Criterion Concert Hall

[Pete]

^

The plan has always been to add neon to the marquee, they just haven't gotten to it yet.

They said they don't expect to be fully done with all the various work until late this year.

[HOT ROD]

i wasn't questioning the ad itself for bud light (and yes - I work in Marketing and Operations so I am familiar with the concept of leases), but I was questioning the advertising signs on the building - which look horrible from the pics.

[White Peacock]

^^^^^^
I did the same since the first show I paid for; a Styx show in Wichita in 1981. I wish I had the stub from the first show I actual attended, which was Elvis Presley in 1976 when I was 9.

I still have many of my stubs going back to The Smashing Pumpkins at the Myriad in '97, which was my first real concert if we ignore the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Coming Out of Our Shells tour.

[OkieNate]

i wasn't questioning the ad itself for bud light (and yes - I work in Marketing and Operations so I am familiar with the concept of leases), but I was questioning the advertising signs on the building - which look horrible from the pics.

What about it looks so horrible? I think it looks pretty minimalist and doesn't take away from the building at all and when the marquee gets its neon it really won't be that noticeable. Honestly asking what do you think they should have done instead?

[BDP]

I still have many of my stubs going back to The Smashing Pumpkins at the Myriad in '97, which was my first real concert if we ignore the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Coming Out of Our Shells tour.

I saw the pumpkins open up for Guns N Roses in '91, I think. They were touring on Gish, which is till my favorite. They weren't well known yet and they got boo'd off the stage (Corgan even said "there's a lot of mooing out there on the prairie", lol). I always think of that with amusement though, because, without a doubt, more than half of those people that booed would end up owning a Smashing Pumpkins album within the following two years.

[OkieHornet]

went to my morning jacket. great show. would've been even better if the sound had been more clear. loud, muddy, tinny... seemed to change throughout the show. not sure if it was mmj's soundguy who couldn't get it figured out? i heard more than a few people on the way out complaining about the sound too. i'm sure it was fine for some, though.

i liked the venue. felt spacious. the risers up top are great. i didn't get anything at the bar, but it looked like it backed up some at the area right behind the soundboard where there's not much room. not a fan of those tables right there that are roped off - is that a vip area?

[Pete]

^

Sound was great in my two trips (Ben Rector and Third Eye Blind) and for the first I was upstairs and the second I was on the floor about 1/4 of the way back from the stage.

How full was it last night?

[OkieHornet]

it looked fairly full to me - i was on the floor. i went upstairs for the last of the encore, and some people upstairs had already left, but i'd guess it was at least 3/4 full.

and speaking of capacity - how can that place hold 4000 people? i could see 3000 for sure, but 4000 seems like a stretch.

[BDP]

^

Sound was great in my two trips (Ben Rector and Third Eye Blind) and for the first I was upstairs and the second I was on the floor about 1/4 of the way back from the stage.

How full was it last night?

It was not as full as Third Eye Blind and the bars were not nearly as backed up, but it was a good crowd. 3/4 is probably about right. I also went upstairs for the first time and there was a beer cart. I did wonder why it was upstairs when there are two bars up there serving less people than the one bar (albeit with more servers) downstairs. Either way, I had little to no wait the times when I went to the bar at this show and it was much easier to get back to your spot on the floor.

Here is the Prince tribute they did:

Here’s My Morning Jacket’s Prince Tribute from Their Tour Opener

[Timshel]

^ I agree with Okie. Though I thought it was better for mmj than for The Barr Brothers. Thought the vocals were soft and muddy. I was in the middle of the crowd about halfway back from the stage. I was thinking the vocals may have been better upstairs as the speakers are up pretty high and off to the sides more than other venues of similar size that I've been to in the past (acknowledging full well that the sound engineers who worked on the Criterion know far more than I do), but it sounds like that may have not been the case. Overall, however, it was a great show.

Pete, I couldn't guess at the actual number but it was "full." I was impressed for a Wednesday show.

[TheTravellers]

Also went to MMJ, first time I've been to the Criterion, and yeah, sound sucked badly (we were upstairs) - lots of echoey overtone harmonic bouncing around stuff (whatever the technical term for that is) going on, instruments and voices dropped in and out. Pretty cool place, though, nice setup with the standing bleachers upstairs (except for the douchebag that thought he could save spots - um, it's standing room, people move around, no assigned "standing spots") and security keeping folks off the railings (wife's short, so she has to be on the front row to see anything). Saw quite a few beer carts, but they weren't that busy (I don't drink that crap, so didn't really notice how many folks queued up during the sets, I was at the real bars), still nice that they had them. Also had a sign up pointing to the box office (which could be easy to miss - 3 1' x 2'-sized windows that don't even look open when they're open). Had plumbing problems, though - every single faucet we tried in every single restroom barely worked with the sensors, wife said she tried turning the little knob on the side, but that didn't work either, so she just wiped off the soap with towels, so they need serious recalibrating. Overall, a very nice addition to OKC, very glad we have it! Prince tribute was amazing - Sign O'The Times, Raspberry Beret, and Purple Rain.

[TheTravellers]

went to my morning jacket. great show. would've been even better if the sound had been more clear. loud, muddy, tinny... seemed to change throughout the show. not sure if it was mmj's soundguy who couldn't get it figured out? i heard more than a few people on the way out complaining about the sound too. i'm sure it was fine for some, though.

i liked the venue. felt spacious. the risers up top are great. i didn't get anything at the bar, but it looked like it backed up some at the area right behind the soundboard where there's not much room. not a fan of those tables right there that are roped off - is that a vip area?

Apparently that is a VIP area, wife asked the security folks standing there if anybody could sit there and the response was an emphatic "No ma'am"

[Urbanized]

Regarding the sound, during the ULI tour of the facility Philip Randolph pointed out that all of the house sound had been struck at the request of MMJ, who was bringing its own equipment. So the bad sound - which was indeed terrible for the first half of the show until they got it dialed in pretty well for the second half - was 100% the band's fault, not the venue's. I also saw the Ben Rector show, utilizing house sound, and it was great. Hurts me to blame MMJ as I'm a big fan, but stuff like that happens and it WAS the first show of the tour, in their defense.

Regarding the VIP platform, you would have been a fan of it had you been standing/sitting on it, like I was. You also wouldn't want TheTravellers' wife crashing the party, because you - like me - would have spent a $40/ticket premium x 5 to have one of those tables. No offense, TT...

You too can have access to this platform (and a dedicated, protected VIP lane at the bar) for a premium, or if you opt for one of the season/premium ticketing upgrade packages. They start for as low as $1500 for a bank of tickets/upgrades to use at your discretion to a package of about $3K/ticket for every Live Nation show for the entire year.

[TheTravellers]

^^^ Thought the sound might've been MMJ's problem - folks on the floor said they were screwing around with the keyboards and other stuff for a while, hence the looong intermission, and yeah, first few shows of any tour are always the working-it-out part, but they did a great job despite that, really liked how they tailored their light show to focus on the chandelier. No offense taken about the tables, we were just curious, I wouldn't want us crashing a VIP section either, lol, but I don't think there were signs up that said reserved or VIP (we coulda missed 'em), just Table #n-type of signs, so we had to ask. Knew about the whole VIP package, told the wife about it after she found out the tables were part of it and she agreed that was a crazy price to pay for that kind of thing, so we'll just be standing/lining up with the rest of the riffraff...

[OkieHornet]

Regarding the sound, during the ULI tour of the facility Philip Randolph pointed out that all of the house sound had been struck at the request of MMJ, who was bringing its own equipment. So the bad sound - which was indeed terrible for the first half of the show until they got it dialed in pretty well for the second half - was 100% the band's fault, not the venue's. I also saw the Ben Rector show, utilizing house sound, and it was great. Hurts me to blame MMJ as I'm a big fan, but stuff like that happens and it WAS the first show of the tour, in their defense.

what defines house sound? speakers? soundboard? i can't defend mmj too much on this, even if it was their first show, because that's what the band's sound guys are paid to do - make the room sound good, whatever room it is.

[Urbanized]

The room was essential empty on the ULI tour. Not a speaker, monitor, board or cable anywhere in sight. The stage was pristine. I can only assume that MMJ supplied every aspect of the system. And I'm sure the band was just as unhappy with the sound situation as the crowd was.

The opening act sounded very good, so I assume it had something to do with the changeover. The intermission was very long and techs seemed to be hurriedly fiddling with a keyboard or other board of some type on the stage. The good news was that by about midway through the show the sound issues had been taken care of, and the two Prince covers, the encores and "One Big Holiday" sounded excellent.

Here's a simulation of what it was like to see MMJ play "One Big Holiday":

[onthestrip]

Here are the Prince covers they did at the Criterion.

[TheTravellers]

The room was essential empty on the ULI tour. Not a speaker, monitor, board or cable anywhere in sight. The stage was pristine. I can only assume that MMJ supplied every aspect of the system. And I'm sure the band was just as unhappy with the sound situation as the crowd was.

The opening act sounded very good, so I assume it had something to do with the changeover. The intermission was very long and techs seemed to be hurriedly fiddling with a keyboard or other board of some type on the stage. The good news was that by about midway through the show the sound issues had been taken care of, and the two Prince covers, the encores and "One Big Holiday" sounded excellent....

I'm not a huge MMJ fan (like their stuff, just not quite as into them as the wife is), and I just basically stood there until around the Prince covers thinking "Hmmm, I just don't get it", and the bad sound might've been a part of it, because it did get better for me after that. And there were 3 Prince covers - "Sign O'The Times", "Raspberry Beret", and "Purple Rain".

[sooner88]

I'm really looking forward to finally checking the venue out next week at Sturgill Simpson. He sold out Cain's last year...

http://www.tulsaworld.com/blogs/scen...0436a3845.html

[OkieHornet]

The room was essential empty on the ULI tour. Not a speaker, monitor, board or cable anywhere in sight. The stage was pristine. I can only assume that MMJ supplied every aspect of the system. And I'm sure the band was just as unhappy with the sound situation as the crowd was.

just my unknowledgeable opinion, but wouldn't you expect a venue that had a 2-week gap between shows to take down speakers and put up the sound gear? i would guess the speakers are the criterion's, but think the bands could travel fairly easily with their own sound/mixing boards so they'll be very familiar with them.

[Urbanized]

just my unknowledgeable opinion, but wouldn't you expect a venue that had a 2-week gap between shows to take down speakers and put up the sound gear? i would guess the speakers are the criterion's, but think the bands could travel fairly easily with their own sound/mixing boards so they'll be very familiar with them.

Not at all. The contract specifies whether the venue provides the sound or the band does. In some venues where the house provides the sound the equipment is actually rented, so in those cases I would expect the sound to be struck and returned to whoever they rent from. But if there is nothing else booked before a show where the venue is providing sound and they OWN the equipment, why on earth would they remove it and then replace it, essentially doubling their workload? You wouldn't; you would throw a protective cover over the sound board and call it a day. In this case the band was providing all sound, so everything was struck and stored by the venue after the prior show. On the tour I took Philip specifically pointed out that everything was moved out in anticipation of MMJ bringing their own stuff.

BTW, he also mentioned that since the venue chose to own a sound system - rather than rent on a show-by-show basis as many do - it helped keep ticket prices down.

[Urbanized]

I'm not a huge MMJ fan (like their stuff, just not quite as into them as the wife is), and I just basically stood there until around the Prince covers thinking "Hmmm, I just don't get it", and the bad sound might've been a part of it, because it did get better for me after that. And there were 3 Prince covers - "Sign O'The Times", "Raspberry Beret", and "Purple Rain".

Aha! I was in the crapper during Sign O' The Times.

[OkieHornet]

Not at all. The contract specifies whether the venue provides the sound or the band does. In some venues where the house provides the sound the equipment is actually rented, so in those cases I would expect the sound to be struck and returned to whoever they rent from. But if there is nothing else booked before a show where the venue is providing sound and they OWN the equipment, why on earth would they remove it and then replace it, essentially doubling their workload? You wouldn't; you would throw a protective cover over the sound board and call it a day. In this case the band was providing all sound, so everything was struck and stored by the venue after the prior show. On the tour I took Philip specifically pointed out that everything was moved out in anticipation of MMJ bringing their own stuff.

BTW, he also mentioned that since the venue chose to own a sound system - rather than rent on a show-by-show basis as many do - it helped keep ticket prices down.

ahh, i see. i was not aware the criterion owned all their sound equipment.

[BDP]

but think the bands could travel fairly easily with their own sound/mixing boards so they'll be very familiar with them.

Yeah, like Urbanized pointed out, they don't always travel with the whole PA, especially front of house stuff. They'll have their own amps and on stage processors, but a lot of times everything else is covered in the agreement with the promoter. It's basically addressed in the technical rider. Most people think about riders in terms of what color M&Ms the bands want or what kind of veggie burgers are their favorite, but a lot of it (most of it) is technical specs and what kind of equipment they need. It's often very specific, so most engineers will be familiar with whatever they ask for even if it isn't one specific board or processor that they carry with them all the time.

While I'm sure that they ran pink noise and had a sound check, the fact they brought everything may have limited their time they had before show due to a longer set up (which may have also led to the long intermission after the opener). I'm sure they had rehearsals with the gear leading up to the tour (most of which actually looks like festivals), so maybe they were kind of forced to start with the presets they got from those rehearsals which may have not been perfect for the room and adjusted on the fly. Total guess though. Sometimes it's just a case of how different the room can be once people fill it up. IMO, MMJs initial mix sounded more like it was tailored for a larger space or outdoors, but there's so many variables to consider it's impossible to really know without first hand knowledge of their approach. Some of it just comes down to taste and preferences, too. Comparing the Third Eye Blind with MMJ, I would have traded Stephen Jenkins's vocal mix for Jim James's initial level. Jenkins isn't really the strongest singer sometimes, and he was pretty upfront in the mix.

I will say though that the Criterion as it is now doesn't look like it would be a good sounding room. Looks can be very deceiving when it comes to acoustics, but there are still a lot of exposed hard flat surfaces, most notably the painted concrete floor. Even with people in the venue, that's going to cause some issues to address for any engineer. That being said, these things are addressed every day in most venues, so it can be and often is overcome. Interestingly, one of the best sounding arena shows I have ever been to was Stevie Wonder at Chesapeake, and that place is an acoustic nightmare. There were probably 40-50 people on that stage at some point, which means there were probably at least as many open mics, and it sounded great.

I'm thinking that the Sturgill Simpson show will better reveal what the room's inherent acoustic characteristics are. His stuff is typically "warmer" with less processing, less distortion, and more acoustic instrumentation, which often makes it much easier to identify how the room is affecting the sound.

[NWOKCGuy]

Went to see Disclosure here on Friday. I think this is easily the best venue I've been to in the state. Sound, visuals, everything was great. I'm not sure why, but they didn't open the second floor until right before Disclosure was going on so it was really crowded and hot at first. The bar was a mess but it looks like they are working on 2 bars on the upper level, so I think that will get worked out once those are open.