2014 Oklahoma Commercial Aviation Discussion

[HOT ROD]

so happy about the Seattle-OKC announcement for Alaska. It's about time!

So sad about the EWR-OKC and F9 DEN-OKC. Shoot, it almost seems like one foot forward, two steps backward.

Hopefully there will be more consideration and we'll get those routes back as it would equal overall growth. If not then perhaps OKC could get more mainline to ORD or IAD to funnel the NYC pax who'd start using those hub routes.

[NWOKCGuy]

Losing EWR definitely sucks but I wouldn't consider losing F9 to DEN as a step backward.

[Video Expert]

I guess there is just too much capacity to DEN from here for F9 to make it. I can't say I'll miss them, I don't care for their product.

I hear you! I tried them once last year and I vowed it would be the last. F9 is obsessed with bag sizes, $2 soft drinks, and charging extra for just about everything including carry-ons. They actually demanded that I resize my bag to get back on the exact same plane I just deplaned from at DEN that was going on to OKC. It obviously fit because I had it sized to get on that exact plane to begin with. But the worst thing I saw was a couple that went ballistic at the gate because F9 told them they were going to charge them $100 for the woman's carry-on since they didn't pay for it at the ticket counter. When the woman pleaded with them and said she didn't know they actually charged for carry-ons in the first place, the ticket agent told them carry-ons were only free if they reserved their tickets through Frontier's website. And if you didn't pay the $25 or whatever at the ticket counter, it was $100 at the gate. Evidently, they had booked through Priceline, Expedia, or some travel service. Fortunately for me, I had booked through their website solely so I could select seats and didn't have to encounter this situation personally.

It's actually kind of surprising as I believe their numbers had been trending upward over the last year for some odd reason. While I don't like seeing an airline leave the market because it can affect pricing, I certainly won't miss their "service."

[CuatrodeMayo]

I'm pretty jazzed about the direct flight from here to OKC, but I need it to start before July =(

[damonsmuz]

I'm not too bummed about losing the EWR flight. While I see the need for those on the east coast to take it, it was horribly timed for international flights.

[Tigerguy]

You are too fast Tiger. :-D

My cat-like reflexes extend to the information superhighway as well.

With the good news comes the bad news.

Frontier is pulling out of OKC on Apr 29.

And EWR-OKC on UA will not return in March or April.

Dommage...Frontier and United were my first go-to airilines. Both have worked themselves off of my go-to list over the past year or two.

It's actually kind of surprising as I believe their numbers had been trending upward over the last year for some odd reason. While I don't like seeing an airline leave the market because it can affect pricing, I certainly won't miss their "service."

If one plays the game and knows the rules, it's not too bad. Either way, there's a reason why Spirit is making bank, and Frontier is headed in that direction. I did the vast majority of my flying with them before the switch to ULCC, and they were a great airline to utilize. Yeah, they were hurting by going head-to-head with United and Southwest, but the Frontier experience was nice while it lasted.

[catch22]

I'm not too bummed about losing the EWR flight. While I see the need for those on the east coast to take it, it was horribly timed for international flights.

The EWR flight was timed for OKC O&D and domestic connections.

IAD was timed for Euro connections, and a very small number of domestic connections. The hubs served different roles. Just because one flight did not serve your needs does not mean it didn't serve the market it was intended to serve.

[catch22]

The EWR flight was timed for OKC O&D and domestic connections.

IAD was timed for Euro connections, and a very small number of domestic connections. The hubs served different roles. Just because one flight did not serve your needs does not mean it didn't serve the market it was intended to serve.

It's like saying because Taco Bueno shut a location down that it is not bad because it was horrible for Chinese food. The EWR flight was never timed for international connections, and can't really be judged on its inability to offer those to you. The hub 150 miles down the coastline is set up for Euro connections.

[damonsmuz]

Catch22: I get that. I was just referencing the times that I flew to Europe how the flight timed out for me. United presented it to me as an option at time of booking... and the thought of sitting in EWR for 8 hours was not something I wanted to do

[venture]

Frontier is moving into bigger markets. OKC is too small for the direction it is going. Nothing to do with passenger loads specifically.

[HOT ROD]

I'm wondering what is United's long term goal with the reductions in EWR? They were/are the only airline to have nonstop flights to all of its hubs and that was and should have been a nice feather to hold in its cap compared to the competition. I think United had the most nonstop to the top business cities of any airline from OKC (EWR, IAD, ORD, SFO, LAX, DEN) and all of them major hubs for connections Int'l or domestic.

I wonder if this is an early signal for a downsize at EWR? While NYC is an important market overall, it doesn't seem to me that having an international gateway and hub in markets 200 miles away from each other (EWR vs IAD) makes any sense and IAD definitely is United's fortress East Coast hub/gateway and notice OKC didn't lose that flight; whereas EWR comes from Continental. I wonder if IAD-OKC and perhaps one ORD-OKC gets upped to mainline to balance the load EWR was obviously splitting to the East Coast/Int'l?

Will United increase DEN-OKC to pickup F9 or has WN the reason for F9 to falter? Didn't F9 fly only A320/319 into OKC? If so, that is a mainline loss (at least temporarily) as well.

Hopefully OKC can score F9/Midwest later with a revamped focus that makes sense.

[GoThunder]

What are the chances of us getting a flight to LGA on Southwest? Slim-to-none or just none?

[venture]

What are the chances of us getting a flight to LGA on Southwest? Slim-to-none or just none?

It's slot controlled. Zero.

[catch22]

I'm wondering what is United's long term goal with the reductions in EWR? They were/are the only airline to have nonstop flights to all of its hubs and that was and should have been a nice feather to hold in its cap compared to the competition. I think United had the most nonstop to the top business cities of any airline from OKC (EWR, IAD, ORD, SFO, LAX, DEN) and all of them major hubs for connections Int'l or domestic.

I wonder if this is an early signal for a downsize at EWR? While NYC is an important market overall, it doesn't seem to me that having an international gateway and hub in markets 200 miles away from each other (EWR vs IAD) makes any sense and IAD definitely is United's fortress East Coast hub/gateway and notice OKC didn't lose that flight; whereas EWR comes from Continental. I wonder if IAD-OKC and perhaps one ORD-OKC gets upped to mainline to balance the load EWR was obviously splitting to the East Coast/Int'l?

Will United increase DEN-OKC to pickup F9 or has WN the reason for F9 to falter? Didn't F9 fly only A320/319 into OKC? If so, that is a mainline loss (at least temporarily) as well.

Hopefully OKC can score F9/Midwest later with a revamped focus that makes sense.

United strategy right now is to trim 6% of network flying that is bleeding money.

So what that means for OKC, losing EWR. Trimming ORD to 3 a day.

[catch22]

Has nothing to do with CO or UA. The network planning VP is a CO guy. Before CO he came from Canadian Airlines. These cuts are coming from above him.

[bluedogok]

The ghost of Spirit is killing Frontier, they are also griping about anything and everything here at DIA as well. As far as I am concerned they can close up and get the hell out of here. I'm done with them now, that is what we flew the most between Denver to Austin and OKC. I guess it is Southwest for us now.

Denver Business Journal - Frontier Airlines dropping flights to regional airports in several states

[venture]

The ghost of Spirit is killing Frontier, they are also griping about anything and everything here at DIA as well. As far as I am concerned they can close up and get the hell out of here. I'm done with them now, that is what we flew the most between Denver to Austin and OKC. I guess it is Southwest for us now.

Denver Business Journal - Frontier Airlines dropping flights to regional airports in several states

I loved Frontier before Indigo got a hold of them...but I guess they were almost dead a few times and Republic wanted them gone. Disheartening to see another small/mid city carrier bail for the larger cities. Allegiant is starting to focus more on big cities too, but hopefully they remain true to their roots.

[ljbab728]

This just in: in the matter of who between Delta and Alaska will give us a link to Seattle first, the cookie goes to Alaska.

Alaska Airlines Expands Partnership with SkyWest, adds New Routes

SEA-OKC 10:30-16:00
OKC-SEA 16:40-18:30

Daily service with SkyWest E175 beginning 1 July.

That timing will definitely not work for cruise ship connections without overnighting in Seattle before and after the cruise. That probably wasn't factored into their decision but would have been nice to do it differently.

[venture]

That timing will definitely not work for cruise ship connections without overnighting in Seattle before and after the cruise. That probably wasn't factored into their decision but would have been nice to do it differently.

Yeah I don't think they are really concerned about cruise traffic on this at all. It is all about business traffic mostly, even though businesses will want an AM departure out of OKC at some point.

[damonsmuz]

Anyone know which gate Alaska will take??

[ljbab728]

Yeah I don't think they are really concerned about cruise traffic on this at all. It is all about business traffic mostly, even though businesses will want an AM departure out of OKC at some point.

You're correct. Those times don't fit for business travelers either. It requires extra hotel expenses and at least one extra day so most of the business traffic I deal with wouldn't use it.

You can get to Seattle fairly early in the day with a connection and get a much later return flight with a connection.

Of course we also have to consider that there will be some Seattle area originating traffic but it's not wonderful for that either. I deal with inbound business travelers to OKC on a daily basis and it's not an insignificant number.

[BG918]

Tulsa appears to be losing IAD and EWR, so it could be worse.

I thought they were resuming March 5 from TUL?

United dropping flights from Tulsa to Newark, D.C. for winter season - Aerospace - TulsaWorld

[ljbab728]

I thought they were resuming March 5 from TUL?

United dropping flights from Tulsa to Newark, D.C. for winter season - Aerospace - TulsaWorld

As of now, UA is showing the flight resuming from OKC on May 6th but not from Tulsa.

[Bits_Of_Real_Panther]

Its been about 8 months since i flew thru DIA, but the Frontier section of the terminal was very overcrowded and terrible to be apart of.

[NWOKCGuy]

I had some friends fly in from LA on Frontier after connecting in Denver a few months back. Their flight came in at 9PM and the baggage claim didn't start until after 10. It was my first experience with them and decided right then that I don't have the patience to ever fly with them.