OKC as tourist destination

[HOT ROD]

and to add to that, Elitch Gardens used to be in the suburbs (in Arvada I think) but moved to a vast empty section just west of Downtown Denver back in the mid-1990's and the rest is history. Just imagine if the same took place in OKC with Frontier City Theme & White Water Park? In fact, having it near or close to Stockyard's City might even help that district out a little bit (being that both are western themed while one is amusement and the other is reality). The other thing I like about combined and near downtown is all of the publicity OKC would get from I-40 as a happening/fun place to stop. It would really be like "wow, something is really going on in OKC".

[HangryHippo]

and to add to that, Elitch Gardens used to be in the suburbs (in Arvada I think) but moved to a vast empty section just west of Downtown Denver back in the mid-1990's and the rest is history. Just imagine if the same took place in OKC with Frontier City Theme & White Water Park? In fact, having it near or close to Stockyard's City might even help that district out a little bit (being that both are western themed while one is amusement and the other is reality). The other thing I like about combined and near downtown is all of the publicity OKC would get from I-40 as a happening/fun place to stop. It would really be like "wow, something is really going on in OKC".

You know, there's a common trend throughout most of OKC's recent development that we don't really place things where they can feed off the synergy they'd create together. We plop crap down wherever and then wonder why it doesn't end up fitting, why it's here and not there. Very annoying because all it takes is a little forethought and this becomes a non-issue.

[ljbab728]

You know, there's a common trend throughout most of OKC's recent development that we don't really place things where they can feed off the synergy they'd create together. We plop crap down wherever and then wonder why it doesn't end up fitting, why it's here and not there. Very annoying because all it takes is a little forethought and this becomes a non-issue.

At the time that Frontier City and, much later, Whitewater were built it would have made little sense to build them anywhere near downtown.

[HangryHippo]

At the time that Frontier City and, much later, Whitewater were built it would have made little sense to build them anywhere near downtown.

I said nothing about downtown. I was simply saying that when Whitewater was built "much later", it surely would have made a lot of sense to locate it near Frontier City for some synergy. Of course, this is but one example of what I'm talking about.

[ljbab728]

I said nothing about downtown. I was simply saying that when Whitewater was built "much later", it surely would have made a lot of sense to locate it near Frontier City for some synergy. Of course, this is but one example of what I'm talking about.

Someone else mentioned the downtown area.

The two parks were not developed by the same people originally. I don't think White Water has suffered financially from not being near Frontier City and I think there was likely more traffic and better accessibility from more of the metro area where it was built. Would have been nice to be together? Maybe, but it probably didn't make economic sense at the time. When you're having to make decisions based on financial considerations you do what is best for you.

Universal Studios did not build next door to WDW in Orlando.

[HOT ROD]

that may not be the best example since US and WDW are competitors whereas FC and WW are not (and actually a waterpark component would significantly help FC out, even back when WW was built).

Anyway, I so wish there was a way to make a downtown move and combination of parks happen. Imagine driving down I-40 having Frontier City White Water on the right and the downtown skyline on the left. ... Who in their right mind wouldn't stop the car in OKC and spend a day or two (or more)? ....

[ljbab728]

that may not be the best example since US and WDW are competitors whereas FC and WW are not (and actually a waterpark component would significantly help FC out, even back when WW was built).

Anyway, I so wish there was a way to make a downtown move and combination of parks happen. Imagine driving down I-40 having Frontier City White Water on the right and the downtown skyline on the left. ... Who in their right mind wouldn't stop the car in OKC and spend a day or two (or more)? ....

Universal Studios and WDW and absolutely not direct competitors. They compliment each other and provide additional reasons for vacationers to visit Orlando. Do you honestly think that Universal would have ever built in Orlando if WDW hadn't been there first? And they were obviously not concerned about being close to WDW.

[HOT ROD]

hence my point, that was a bad comparison bringing up WDW.

[ljbab728]

hence my point, that was a bad comparison bringing up WDW.

No, my comparison was quite appropriate. You might also note that Universal Studios in LA is a significant distance from Disneyland and it has nothing to do with being competitors or not. It was a matter of convenience in location for Universal. Seaworld in San Antonio and Six Flags did not find it necessary to be close together to be successful and they are very different types of parks. As I said, it might have been nice to have the two parks together in OKC, but obviously was not the best option for the original developers of White Water.

[Praedura]

A visitor to OKC from Houston blogs about it here:

Jan Paul Yap: [Drive Log] Oklahoma City - Day 1

Jan Paul Yap: [Drive Log] Oklahoma City - Day 2

Oklahoma City has a unique vibe - somewhat of a small town pace in a big old-city setting.

This is actually from about a year ago. I just found the site today. He took some nice pics of the town while he was here.


































Many more pics at the links.

[bchris02]

Great blog. It looks like this guy did his research before coming to OKC and knew where to go and painted a much more positive image of this city than many other's I've seen.

[PWitty]

I'm sure some more seasoned posters will correct me on this, but outside of business travel I don't know many people who would go visit cities, other than a select few (NYC, SF, Chi, LA, etc.), unless they were going to visit family or friends in the area or had a specific need to go. I could have just been oblivious, but even in KC I never heard about it being a "tourist" spot. The main thing that brought people from outside the area to the city was Royals and Chiefs games or alumni from KU making trips back for whatever reason. At least as far as I knew

[PWitty]

And I agree, those photos were exceptional. It's too bad people aren't forced to sit down and look at photos like those before they post opinions on cities like OKC on the internet. There's nothing boring and redneck about those.

[bchris02]

And I agree, those photos were exceptional. It's too bad people aren't forced to sit down and look at photos like those before they post opinions on cities like OKC on the internet. There's nothing boring and redneck about those.

Here are a couple of posts from somebody on City-Data forum who just moved to OKC from the UK. If anybody here has a City-Data account, you know that OKC is not well liked on there and the negative Pre-MAPS image is the one most of the posters accept as fact.

I've been here (in Norman) for about 5 weeks now following a relocation from the UK. I can catagorically state that the scare mongering on this form re religion and Conservatism is fastly out of proporation with the reality. At least of what I've seen. Talking to people from my office that *impression* of OKC and area is about 15 yrs out of date. Ok ,its not LA here, but hey the Flaming Lips are from OKC. Mumford and Sons and Alabama Shakes have played Guthrie last month and the Lumineers played this week.

In fact the overidding obsession amongst the vast majority seems to be love of everthing sports related, particulary the OU football team. That and the OKC Thunder are the true religion here it seems.

I was genuinely worried about relgion and conservatism being ramed doen my throat , but It's simply not the case. No matter what your culture or creed the vast majority of the people here are super friendly and welcoming.

Ok , We've been here about 5 weeks so enough time to get an overall impression. Well of Norman anyway. I must say reading this forum from the UK really had a worried about what we were walking in on. There are some real scre mongers on here. Hey... OK is pretty OK really.

First the Good.

We've found Norman to be a very safe environment
Lots of good restaurants
People here are super friendly
Guestroom Records - Probably one of the best record shops in the world.
You guys just love the Sooners and big trucks.
The Sun shines (For a person used to living under tupperware, I love the sun)
As a road cyclist, car drivers are very respectful (compared to the UK at least)
The OU campus
Norman schools are really good. My kids love it here.
did I mention Guestroom records ?

... the bad. (not much really).. so some minor gripes

As a cyclist some of the roads are in really bad condition
The whole "cant buy Wine in Supermarkets thing" !! (I guess that's more of a state wide thing)
The house rental market here is really aggressive (but I get why)
Cox cable with Contour is overy complicated. This is something we do much better in the UK

Personally, I think much of the negative stereotype keeps getting regurgitated by either people who know a little about the state politics and have only been to OKC driving through on I-40. The number of country stations on the radio probably confirms their "redneck" perception. Also, in the case of City-Data, a lot of blue staters simply jump on the bandwagon of bashing OKC.

[bchris02]

I'm sure some more seasoned posters will correct me on this, but outside of business travel I don't know many people who would go visit cities, other than a select few (NYC, SF, Chi, LA, etc.), unless they were going to visit family or friends in the area or had a specific need to go. I could have just been oblivious, but even in KC I never heard about it being a "tourist" spot. The main thing that brought people from outside the area to the city was Royals and Chiefs games or alumni from KU making trips back for whatever reason. At least as far as I knew

I agree with this. OKC is not the type of city that would ever really be a tourist destination except to people from surrounding states. A good tourist destination isn't necissarily just the large cities, but cities that offer things that are unique that you can't get elsewhere. OKC just isn't that type of city (and neither is Charlotte). A lot of people do come to OKC on business or for various reasons however and I think a lot of them are very surprised if they are able to break past the stereotype.

[Urbanized]

Business travelers who are here for meetings/conferences also plan leisure return trips if a city engages them enough and they can't fit in enough sightseeing. I have done this a number of times myself, returning to vacation in a city which I had previously visited on business.

Because of the nature and location of my business, my employees and I routinely engage visitors to OKC and ask them where they are from and why they are visiting OKC. I have spoken to many people who have returned here by choice to explore a place that surprised them on a business or other type of visit. I was mildly surprised the first time I heard it; now not so much.

But there is quite a bit of ignorance among OKC residents as to just how many out-of-state and international travelers are here on a daily basis. EVERY DAY we talk with people from places like the UK, France, Germany, Sweden, Taiwan, Jordan, Japan, China, India and elsewhere. Did they all travel here just to visit OKC? Of course not. We are PART of their trip to see/experience the United States.

How many of you turn vacations into road trips, or hub-and-spoke from one place while visiting an entire region? That's the way I usually travel, and so do many others. If a trip involves this part of the country, OKC often becomes a key part of it.

We are an important stop on Route 66, which many view as the holy grail when it comes to experiencing America. We are also a major outpost/overnight/crossroads on three major interstates. So our job is to catch people passing through and offer them reason enough to linger. These days we do an excellent job of this, and have developed an excellent reputation in the travel industry.

People who think we are not and will never be a tourist destination are, put simply, clueless to the reality that ALREADY exists here.

[bchris02]

An integral part of OKC's tourist future lies with the Native American cultural center. The state really needs to get with the program and make it a reality. An updated Science Museum will also be a great thing for people who have kids. I've said this before but it surprises me with OKC being at a major national crossroads that it does not have a real theme park. I don't see how such a thing would not be a huge hit.

[bchris02]

I don't really do theme parks. How does Frontier City compare to others?

Frontier City is a mere street carnival compared to parks like Six Flags in Texas or Carrowinds in Charlotte. It's fun for the kids, but not really for teen or adult thrill seekers like a major park would be. Magic Springs in Hot Springs, Arkansas, while by no means a great park compared to the two I mentioned, is better than Frontier City.

[PWitty]

Frontier City is a mere street carnival compared to parks like Six Flags in Texas or Carrowinds in Charlotte. It's fun for the kids, but not really for teen or adult thrill seekers like a major park would be. Magic Springs in Hot Springs, Arkansas, while by no means a great park compared to the two I mentioned, is better than Frontier City.

Yeah, I've never been to Frontier City but I have driven by. Growing up around KC I have been to Worlds of Fun MANY times, and Frontier City doesn't look like it stacks up too well to that. I think the problem is with Six Flags Over Texas so close in Arlington nobody wants to make a major theme park investment in OKC.

[Plutonic Panda]

Frontier City is a mere street carnival compared to parks like Six Flags in Texas or Carrowinds in Charlotte. It's fun for the kids, but not really for teen or adult thrill seekers like a major park would be. Magic Springs in Hot Springs, Arkansas, while by no means a great park compared to the two I mentioned, is better than Frontier City.

I might get some crap for saying this, but I think a Disney resort/theme park would be very successful here. We are located nearly in the center of the country and have some of the bigegst interstates passing right through us, I44/I40/I35. They could call it Disney Universe or something. If we got a Disney park here, I bet a Universal Theme park would be built here soon after, it's a win win win. I know it will likely never happen, but if my dreams come true, I would like to one day build a true theme park here in OKC.

I've also thought that if a true theme park were to be built here, it would be cool if they made Frontier City the biggest halloween scare house in the world. That would be freakin sick!!!! It would obviously have to renamed, but I would support it. It could be open from September 10th to November 5th.

Also just to say, if a new Disney park were to built in the U.S., it would be very likely go in Dallas or Houston.

[ljbab728]

Plupan, I won't give you crap for saying it but Disney won't go to a location where they can't operate year round in reasonably good weather conditions and OKC doesn't qualify. I know they are in Paris and Tokyo but those cities are somewhat unique in that regard.

[Plutonic Panda]

Plupan, I won't give you crap for saying it but Disney won't go to a location where they can't operate year round in reasonably good weather conditions and OKC doesn't qualify. I know they are in Paris and Tokyo but those cities are somewhat unique in that regard.

Yeah, I figured as much. If a new Disney park is to be built in the US, Houston will almost certainly get it,

[Teo9969]

Among the important things for OKC to strengthen tourism:

1. Better public transit: Bad transit simply eliminate or hurts perception with a percentage of tourists. For some it makes it a non-option city. For some, they just prefer not to drive all about a city they've never been to.

2. Much stronger core area. Imagine if Capitol Hill, Plaza, 23rd, Western Ave, Film Row, 39th/Penn, and Belle Isle were all even 25% as marketable as Bricktown. If all of those areas became vibrant districts (which will of course take time) then it increases the chances for a tourist to miss something. People feeling like they missed out on something not only generates repeat tourism, it generates excitement and reason for people who hear these tourists' stories to add OKC to the list.

3. Educated and engaged citizens. This is probably the most important aspect to going from a place known for The Memorial, The Thunder, and Bricktown (maybe a few museums) to a place where #2 becomes a reality.

[bchris02]

Yeah, I've never been to Frontier City but I have driven by. Growing up around KC I have been to Worlds of Fun MANY times, and Frontier City doesn't look like it stacks up too well to that. I think the problem is with Six Flags Over Texas so close in Arlington nobody wants to make a major theme park investment in OKC.

I disagree that OKC is too close to Arlington. Charlotte is around the same distance from Atlanta and it can support a major park. Kansas City is just a few hours from St. Louis and they both have parks. If OKC's population is the worry, it also has to be considered that a major park in OKC would also draw from Tulsa, Wichita, Ft Smith, and maybe even Little Rock. Metro population itself isn't important to supporting a theme park as the location and draw it would have from surrounding areas. Also, unless it's improved in the past few years, Worlds of Fun in Kansas City has seen better days. It's still a significant cut above Frontier City but not what it was back in the 1990s.

[hoya]

Among the important things for OKC to strengthen tourism:

1. Better public transit: Bad transit simply eliminate or hurts perception with a percentage of tourists. For some it makes it a non-option city. For some, they just prefer not to drive all about a city they've never been to.

2. Much stronger core area. Imagine if Capitol Hill, Plaza, 23rd, Western Ave, Film Row, 39th/Penn, and Belle Isle were all even 25% as marketable as Bricktown. If all of those areas became vibrant districts (which will of course take time) then it increases the chances for a tourist to miss something. People feeling like they missed out on something not only generates repeat tourism, it generates excitement and reason for people who hear these tourists' stories to add OKC to the list.

3. Educated and engaged citizens. This is probably the most important aspect to going from a place known for The Memorial, The Thunder, and Bricktown (maybe a few museums) to a place where #2 becomes a reality.

I definitely agree with #1 and #2. I don't know that having Joe Smith from Edmond be more knowledgable about the city really matters much.

People should be able to take public transit from the airport to any major attraction within the city. Having a denser city as well will mean there are more things to do. We need to build up instead of spreading out. If I'm here for a business trip, I should be able to get on a train at the airport, take it to my hotel downtown, attend my conference, then go to the zoo, or the racetrack, the Cowboy Hall of Fame, Frontier City, basically any kind of touristy thing I want to do, all by public transit. I shouldn't have to rent a car. That will make it more likely that I will want to come back.

Stockyards City could be a big attraction if we were to develop it the right way. A streetcar line running down past the Farmer's Market building to that area would really help things along. Tourist things don't have to just be theme parks. Going into a store and buying a $300 pair of cowboy boots or a hat can be just as much of a tourist thing.