BOK Park Plaza

[Urban Pioneer]

I don't think our city developers will "learn" or change how we develop urbanity until the streetcar is up and running. Basically, it doesn't exist until it does exist. For Larry Nichols or many others still stuck with development strategies around cars, they will literally have to ride on the system before these development trends change.

Hopefully, some of us will be around long enough to see a wrecking ball attack a few of those garages.

[Rover]

The whole world has already figured it out.

Actually, YOUR whole world has figured it out.

OKC has yet to have adequate downtown population to create an adequate work force for what is already downtown, let alone to create economic growth through substantial and high paying jobs. And, there is yet to be adequate mass trans to shuttle enough people from areas where they live or would like to live. So, we are supposed to believe that if we just eliminate new parking we can continue to add thousands of jobs to our economy downtown. Just add a few bars and restaurants that serve downtowners and that will create economic growth to pay for $200-300 sq ft housing and free income to pay for all the cool meals and drinks?

You can not just imagine things to be true and make it so. Until we have enough housing that appeals to enough workers of all types (not just "cool" 20 yr olds), or a VASTLY different mass trans that the right kind of demographics wants to use, then we are stuck with building parking garages. Fortunately, they can be torn down in 15-20 years when we might actually have a city that doesn't need them. Till then, parking is a requirement and we have been inadequate.

[pickles]

The debate on this project was a fantastic opportunity for social and cultural positioning and I hope you all took full advantage of it on Twitter and Facebook.

[Spartan]

Not gonna lie, that render that Pete just put up, if everything comes through as it's "supposed" to, OKC is gonna have a killer skyline here in a few years. From some angles, it'll look like a slightly miniature replica of Dallas', and I know few people will cringe at that, but most won't.

Take this view, for example (take away reunion tower and just look at the "pyramid effect"):

Attachment 10067

You're damn right about the killer skyline that we are going to have! The only thing is that these historic buildings do not really come in the way of that.

Seriously, if the issue with Devon is that they don't want to pay over $15,000 per parking space (which by the way is sub-prime for structured parking, hence the quality of the Walker facade) then throw as much TIF at them as it takes. How about worthy things for applying TIF?

I can't even begin to analyze how "People don't want to be looking out into the clouds!" (with regards to the height of parking garages) reflects where we stand as a civic culture. Hines is not normally backwards.

[Dubya61]

... the real problem is that preservation is a 3-legged stool. It particularly requires the property owner to have a vision for adaptive reuse. The city didn't have much of a negotiating tool as the aren't any Tif dollars involved in the project.

That would seem to indicate that the block was on the gallows the minute it was sold to Preftakes (Devon).
Good post, BTW. Thanks for posting it.

[ljbab728]

Oklahoma City councilman appeals downtown bus station demolition | NewsOK.com

Councilman Ed Shadid on Friday appealed an architectural review panel’s decision to approve demolition of downtown Oklahoma City’s historic Union Bus Station.

A hearing was set before the city’s Board of Adjustment on March 5, two days after Shadid faces Ward 2 voters in his bid for re-election.

Shadid paid $750 to file his 19-page appeal with the city. Shadid had tried on Tuesday to persuade the city council to file an appeal, but lost on a 7-2 vote.

Shadid said in his appeal that the decision to demolish the bus station contradicted guidelines intended to promote downtown redevelopment “in a manner consistent and compatible” with existing designs.

The city’s Planning Department favored preserving the bus station, and Shadid noted a staff report to the Design Review Committee suggested the bus station’s facade could be refurbished and integrated into the office complex.

[Pete]

I moved a ton of posts here:

http://www.okctalk.com/politics/4002...y-council.html

[Village]

I moved a ton of posts here:

http://www.okctalk.com/politics/4002...y-council.html

Thanks Pete!
Now hopefully it can stay on topic.

[ChrisHayes]

Any updates on this project and when it's set to get started?

[Pete]

Not until after the Board of Adjustment hears the appeal on the demo of the bus station next month.

I assume they will reject the appeal, then demolition on all the buildings should start very soon.

[Pete]

The appeal of the demolition of the Union Bus Station is on the agenda for the 3/5 Board of Adjustment meeting.

The brief of the appeal is interesting to read and raises lots of good points.

This appeal shall be heard and tried de novo by the Board, provided such appeal shall be limited to the issues and evidence presented to and decided by the Downtown Design Review Committee, and the grounds specified in the Notice of Appeal. In deciding an appeal, the Board shall use the same standards and criteria of review as set forth in the Downtown Design District Ordinance. Upon review, the Board may affirm, reverse or modify the decision of the Committee; or the Board shall remand the case to the Committee based upon new evidence in the event that new evidence is presented.

Read full brief here (PDF)

[BDP]

The appeal of the demolition of the Union Bus Station is on the agenda for the 3/5 Board of Adjustment meeting.

The brief of the appeal is interesting to read and raises lots of good points.



Read full brief here (PDF)

Is this an open forum with time allotted for public comment?

[Pete]

Is this an open forum with time allotted for public comment?

Yes.

It is scheduled for Thursday March 5th at 1:30PM in the Council Chambers at City Hall.

The applicant will be requested to present their case first. Following the applicant's presentation, the public will be called upon to present testimony, for or against, the stated request. Each person who speaks should first state their name and address. Each person shall be given the opportunity to present their case once, as succinctly as possible. All parties should limit their remarks to five minutes. Large groups who want to address the Board should choose one spokesperson. After protestant's remarks, the applicant will be entitled to one brief rebuttal.

[Chitty]

After reading the brief, I agree with Pete - there are some good points made in it. Maybe the DDRC did not do their due diligence here. I didn't previously support the idea of saving the bus station, but I don't love the idea of just a parking garage being there either. I don't think the structure as whole should be saved however. The appeal presents the idea of saving the exterior facade, and I think that's a good idea.

[CuatrodeMayo]

Don't get your hopes up...

[Pete]

The point about not even talking to the City about the possibility of using TIF funds was a great one to make.

Their whole argument is that the building is not economically feasible, but bridging that gap is a big part of the purpose of TIF, and there is plenty of money in that budget.

Of course, everyone knows they just want to make room for more parking, but then they should at least say so rather than put up the cost argument because it is full of holes.


I don't expect the BOA to overrule, but it may be an interesting meeting and process. Remember, the vote on Stage Center by this same body was very close.

[BoulderSooner]

Not sure applying tif funds or not will have any impact on this application. As those funds may or may not have been approved.

[Spartan]

I think that the TIF thing is the way to go, because then the argument isn't anti-Devon, but rather that Devon and the City just need to work together to make this happen. To me, that's the right message.

[Village]

If any of you are going....give em hell to save it. :P

[UnFrSaKn]

Via Steve's Twitter

https://twitter.com/stevelackmeyer/s...06993913622529

[jccouger]

Typical arrogant attitude displayed by the big oil bullies.

Man, this 499 building looks less & less inspiring every single time I look at the rendering. What a ugly boring annex it is going to be.

[David]

ummmm.... is right. Aren't we still waiting on the Board of Adjustment appeal?

[kevinpate]

Some folks are waiting. Some perhaps trust their gut and/or ability to count noses. Not unlike when a sports team blows off the final bit of the clock because clock striking zero or not, it's actually over, and has been for a spell (as in long before the renderings were ever drawn, let alone pitched.)

[BoulderSooner]

ummmm.... is right. Aren't we still waiting on the Board of Adjustment appeal?

Is removing a sign demo? Do they even need appoveal to do that?

[jn1780]

Are they actually removing the sign or just inspecting it? I'm sure they are getting demolition and sign "Preservation" estimates so they can start demolition as soon as they can.

It doesn't look like they actually have a crane there to take it down.