difference: Loves vs. QT ... Loves shares the same "ugly store" issues, but is doing well at the bank. QT is hands-down a better managed corporation ( from the top , to the bottom). and the results are evident... Look at their employees when you walk into their store... Highly trained & motivated. They are buying-into what QT is trying to accomplish.

Bruam's and Loves share the same excuse, they say the "low skilled workforce" is the reason for their POOR performance, but QT is showing you how that is not true.

Sorry, you lost me at QT vs Loves. Their not even in the same sector of the industry. Loves does have a few car stops, but this is a very small segment of their target market. They do have better stores compared to Pilot who is thier main competitor.

How many stores does QT have out in the middle of nowhere where their is less employees to choose from?