Santa Fe Station

[Martin]

according to the assessor's site, bricktown real estate llc paid $374,667 for the property in 1998. i'm not sure how much they've spent in restoring the building since then, but i'm positive $23.5m would give them an insane return on their investment. -M

[Bellaboo]

according to the assessor's site, bricktown real estate llc paid $374,667 for the property in 1998. i'm not sure how much they've spent in restoring the building since then, but i'm positive $23.5m would give them an insane return on their investment. -M

I think it was reported they had received a 1 million dollar federal grant, which was applied to restoration.

[MustangGT]

I have no sympathy for the Brewers. Nor do the Brewers seem to have any sense of civic pride. Screw 'em.

I agree they are low degenerates that cannot assume room temperature soon enough. Their daddy was a crook thru and thru. The apple landed right at the base of the tree.

[OKCPhotog]

I honestly don't see how the Santa Fe Station could be the central hub for a metro lightrail system. It seems to me that the rails and the station itself is way too small to accommodate the amount of traffic that could potentially pass through there.

[Larry OKC]

What a crock of crap. I do think the city lowballed the Brewers, but they want to support their children by extorting the city? Why can't they just come to a reasonable price in the middle? The Brewers make money and the city gets to work on the transit hub. Honest to god, why does this stuff have to be so hard?

It is the starting point of the negotiations...both sides go back and forth and meet somewhere in the middle to a mutually acceptable number...or go into the eminent domain thing...

There aren't that many places that you can put a train station indeed. It is the perfect example as to why imminent domain capabilities should exist.

But there ARE other places though, right? Just as with the COnvention Center/Cotton Mill, if the asking price is unacceptable, move on. I am against I.D. in general, especially when you are talking about government coming in and using it for a public want as opposed to a public need. Especially true when governments use it to buy property not for a public purpose (government buildings, parks etc) but turn around and sell it to private investors for development (like they might do on the properties surrounding the MAPS 3 Park). If you need to use I.D. for the Park land, that is one thing, but the properties surrounding it? NO.

I think it was reported they had received a 1 million dollar federal grant, which was applied to restoration.

And they put in $1 million of their own money for that too. The City's offer doesn't amount to that much of a profit. Have to factor in the amount of time they have owned the property, property value increases etc etc. When you do that, are they asking too much? Is the City low-balling? I don't know.

[Midtowner]

The city needs to file an eminent domain case and just run with it.

[RadicalModerate]

There aren't that many places that you can put a train station indeed. It is the perfect example as to why imminent domain capabilities should exist.

yeah. and eminent domain too! =)
this type of anti-communial BS crosses all "party lines" . . .

(metaphorically speakin', o' course):
Here's what should be just over the imminent virtual horizon of these pathetic money-grubbers' efforts to join the One-Percenters: They should be tarred, feathered, and run out of town ON A RAIL!!!!

(the irony itself is nearly overwhelming. is that a real train whistle that i hear in the distance? yes it is. =)

Say! Before Willam H. Macy leaves town, maybe someone could pitch him the concept of a Reality TV Show revolving around this issue! Loosely based on American Pickers . . . it could be called . . . American Dickers!

(btw: the photos of that lobby are beautiful. when someone got off the train, back in the day, they would have had a GREAT first impression of Oklahoma (city).)

[Larry OKC]

Radical: I agree, the interior shots are great...would never guess from the outside, that that was on the inside.

[BoulderSooner]

I honestly don't see how the Santa Fe Station could be the central hub for a metro lightrail system. It seems to me that the rails and the station itself is way too small to accommodate the amount of traffic that could potentially pass through there.

read this http://www.acogok.org/Programs_and_S...s/hubstudy.asp

clearly enough room .. and it wouldn't be light rail it would be used for commuter rail

[hoya]

The $2 million the city offered was clearly a lowball. The property is worth a lot more than that. Just because the Brewers invested wisely and bought a key piece of property early for a good price is no reason to screw them over. Of course the $23 million they countered with is just as crazy the other way.

They should get what the property is really worth. Eminent domain isn't intended to screw people out of their land, or to just give them back the money they invested. The Brewers should get fair market value. Both sides should negotiate in good faith. If the city starts screaming about eminent domain, that will reflect badly on them if this case goes on to court, especially if the Brewers can show that the property is much more valuable than the $2 million the city was initially offering. Then it looks like the city is using their power unjustly, and we might end up paying a lot more for it because of that.

[BoulderSooner]

The $2 million the city offered was clearly a lowball. The property is worth a lot more than that. Just because the Brewers invested wisely and bought a key piece of property early for a good price is no reason to screw them over. Of course the $23 million they countered with is just as crazy the other way.

They should get what the property is really worth. Eminent domain isn't intended to screw people out of their land, or to just give them back the money they invested. The Brewers should get fair market value. Both sides should negotiate in good faith. If the city starts screaming about eminent domain, that will reflect badly on them if this case goes on to court, especially if the Brewers can show that the property is much more valuable than the $2 million the city was initially offering. Then it looks like the city is using their power unjustly, and we might end up paying a lot more for it because of that.

ED goes to a 3 person panel that sets the "fair" market price ... what the city or the brewers do now doesn't have an effect .... like i have said before the city IMHO will play 5 mil or less

[Pete]

BTW, the City has used eminent domain multiple times in acquiring the land for Central Park and the process has seemed to move relatively quickly.

[hoya]

ED goes to a 3 person panel that sets the "fair" market price ... what the city or the brewers do now doesn't have an effect .... like i have said before the city IMHO will play 5 mil or less

And the owners can sue if they feel they are getting shortchanged in the deal. My point is that if the Brewers have invested $1M of their own funds and $1M in federal grants, that property may be worth quite a bit more than $2M. If the city pushes for ED seizure too quickly or without negotiating, it could come back to hurt them later. I am not against seizing it if that is what becomes necessary, but my preference would be a negotiated deal instead.

[hoya]

BTW, the City has used eminent domain multiple times in acquiring the land for Central Park and the process has seemed to move relatively quickly.

Big difference between taking some worthless shacks and taking a historic piece of architecture from a family with the money to sue you.

[BoulderSooner]

Big difference between taking some worthless shacks and taking a historic piece of architecture from a family with the money to sue you.

not really

[okcboy]

Negotiations are what needs to happen. Their low offer is just as bad as the high counter. In the article it said that an appraisal is coming soon and that will set some ground work in place of what some fair comps and income streams are worth. The city wants to move at a faster pace and a ultimatum letter was given to the family to produce a "number" by the end of January and thats what happened. Due diligence by the property owner is still on going and just needs some time. Its just a "number" and there is no ill intent or lack of civic pride here. Its just a business deal that has to take its course and the city wants to pay as little as they can and the family is trying to get the most they can.

[Rover]

Bet the appraisal is MUCH closer to the city offer than the Brewer family number. It's one thing to try to get fair value and quite another to try to pillage the city.

[HOT ROD]

yep, I'd be surprised if the appraisal is worth more than $3M. Brewers should have offered $4M or $5M max, Im sure the city would have gone for that.

I agree the Brewers shouldn't get screwed over for their building but then again - what have they done with it to make it all of the sudden worth nearly as much as some of the AAA towers downtown are selling for? ??? That train station isn't even open most of the time nor is it staffed. ....

Looks like the Brewers want to screw the city, not the other way.

[BoulderSooner]

Negotiations are what needs to happen. Their low offer is just as bad as the high counter. In the article it said that an appraisal is coming soon and that will set some ground work in place of what some fair comps and income streams are worth. The city wants to move at a faster pace and a ultimatum letter was given to the family to produce a "number" by the end of January and thats what happened. Due diligence by the property owner is still on going and just needs some time. Its just a "number" and there is no ill intent or lack of civic pride here. Its just a business deal that has to take its course and the city wants to pay as little as they can and the family is trying to get the most they can.

the owners were contacted months and months ago ... the city is moving a a deliberate pace (not fast)

[HangryHippo]

Negotiations are what needs to happen. Their low offer is just as bad as the high counter. In the article it said that an appraisal is coming soon and that will set some ground work in place of what some fair comps and income streams are worth. The city wants to move at a faster pace and a ultimatum letter was given to the family to produce a "number" by the end of January and thats what happened. Due diligence by the property owner is still on going and just needs some time. Its just a "number" and there is no ill intent or lack of civic pride here. Its just a business deal that has to take its course and the city wants to pay as little as they can and the family is trying to get the most they can.

OKC waited months for their counteroffer. Did you even bother reading the article? There's not really all that much due diligence that needs to happen on the part of the Brewers. They have a cupcake shop and two ad boards and whatever they get from Amtrak. They're trying to screw the city.

[okcboy]

OKC waited months for their counteroffer. Did you even bother reading the article? There's not really all that much due diligence that needs to happen on the part of the Brewers. They have a cupcake shop and two ad boards and whatever they get from Amtrak. They're trying to screw the city.

That's your opinion but there is more to this story. I'm interested in seeing this kind of article about the acquisition of the convention center property.

[Midtowner]

This turned out to be very prophetic. There will be no sympathy for the Brewers after their outrageous sale price. They come off as petty extortionists as a previous poster pointed out.

To be fair, you can't extort the city government. They have the power of eminent domain and will probably commence condemnation proceedings shortly. I can speak with a little bit of authority on that subject as my firm has represented many landowners and governmental entities in these sorts of cases. The Brewers (and any landowner in this situation) need to hire experienced legal counsel ASAP and quickly start working on their own appraisals. They should avoid throwing out high numbers to the media or doing anything to influence a high commissioner's award. If the city really thinks this property is going to only appraise for a $2.5MM commissioner's award, all the Brewers' attorney would have to do at trial is get a jury to come back with $2,750,001 or more and the city gets to pay the bill for the Brewers' attorney fees. From previous experience with the city of OKC/ODOT, etc., their appraisers lowball things, which if they get a good attorney on the other side and a good appraisal on the other side, they're not doing themselves any favors.

Then again, who besides the city has any use for a train station? It's going to be tough to determine fair market value in terms of the value exchanged between a willing buyer and a willing seller for a well-located train station in OKC. I'd be really curious to see what goes into that appraisal.

[Midtowner]

They're trying to screw the city.

No, it looks like they're trying to lobby for a high commissioner's award.

That has a real potential to blow up right in their face.

[LakeEffect]

Big difference between taking some worthless shacks and taking a historic piece of architecture from a family with the money to sue you.

My underground understanding of their finances is that the Brewer sons aren't nearly has business-minded and proficient as their father. Therefore, they don't have the money to sue. They need a cash supplement to help them out of other over-leveraged deals.

[Skyline]

Can someone refresh my memory...... Why were the Brewers allowed to purchase the building to begin with, Why was it for sale?