New Arena (formerly Prairie Surf)

[Dob Hooligan]

Is that one of those “awe shucks” politely understated state the facts. That place is easily in the top three sketchy OKC establishments. Couldn’t imagine it’s any better since the pandemic began. I can’t begin to state the crackheads I’ve seen stealing bikes and converters in the area.

It sounds to me that you might be thinking of Whittaker's, which is on NW10th at May Avenue. That is legitimately sketchy, and I have been in the area 40 years.

Eley's at 30th and N. May is pretty clean and well run IMO.

[TheTravellers]

Is that one of those “awe shucks” politely understated state the facts. That place is easily in the top three sketchy OKC establishments. Couldn’t imagine it’s any better since the pandemic began. I can’t begin to state the crackheads I’ve seen stealing bikes and converters in the area.

Eh, never too sketchy when we had been in there. Area's not that bad, we actually live in Venice. Across May to the west and further south to 23rd are worse, I believe.

[TheTravellers]

It sounds to me that you might be thinking of Whittaker's, which is on NW10th at May Avenue. That is legitimately sketchy, and I have been in the area 40 years.

Eley's at 30th and N. May is pretty clean and well run IMO.

I'll chime in on this one - hell yeah, Whittaker's is way iffy, we walked in one time to try to get one thing on the way home from somewhere and walked right out.

[soonerguru]

I’ll chime in. It’s rough. I’ve spent a lot of time in the core of the city. That area in particular I’m very well versed in. How the place is in business still idk. I didn’t even know the grocery stores were anti mask? But in this place I’m not too surprised. Less masks and more dental caries, catalytic converter thefts Does sound right about that place

Gross and wildly inaccurate. I have not been there during the pandemic so I cannot speak to the mask issue, but the place was never "rough" by any standards. Also, most definitely not a high-end grocery store but a place that offered most of the basics in a small footprint in the inner city. It's not a highly replicated model but one that still works for a lot of people, like my in-laws and countless others in the adjacent neighborhoods who continue to support the store and would be very upset if it were to close.

[Ryan]

Gross and wildly inaccurate. I have not been there during the pandemic so I cannot speak to the mask issue, but the place was never "rough" by any standards. Also, most definitely not a high-end grocery store but a place that offered most of the basics in a small footprint in the inner city. It's not a highly replicated model but one that still works for a lot of people, like my in-laws and countless others in the adjacent neighborhoods who continue to support the store and would be very upset if it were to close.

Maybe the anti vax political stunt they’re doing is enough to cancel any shopping I would have done alone. But the number of crackheads around there is not inaccurate. The place is scketchy. That’s a fact My ex’s bike was stolen from inside their home while she was there literally 100’s of feet from there.

[GoGators]

Maybe the anti vax political stunt they’re doing is enough to cancel any shopping I would have done alone. But the number of crackheads around there is not inaccurate. The place is scketchy. That’s a fact My ex’s bike was stolen from inside their home while she was there literally 100’s of feet from there.

Sorry about your ex’s bike but 30th and May is far from a sketchy area.

[borchard]

Never noticed or been into that store. Has anyone else? I think it is kind of cool that a small, independent, neighborhood grocery like that is still in business. Must be doing something right.

We just to a different part of town. But for the last ten years it was our neighborhood grocery store. Liked having one so close.

[Laramie]

We just to a different part of town. But for the last ten years it was our neighborhood grocery store. Liked having one so close.

Nice to see you back and posting; hope when our USL soccer operations become more firm with the same (Energy FC) or some other local ownership we'll hear more from you. Welcome back my friend...

[Pete]

Regarding unionization of local productions, Prairie Surf posted this on their Facebook page:

Prairie Surf Media
December 7, 2021

Prairie Surf Studios is a private motion picture and television production facility in Oklahoma City, in the business of renting its soundstages to major and independent production companies. A national entertainment industry union is seeking to obtain collective bargaining status for certain employees of the movie production currently filming for a limited time at Prairie Surf Studios.

Prairie Surf supports the “right to work” of Oklahoma citizens as provided for under Oklahoma law, as well as the right of workers to organize as provided for under federal statutes and other applicable laws and regulations.

We are not a party to this dispute. We will however abide by the requirements of state and federal law in insuring that Prairie Surf is and remains a safe and productive work environment for our clients and those they employ on their projects here.

[Pete]

BTW, I recently heard Matt Payne speak on the progress they are making at Prairie Surf (Matt is one of the co-founders) and over the last year or so, they have been trying to build the workforce needed for TV and film production.

I mentioned this when it was announced because of my experience having worked on the lot at Paramount for several years and doing management consulting for other studios: you need much more than a place to film (which Prairie Surf now provides) you need all the people to do the work. Typically, a TV series employs around 250 people for 6-9 months out of a season/year. You have production management (scheduling, planning, budgeting, accounting), grips for handling all the equipment, cameramen, art department (sets, wardrobe, etc.), lighting (cinematographer and all the lighting techs), and then a purchasing department who has to procure everything that is needed. This is just for production; post-production (editing, sound, music clearance, etc.) is a whole other set of jobs and can be (but not always is) performed in a location independent of production.

It didn't take Prairie Surf long to realize Oklahoma didn't have the people and skills to perform these jobs and other than the higher-level positions and most of the cast, a production company is not going to pay to bring in people from out of state and house them; especially for TV. I know they made a run at a bunch of TV shows without much success.

And that's why PS is spending so much time trying to train people and partner with local community colleges and vo-techs.

They have also spent a lot of time lobbying for incentives and a new bill was signed last year that is very aggressive.

Having said all this, the sound stages (which Prairie Surf is) don't really hire many people; the individual production companies do that and before they decide to film somewhere, they have to know they will be able to staff all the required jobs.


A year later, good progress has been made. With these key pieces in place, we should have a decent shot at landing more shows and films.

[gopokes88]

If Albuquerque is any indicator it'll build slowly but hit critical mass at the 10-15 year mark.

They started with rebates, the talent took a decade to build, and finally Netflix moved in which is now an anchor for all that talent.

[Zuplar]

So has the long term goal changed to Prairie Surf continuing on as a studio indefinitely? I guess I thought this was all temporary until the city could figure out what to do and get funding for the area that the Cox Center occupies. Maybe this changed when Prairie Surf came in, I haven't followed this very much because I didn't think it was sticking around long term.

[Jeepnokc]

So has the long term goal changed to Prairie Surf continuing on as a studio indefinitely? I guess I thought this was all temporary until the city could figure out what to do and get funding for the area that the Cox Center occupies. Maybe this changed when Prairie Surf came in, I haven't followed this very much because I didn't think it was sticking around long term.

At least an 8 year plan. "The agreement gives PSM a five-year lease with the option for three more years."

https://journalrecord.com/2020/12/08...at-cox-center/

[chssooner]

So has the long term goal changed to Prairie Surf continuing on as a studio indefinitely? I guess I thought this was all temporary until the city could figure out what to do and get funding for the area that the Cox Center occupies. Maybe this changed when Prairie Surf came in, I haven't followed this very much because I didn't think it was sticking around long term.

I mean, if it takes off and does really well, hard to fore them to move somewhere else (Capitalism, and all). But yeah, the superblock break-up was always a 5 year plan, minimum. Covid likely slowed it down even more.

[Urbanized]

I’d expect that if the studio successfully utilizes the building as a successful launch pad that they will purpose-build a new property elsewhere, where land is significantly cheaper. While this building is apparently very well-suited for the purpose, new studio space would likely not be cost-prohibitive for a successful company; likely most of it could be done using tilt-up concrete construction.

The existing location will eventually be at a premium as downtown continues to knit back together, and doubtless would be unsustainable for its current usage. I’m sure the City would drive a very hard bargain on the next go-round, as they will undoubtedly have a redevelopment plan in their hip pocket. The best thing for the City would be to have a successful Prairie Surf move offsite AND to strategically redevelop the current site.

But so long as the existing site doesn’t have a compelling use plan, this is a great temporary use.

[Pete]

The underlying site was envisioned as an expansion of the central business district in a plan commissioned by the city a few years ago. Primarily, it projected the property as high- and mid-rise office buildings.

But there is currently a bunch of excess office space downtown, so unless that changes in the next five years (and trends show businesses needing and using less space) the city won't be in a rush to clear this land, especially if they are seeing a big economic boost from TV and film production.


There are still some very large neighboring properties that need developing: the land west of Myriad Gardens; the property between the gardens and Scissortail Park, the old coop site, Strawberry Fields, etc., etc.

[Ryan]

I’d expect that if the studio successfully utilizes the building as a successful launch pad that they will purpose-build a new property elsewhere, where land is significantly cheaper. While this building is apparently very well-suited for the purpose, new studio space would likely not be cost-prohibitive for a successful company; likely most of it could be done using tilt-up concrete construction.

The existing location will eventually be at a premium as downtown continues to knit back together, and doubtless would be unsustainable for its current usage. I’m sure the City would drive a very hard bargain on the next go-round, as they will undoubtedly have a redevelopment plan in their hip pocket. The best thing for the City would be to have a successful Prairie Surf move offsite AND to strategically redevelop the current site.

But so long as the existing site doesn’t have a compelling use plan, this is a great temporary use.

I wonder where the ceiling would be on this. They definitely seem to be popular with the Christian themed , faith based projects but not so much with the high profile major studio projects. I know local staffing is an issue. I guess what I mean is Scorsese is great but he chose Oklahoma for authenticity purposes not because PS is here. Also considering the faith based focus here wouldn’t there be a problem getting more R rating type projects?
Would the studio turn down a project if it were promising but contained more mature themes? There are a lot of really well made classics that have a R rating. I would hate to see OKC miss out on great project because of religious objections.

[chssooner]

I wonder where the ceiling would be on this. They definitely seem to be popular with the Christian themed , faith based projects but not so much with the high profile major studio projects. I know local staffing is an issue. I guess what I mean is Scorsese is great but he chose Oklahoma for authenticity purposes not because PS is here. Also considering the faith based focus here wouldn’t there be a problem getting more R rating type projects?
Would the studio turn down a project if it were promising but contained more mature themes? There are a lot of really well made classics that have a R rating. I would hate to see OKC miss out on great project because of religious objections.

I honestly don't think they have ever said they focus on faith-based projects. Nor do they actively seek those out. As a new studio, beggars can't be choosers. So they are taking what they can get.

The doom and gloom amongst OKC people because of religion is way, way overblown. 23rd and Lincoln? Sure. But OKC is progressive, and getting more and more so each day. I doubt this studio has said anything about turning down mature peojects

[Jeepnokc]

Are they a religious based company or have they just produced christian based films because that is what has come through the door? I didn't see anything on their website eluding to religion at all. The profiles of the owners don't even mention religion or the church they belong to.

[Ryan]

Are they a religious based company or have they just produced christian based films because that is what has come through the door? I didn't see anything on their website eluding to religion at all. The profiles of the owners don't even mention religion or the church they belong to.

I’m sure hallmark and lifetime would love to land an Oscar winner but that’s not what they get. My point being you don’t want to offend the folks that provide your bread and butter and these faith based folks can be easily offended. And it’s very easy to get “typecast” in this industry. Best to make known that they don’t exclusively cater to the church or crowd because major projects will straight up avoid getting into bed with that crowd

[Urbanized]

The underlying site was envisioned as an expansion of the central business district in a plan commissioned by the city a few years ago. Primarily, it projected the property as high- and mid-rise office buildings.

But there is currently a bunch of excess office space downtown, so unless that changes in the next five years (and trends show businesses needing and using less space) the city won't be in a rush to clear this land, especially if they are seeing a big economic boost from TV and film production.


There are still some very large neighboring properties that need developing: the land west of Myriad Gardens; the property between the gardens and Scissortail Park, the old coop site, Strawberry Fields, etc., etc.

Yep. Agree with all of this, which could of course lead to another friendly short-term lease to PS at the end of their current lease and options. But at SOME point that land will be too in-demand for this use, which could be undertaken just about anywhere in town with the construction of a pretty bland industrial-type complex.

Also bears mentioning that after the Thunder's next lease there will likely be some pressure to build a new arena, and this would be one of the prime locations that would be considered. Keeping it engaged as-is with a viable tenant in the meantime would protect the site until that future bridge is crossed makes a ton of sense.

[Zuplar]

Yep. Agree with all of this, which could of course lead to another friendly short-term lease to PS at the end of their current lease and options. But at SOME point that land will be too in-demand for this use, which could be undertaken just about anywhere in town with the construction of a pretty bland industrial-type complex.

Also bears mentioning that after the Thunder's next lease there will likely be some pressure to build a new arena, and this would be one of the prime locations that would be considered. Keeping it engaged as-is with a viable tenant in the meantime would protect the site until that future bridge is crossed makes a ton of sense.

Makes a lot of sense. I sure hope the Thunder have turned the corner by the time they need a new arena. Would hate to end up in a Seattle type situation where the team has lost a lot of support due to so many losing seasons.

[dankrutka]

You don’t lose an NBA team because of poor attendance or stadiums. You lose a team because owners want to move it. As long as the owners want the team in OKC it’ll be in OKC.

[Laramie]

Makes a lot of sense. I sure hope the Thunder have turned the corner by the time they need a new arena. Would hate to end up in a Seattle type situation where the team has lost a lot of support due to so many losing seasons.

Truly feel OKC has crossed that milestone for support. Right now the NBA is the biggest act in town, Covid-19 safety regulations (2020-21 No fans) had a lot to do with the team's drop in fan support and attendance.

Now the fan support is in rebuild mode as well as the team. The franchise will be more competitive come 2022-23 with a ton of future draft picks.

As for a new arena, OKC will invest $104 million in upgrades (new seats, outdoor terrace) for Paycom Center and $11 million in the NBA practice facility.

We'll know more about becoming an even Bigger League City in December of 2027 as MAPS 5 is proposed and renewed.

[Dob Hooligan]

Saw a story at Broadcasting & Cable that says there are currently 559 scripted series in production in North America. Does include streaming, but not movies, IIRC. Still an incredible number, IMO.