Trader Joe's

[TAlan CB]

Is their wine healthy, environmentally friendly, and exotic?

Yes

[TAlan CB]

More importantly, it is consumed by the same demographic... foodies. People who take their time and prepare meals, and enjoy something 'different'. Wine is a traditional evening meal beverage for a lot of different cultures. Taken by itself, the exclusion of wine would not Keep a Trader Joes out of any market. But, combined with a population that shows no demand for non-tradional fare, Tj would be taking a big chance going into such a market. Now, having said this, I believe TJ would be successful if it located a store in specific areas of OKC and Tulsa. Bricktown in OKC could support this due to the combinations of location (central - more of less), demographic of the new residences located near by, and destination location for a greater population that would then shop at TJ for the novelity - and some would then return rutinely. Since there are a lot more attractice markets nationwide, there is little incentive for Traders to 'take a chance'. Knowing the market, I don't think it would be a chance - but looking at it from the 'outside' and seeing how how well it fits their 'ideal' target market I could see their reluctance. Colorado is not as much of a chance because despite its similar laws, its population demographic fits to their target audience. I know OKC is changing, but has not been to long ago that when a 'fast-food' company wanted to test its marketability, it would open stores in OKC under the philosophy that okies are the most fast-food friendly market.

[progressiveboy]

Was at TJ today at Plano and Preston. Very busy. Lots of people buying wine. I saw several license tags in the parking lot with Oklahoma tags! TJ will work well in OKC and Tulsa! I love the diverse selection of their private brands. Lots of great stuff!!

[TAlan CB]

Was at TJ today at Plano and Preston. Very busy. Lots of people buying wine. I saw several license tags in the parking lot with Oklahoma tags! TJ will work well in OKC and Tulsa! I love the diverse selection of their private brands. Lots of great stuff!!

Have you tried Central Market? That use to be our favorite in Dallas ... all those prepared meals and great selection. Still, I'd bet they were more expensive than TJ.

[progressiveboy]

Have you tried Central Market? That use to be our favorite in Dallas ... all those prepared meals and great selection. Still, I'd bet they were more expensive than TJ.

Yes I have tried Central Market. It is one of my favorites because they have a wonderful meat market and their produce is incredible! My favorite by far next to Whole Foods and TJ. CM also offers mozarella cheese made on the premises and great cooking classes. They have a wonderful wine selection too. Great for all the foodies! I shop at both the Plano location and the newest one at Preston and Royal.

[TAlan CB]

Yes I have tried Central Market. It is one of my favorites because they have a wonderful meat market and their produce is incredible! My favorite by far next to Whole Foods and TJ. CM also offers mozarella cheese made on the premises and great cooking classes. They have a wonderful wine selection too. Great for all the foodies! I shop at both the Plano location and the newest one at Preston and Royal.

When I lived there they had just built the one on Lovers, which was a few miles north of where I lived (south of White Rock), and later built one near where I worked at Coit and George Bush Frwy - very convient. The selection is great, but I still think the prices are better at Trader Joes. Before CM we shopped for prepared foods at Eatiz original location downtown - best for prepared food, not as good for selection to prepare for yourself.

[Pete]

Trader Joe's is a store that is hard to explain until you really have experienced it many times and discovered all the little treasures scattered among it's shelves.

To wit, tonight I bought pumpkin butter (non-dairy but you can spread it on almost anything), some cinnamon apple goat cheese (amazing), a loaf of thick-cut cinnamon swirl bread (perfect for French toast), a package of 10 huge chili/onion flour tortillas, and a jar of fresh salsa.

Total, including tax: less than $14.

[Roger S]

When I lived near SW 104th and Western I would walk or ride my bike to the Neighborhood Market to get groceries and I would always take my Trader Joe's reusable shopping bag that I picked up on a trip to California.

Hopefully I'll be able to use my Trader Joe's bag at a Trader Joe's instead.

[progressiveboy]

Does anyone know if there has been any progress made on securing TJ for the OKC area. They just opened TJ on Lower Greenville Ave here in Dallas, and have started construction on a new shopping development on Walnut Hill and 75 where TJ will be anchoring a spot. I wonder how many locations OKC will be able to support? Anyone want to guess?

[Pete]

TJ's is scouting the OKC market and I'm sure we'll see some sort of announcement in the next year.

They tend to be a bit more "urban", so I would guess their first location would be on the near north side somewhere.

As for number of locations, that's hard to say but I suspect they would start with 2 or 3 and go from there.


Their stores are smaller, so they can have a bunch of them in pretty close proximity.

[bchris02]

The Charlotte locations were both in strip centers similar to Spring Creek (the standard for suburban development there). I think Nichols Hills Plaza would be perfect for the first OKC location.

[BG918]

I know Denver will have its first TJ's open by the end of the year and another closer to downtown by the end of 2014. There is also one under construction in Boulder and one planned for Greenwood Village by the Denver version of Nichols Hills (Cherry Hills). With the ones in Kansas City, Omaha and Texas the state is pretty much surrounded.

[mcca7596]

TJ's is scouting the OKC market and I'm sure we'll see some sort of announcement in the next year.

They tend to be a bit more "urban", so I would guess their first location would be on the near north side somewhere.

As for number of locations, that's hard to say but I suspect they would start with 2 or 3 and go from there.


Their stores are smaller, so they can have a bunch of them in pretty close proximity.

It seems like they've been scouting locations for over 2 years.

[bluedogok]

The first Austin location is going to open any day now.

[bradh]

TJ's is scouting the OKC market and I'm sure we'll see some sort of announcement in the next year.

They tend to be a bit more "urban", so I would guess their first location would be on the near north side somewhere.

As for number of locations, that's hard to say but I suspect they would start with 2 or 3 and go from there.


Their stores are smaller, so they can have a bunch of them in pretty close proximity.

You went to TJ and didn't leave without at least one bottle of Two Buck Chuck? Sacrilege!

[bchris02]

Comment From Guest: Hearing more about trader joe's comign to town. has thsst been confirmed?

Steve Lackmeyer: I'm hearing a Trader Joe's deal in the Oklahoma City metro has been struck ...

It looks like Trader Joe's will soon be coming to Central Oklahoma. Steve's response seems to indicate that it will be in the metro area but not in OKC proper. My guess is Edmond or Norman.

As for a downtown grocery store, a lot of people seem to be set on an urban style Target like the one in Minneapolis or the one in Charlotte. While that would be a great, welcome development, I would rather see a local grocery like Buy For Less open an Uptown Grocery-like concept in Midtown. I don't think there are currently enough people living in downtown OKC to support both.

[Pete]

Comment From Guest: Hearing more about trader joe's comign to town. has thsst been confirmed?

Steve Lackmeyer: I'm hearing a Trader Joe's deal in the Oklahoma City metro has been struck ...

It looks like Trader Joe's will soon be coming to Central Oklahoma. Steve's response seems to indicate that it will be in the metro area but not in OKC proper. My guess is Edmond or Norman.

As for a downtown grocery store, a lot of people seem to be set on an urban style Target like the one in Minneapolis or the one in Charlotte. While that would be a great, welcome development, I would rather see a local grocery like Buy For Less open an Uptown Grocery-like concept in Midtown. I don't think there are currently enough people living in downtown OKC to support both.

My bet is Nichols Hills Plaza -- old Crescent Market space.

[bchris02]

My bet is Nichols Hills Plaza -- old Crescent Market space.

Yeah didn't think about that. That would be the perfect spot.

[Pete]

The old Crescent space is about 18,000 square feet and the Trader Joe's that have just been opened in Ft. Worth and Omaha (and most other places) are around 13,000 s.f.

But obviously, they could make that space work for them.

The only thing working against NH Plaza is that is sounds like it will be sold very soon, and it's unusual for big new leases to be signed when a property is in flux.


With Dallas, Ft. Worth and Omaha their first locations were not in suburbs; not in downtown either just in Lower Greenville in Dallas, near TCU in Ft. Worth. Seems like Nichols Hills would be right up their alley, especially since Whole Foods has blown out it's numbers right next door.

TJ's and WF don't really compete heads-up, as TJ's is much more price and value driven and WF more about organic items and higher price points. Out here in Cali, it's not unusual for them to be located near each other.


Really hope it does come to NH Plaza as that would make a lot of sense and be great first location.

[Pete]

Also, just remembered that in one of Steve's articles from early in 2013 -- after Aubrey McClendon's departure had been announced but prior to him actually stepping down -- he quoted the former employee of Chesapeake who was hired to start the company-run grocery store. That ex-employee said that Chesapeake was close to striking a deal with Trader Joe's. Then later, the deal fell apart because of the changes at Chesapeake.

It's common knowledge that McClendon personally negotiated a sweetheart deal for Whole Foods (he was thanked for his generosity at that store's grand opening) and I suspect similar concessions had been offered to TJ's after the CHK grocery plan fell through.

But I'm quite sure Aubrey was no longer able to unilaterally strike such deals with Chesapeake assets after the new Chair took over.


So, maybe this means the Plaza is now formally under contract (something we have heard) and the new owners were able to finalize a deal with TJ's, as the store obviously likes that location and it does make a lot of sense.


BTW, in one of his chats Steve indicated that Aubrey McClendon may be trying to buy some of the non-business real estate but it's my understanding that if Aubrey is involved in the group that his buying NH Plaza, it's only in a minor role.

[Urbanized]

Do you think they would locate that close to WF on a first outing? The numbers HAVE to look better in certain Edmond and/or Norman neighborhoods, by their standards. The only reason for the Classen Curve WF was Aubrey. If it had gone into the OKC metro organically (pun intended), it likely would have started in the 'burbs. I think unless Aubrey has managed to start influencing NHP real estate again, it is likely to be elsewhere...

[bchris02]

Do you think they would locate that close to WF on a first outing? The numbers HAVE to look better in certain Edmond and/or Norman neighborhoods, by their standards. The only reason for the Classen Curve WF was Aubrey. If it had gone into the OKC metro organically (pun intended), it likely would have started in the 'burbs. I think unless Aubrey has managed to start influencing NHP real estate again, it is likely to be elsewhere...

Remember though that these stores choose location based on the number of high-income rooftops within at 1, 3, and 5 mile radius. Using their formula, Nichols Hills is probably the only place in the OKC metro that qualifies, it only barely.

[Pete]

Also, TJ's is more city oriented than suburbs.

They do go to the suburbs, but usually only after establishing locations in the cities themselves.

I realize NH is technically a suburb, but it's really just a small island in the middle of North OKC as opposed to Edmond, Norman, etc.


I'm sure TJ's will eventually go to Edmond and Moore/Norman but I doubt they would open their first Metro location in either.

[Urbanized]

Remember though that these stores choose location based on the number of high-income rooftops within at 1, 3, and 5 mile radius. Using their formula, Nichols Hills is probably the only place in the OKC metro that qualifies, it only barely.

I doubt that, actually. Based on low density in Nichols Hills and the poor-ish demographics in the higher-density neighborhoods outside of it (especially to the North and to the East), I strongly suspect some areas of Edmond would have far better demographics for the same radii. Also, assumption was that the Classen Curve location did NOT qualify, ergo incentives. It's fairly obvious where national retailers WANT to be sans-incentives; just look at where the more upscale nationals cluster. It ain't Nichols Hills/Classen Curve.

[OKCTalker]

Aubrey is persona non grata in Nichols Hills for what he did to NH Plaza and how it has directly affected the pocketbooks of its residents. He ran off the south tenant base which decimated sales tax revenues, and they're having to increase water rates to make up the shortfall. If would add insult to injury if Trader Joe's had been ready to pick NH Plaza but couldn't keep waiting for CHK to consummate the sale to a buyer, and had to select a non-NH location. I guess we'll know soon enough.

I know of a local investment group that tried to buy NH Plaza but was rebuffed by CHK because they were holding out for several million more than the property can justify. They're a serious group, highly-respected, well-capitalized and deep in commercial real estate projects, and would be embraced by everyone. They were ready to write a check, but since CHK was unreasonable they had to walk away. More pain, uncertainty, and delay to businesses wanting NH Plaza as their future home.