University Town Center

[rcjunkie]

This is the progression of this project.

Large mixed-use lifestyle center > Project on hold, give us another year > Just Target strip mall only > Can't get lifestyle center tenants, but here's Discount Tire and Academy > Office portion ready to go > Oops can't get discount tire, office park having trouble now > Instead of office park, howabout a nice new "advanced manufacturing center" instead? > Utter fail?? > Citizens revolt and get their money back?

Maybe just wishful thinking..

The "advanced manufacturing center" has always been a compoent of this development. The far N. section (closer to Tecumseh Rd.) was the section identified for this land use segment.

[Questor]

They probably didn't even think about it. However, I could see Warren wanting Moore over Norman to be a bit closer to pull from North OKC.

I have no idea if this is true, but a business owner in UNP once told me that the Warren was initially supposed to go into UNP but that the city had such ridiculous regulations they eventually started looking elsewhere. Elsewhere ended up being Moore because of all their incentives. One has to wonder if there is some truth to that when you consider the number of plans that have been released showing businesses that ultimately went to Moore instead, Five Guys being a good example.

[ChargerAg]

I have no idea if this is true, but a business owner in UNP once told me that the Warren was initially supposed to go into UNP but that the city had such ridiculous regulations they eventually started looking elsewhere. Elsewhere ended up being Moore because of all their incentives. One has to wonder if there is some truth to that when you consider the number of plans that have been released showing businesses that ultimately went to Moore instead, Five Guys being a good example.

So we aren't getting the 5 guys anymore?

[progressiveboy]

So we aren't getting the 5 guys anymore?

I am pretty sure Norman will still be getting a 5 Guys Burgers because their website shows a location "Coming Soon" to Norman. I hope that Norman will eventually step up to the plate and get a few decent shops in that development. UNP has been somewhat of a dissapointment.

[rcjunkie]

So we aren't getting the 5 guys anymore?

5 Guys is going in the same area (under construction) as Zio's, should open early fall.

[venture]

I have no idea if this is true, but a business owner in UNP once told me that the Warren was initially supposed to go into UNP but that the city had such ridiculous regulations they eventually started looking elsewhere. Elsewhere ended up being Moore because of all their incentives. One has to wonder if there is some truth to that when you consider the number of plans that have been released showing businesses that ultimately went to Moore instead, Five Guys being a good example.

Yeah, it is definitely a trend that Norman is its biggest enemy when it comes to landing new businesses. There is no reason Norman isn't able to compete, effectively, to land companies that are going to OKC or the other suburbs. Unfortunately the mayor and council haven't really shown much willingness to change the way they do business.

[dop]

I saw where OKC gave an incentive of 7 million plus to attract the outlet mall. Norman would never offer any incentive money...the council would argue about natural development and that everyone should be treated fairly, the little guy would get cheated, and that they could not afford it! This incentive money is small change in comparison to the return OKC will get from it.

[OKCNDN]

that sounds horrible.

Where is the discount tire that we were promised.

Discount Tire is anything but...

They have the highest prices around. Always a little pushy too. "No reason to go anywhere else, we have the lowest prices anywhere". The thing about tires is many shops are the only places to get certain tires, not brands but models. You can't comparison shop. That's my experience anyway.

[venture]

I saw where OKC gave an incentive of 7 million plus to attract the outlet mall. Norman would never offer any incentive money...the council would argue about natural development and that everyone should be treated fairly, the little guy would get cheated, and that they could not afford it! This incentive money is small change in comparison to the return OKC will get from it.

$7 million to get something like $50 million annually in sales tax revenue. Yeah...terrible. lol

There was a story in the Transcript or DOK about the outlet and the support OKC gave it to land the project. They were very honest about being aggressive to bring in businesses from suburbs to raise the city's sales tax revenues. So the situation for Norman is going to become...do they continue the current "natural development" philosophy and permit OKC and Moore to take business away, or play the same game and lure companies away from surrounding areas.

Eventually the city will need to decide - do they want to be proactive and grow, or settle being a commuter community supporting OKC's growing revenue base.

[JimTrabersColostomyBag]

I saw where OKC gave an incentive of 7 million plus to attract the outlet mall. Norman would never offer any incentive money...the council would argue about natural development and that everyone should be treated fairly, the little guy would get cheated, and that they could not afford it! This incentive money is small change in comparison to the return OKC will get from it.

RE: the little guy would get cheated..... ask all those eating establishments around the Warren Theatre if they would rather have the theatre there or an empty field.

[metro]

I saw where OKC gave an incentive of 7 million plus to attract the outlet mall. Norman would never offer any incentive money...the council would argue about natural development and that everyone should be treated fairly, the little guy would get cheated, and that they could not afford it! This incentive money is small change in comparison to the return OKC will get from it.

The incentive was for tax credits so they could use it for advertising, like over a 5 or 10 year period.

[Just the facts]

I was suspicious of the project from the beginning. Rarely do directions to Louis Vuitton stores begin with "make a right at the Dress Barn and keep going until you see TJ Maxx"

Check out St. Johns Town Center. To get to Louis Vuitton you can enter by PetsMart, pass by Dress Barn, turn right at Target, turn right again at Dollar Tree, left at the ATT store, go around the traffic circle, and Louis Vuitton is just ahead on your right.

http://www.simon.com/mall/FloorPlan.aspx?id=857

[venture]

Can we just take that and copy it for UNP?

It is disturbing that even in Moore they are talking about a lifestyle center there now and we can get this stupid one built. Rosenthal seems to be sleeping.

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?s...2997240&type=1

[Just the facts]

Can we just take that and copy it for UNP?

St Johns Town Center has it is own screw-ups as well. They have condos on site but they put a pond in-between it and the shopping which require people living on site to have to drive a 1/2 mile to go to a store that is 100 feet from their front door.

[venture]

That is pretty stupid. I'm all for water features...but work in a couple artsy/scenic bridges (walking and vehicle) to allow for easy connections and promote a neighborhood type setting.

[Jesseda]

went to ulta with the family this morning and i noticed that the rock creek bridge is now open.. So is there going to be anything new being built or announced for the unp area?

[kevinpate]

It's been open several weeks now. The once planned office complex for that northern end of UNP seems to be, at best, in a coma. The once planned, allegedly anyway, lifestyle center for the eastern part of UNP seems to be, at best, a long forgotten pipe dream. Seems the current thinking is that nobody is building lifestyle centers anymore and they feel they missed out but are hopeful something else will work out.

Not the city's best laid plans all in all. But as my bank moved there from Main I'll likely go over to that area more now. Hadn't been much to date to make it worth the bother.

[BG918]

It would be good if they could at least finish the lake that was supposed to go in south of Academy. The new bridge looks nice.

[Questor]

Another hotel and a Crest Foods are planned, but the developer is dragging his feet on turning over the land....

http://normantranscript.com/headline...under-scrutiny

[ljbab728]

It's interesting that the developer wants to alter pedestrian friendly areas to allow for more parking. Is that area so busy that no one can find a place to park?

[kevinpate]

Followup on the Oct. 4 study session:

Norman city council members tonight ordered City Attorney Jeff Bryant to let University North Park developers know there would be no further negotiations until land for Legacy Park has been dedicated to the city as promised. “The developer is not negotiating with the city in good faith,” Council Member Hal Ezzell said. “The developer is playing games.”
No members of the University Town Center development team were at the study session meeting. The Transcript spoke to Stanton Nelson, a Norman resident and member of the development team, by phone following the meeting.
“It’s more complicated than just the delivery of giving the land,” Nelson said. “From my perspective, I want to see the park developed. I believe it will be a benefit to the city. We want to see it happen. We want to see an agreement made. The partnership is more than willing to donate the land in order to make this a reality, but it’s more complicated than that.”

Full article is at
http://normantranscript.com/headline...ark-dedication

[venture]

What I don't get is that the park was part of the plan agreed to at the beginning...so why is it more complicated now to just get that part done?

Just screams of a developer that has/had no intention of following through on anything they agreed to and continue to develop a big box haven.

[lasomeday]

I am sure the developer has breached his agreement. The land is owned by the city right?

[kevinpate]

5 Guys is going in the same area (under construction) as Zio's, should open early fall.

Driving by their site on my way elsewhere yesterday, they have Now Hiring signs hanging outside their entry. Apparently they are still on track for opening soon.

[kevinpate]

The theater is out and a cluster of hotels and a grocery store are in, reported University North Park Developer Bob Stearns of Sooner Investments.

(emphasis added)

Stearns and architect Frank Goppold reported to city council members on the changing vision for the TIF District development on 24th Avenue Northwest. Discussion revolved around plans for a town center, a concept which replaces plans for a lifestyle center originally proposed for the project.

(emphasis added)

“We’re excited about this cluster of hotels to anchor the village center,” Goppold said. He described the “streetscape” of the proposed village center as reminiscent of a boulevard in Paris with a wide median containing a double row of trees. ...

Rest is at:
http://normantranscript.com/headline...learer-for-TIF