Oklahoma liquor laws

[jerrywall]

I am not talking about allowing national chains to come in and run liquor stores. I would not be in favor of that. What I am referring to is if a store like Byron's wanted to open a second location they could do so. Right now, I believe liquor stores must be a sole proprietorship and they are only allowed a single location. I don't think liquor stores would be on board with allowing Wal-Mart to sell chilled beer and wine 7 days per week until 2AM each night without getting something in return to help them compete.

If I was in charge of this process, I would propose the following.

-Single-strength beer chilled in both liquor and grocery stores, 7 days per week between 10AM and 2AM
-Oklahoma wines in grocery stores. All other wines in liquor stores
-Accessories sold in liquor stores (bottle openers, etc)
-Allow liquor stores to have multiple locations but keep requirement for them to be locally-owned

I think this would be a fair compromise. Of course from a liberty perspective the Missouri model would be best, but I can't see everybody getting on board with that.

Yeah, I just threw in that qualifier. I'm not sure the legality of allowing multiple locations with liquor licenses yet limiting it to locally owned. No idea if that would hold up. So my If was a big IF.

[Bunty]

I think Oklahoma legislators on the House side just want to kick the problem with Oklahoma alcohol laws down the road for yet another year as we all become old, or older and older waiting for major changes. The liquor store owner's excuse for not wanting chilled beer legalized is the height of ridiculousness.

Lawmakers who wrote cold beer bill do ?not? want it to pass | KFOR.com

[bchris02]

“If somebody wants a beer, they should take time, take it home and chill it, and drink it at home not take it chilled already and drink it out of their car on their way home,” Eid said.

Why isn't this a problem in 49 other states? I want to say that I miss living in a state that treats it's citizens like responsible adults.

[Dustin]

^^

Eid doesn't realize that many beer companies wont distribute here because their beers have to be refrigerated AT ALL TIMES.

[Urbanized]

^^
Eid knows more about the liquor business than you, me, or anyone who posts here (no offense to JerryWall or anyone else who owns/owned a liquor store). Sam has run a couple of the largest, most successful liquor stores in the metro for decades.

Regardless of what he said in that interview, I'm sure he opposes this for purely business reasons. He probably doesn't want to have to buy coolers, and/or probably doesn't want to compete with grocery and C-stores if the whole bundle of changes take place. I'm sure he's just rationalizing in that story to protect the status quo.

[Bunty]

“If somebody wants a beer, they should take time, take it home and chill it, and drink it at home not take it chilled already and drink it out of their car on their way home,” Eid said.

Why isn't this a problem in 49 other states? I want to say that I miss living in a state that treats it's citizens like responsible adults.

Oklahoma's problem with alcohol is long ingrained in its history almost from the very beginning. One of first things Oklahoma wanted to do when it became a state in 1907 was to ban alcohol. For some reason, in its early settlement, Oklahoma attracted a lot of Christian conservatives from neighboring states as well as the South. Anyway, it can probably be said people from the middle part of the country were conservative years before the Oklahoma Land Runs started.

[Dustin]

^^
Eid knows more about the liquor business than you, me, or anyone who posts here (no offense to JerryWall or anyone else who owns/owned a liquor store). Sam has run a couple of the largest, most successful liquor stores in the metro for decades.

Regardless of what he said in that interview, I'm sure he opposes this for purely business reasons. He probably doesn't want to have to buy coolers, and/or probably doesn't want to compete with grocery and C-stores if the whole bundle of changes take place. I'm sure he's just rationalizing in that story to protect the status quo.

Of course, he's just trying to protect his business. I totally understand that, but he makes it sound like people are going to buy a refrigerated six-pack and chug it in the parking lot. I'm sure there are some sad people that do this, but the majority wouldn't and don't.

[tfvc.org]

I think I said this a few pages back but the whole refrigerated beer get drunk in the parking lot excuse is bs. If I were really wanting to get drunk in a parking lot, I could buy a 5th of rum and get drunk faster and not have to pee 20 minutes later. Heck if I was that desperate for a buzz I would just snort a bit and get that instant buzz of the alcohol going directly in the bloodstream.

[Mel]

I think I said this a few pages back but the whole refrigerated beer get drunk in the parking lot excuse is bs. If I were really wanting to get drunk in a parking lot, I could buy a 5th of rum and get drunk faster and not have to pee 20 minutes later. Heck if I was that desperate for a buzz I would just snort a bit and get that instant buzz of the alcohol going directly in the bloodstream.

This forum has caused me to hoark Ketel One through my snoot a few times and it's not real buzzy, more like stingy. I would like to be able to buy chilled wine or beer especially when I already have what I am going to grill or cook in the car heading home.

[tfvc.org]

This forum has caused me to hoark Ketel One through my snoot a few times and it's not real buzzy, more like stingy. I would like to be able to buy chilled wine or beer especially when I already have what I am going to grill or cook in the car heading home.

Start at 9:06 http://video.pbs.org/video/2365458296/
Video: Ask This Old House | Shelf, Rough Electric | Watch Ask This Old House Online | PBS Video

[Bunty]

Of course, he's just trying to protect his business. I totally understand that, but he makes it sound like people are going to buy a refrigerated six-pack and chug it in the parking lot. I'm sure there are some sad people that do this, but the majority wouldn't and don't.

Then I'll never understand how selling chilled beer in grocery and convenience stores was ever allowed, unless 3.2% beer was classified as a non-intoxicating beverage at the time. If true, another indication how crazy Oklahoma alcohol laws can be.

[bluedogok]

There were pro/con op-ed pieces in today's Denver Post about changes in the 3.2 laws here for grocery stores. So changes are not just being discussed or moronically challenged in Oklahoma. Just like in Oklahoma, the establishment makes wild claims that are just ridiculous and neglect the fact that many other states have found ways to coexist.

Denver Post - Yes, allow Colorado grocery stores to sell full-strength beer and wine

Denver Post - No, don't allow Colorado grocery stores to sell full-strength beer and wine

[bchris02]

I think I said this a few pages back but the whole refrigerated beer get drunk in the parking lot excuse is bs. If I were really wanting to get drunk in a parking lot, I could buy a 5th of rum and get drunk faster and not have to pee 20 minutes later. Heck if I was that desperate for a buzz I would just snort a bit and get that instant buzz of the alcohol going directly in the bloodstream.

Thing is, how do you convince Oklahoma lawmakers of that fact? This isn't that difficult. This country has 48 other states with more sensible liquor laws than Oklahoma.

[jerrywall]

Thing is, how do you convince Oklahoma lawmakers of that fact? This isn't that difficult. This country has 48 other states with more sensible liquor laws than Oklahoma.

Eh.. I'm not sure I agree. We have 48 states with DIFFERENT liquor laws, is about all you can say. Should we only have state owned liquor stores? What about not allowing liquor stores to sell cases of beer (only individual bottles). How about county by country laws and rules? No confusion there, of course.

The only thing you can say is that 48 states allow cold beer. But there are worse states out there in regard to liquor laws. People get myopic sometimes when obsessed about being anti-Oklahoma.

[jerrywall]

^^

Eid doesn't realize that many beer companies wont distribute here because their beers have to be refrigerated AT ALL TIMES.

No, Good beer doesn't have to be refrigerated at ALL TIMES and there isn't a beer that is done so. Selling cold beer doesn't mean the beer is transported, warehoused, distributed, and stored cold. It's just sold cold. I've been to too many places in Colorado where New Belgium beers are sitting in piles on display at room temperature. It's a myth that does the battle for cold beer no good. Considering the company that CLAIMS they won't distribute to Oklahoma because of refrigeration DOES distribute to Utah proves it's a lie. They just don't want to be honest about their business decisions, and the fact they don't want to invest in a distribution channel in Oklahoma.

[trousers]

Eh.. I'm not sure I agree. We have 48 states with DIFFERENT liquor laws, is about all you can say. Should we only have state owned liquor stores? What about not allowing liquor stores to sell cases of beer (only individual bottles). How about county by country laws and rules? No confusion there, of course.

The only thing you can say is that 48 states allow cold beer. But there are worse states out there in regard to liquor laws. People get myopic sometimes when obsessed about being anti-Oklahoma.

I can't agree with this more. At least our laws are consistently bad lol. The county by county rules that Texas has is just crazy.

[BDP]

Then I'll never understand how selling chilled beer in grocery and convenience stores was ever allowed, unless 3.2% beer was classified as a non-intoxicating beverage at the time. If true, another indication how crazy Oklahoma alcohol laws can be.

It's my understanding that 3.2 was classified as non-intoxicating to circumvent prohibition.

If anyone wants to drink cold beer in their car or in the parking lot, 3.2 beer is already available for that activity and it's more readily available and accessible than higher point beers, so using that to keep cold beer out of liquor stores is pretty silly.

If buying the refrigerators is the problem, I'd gladly finance any store that doesn't have the resources for it, as I'd be pretty confident the increase in sales will pay it off very quickly with a nice return.

I'm pretty sure the resistance from stores and from Central is just based on fear that cold beer in liquor stores is a stepping stone to high point beer and wine in grocery stores. Theses businesses have depended on the state's regulation of competition in their industry for a long time. Any amount of change or ease of regulations will cause concern and anxiety, even if some of the change has a great chance of helping them in the near future.

And, as Jerrywall pointed out, I am also pretty sure that many breweries and wineries avoid the state not just because of refrigeration laws, but because of our distribution regulations.

[adaniel]

I can't agree with this more. At least our laws are consistently bad lol. The county by county rules that Texas has is just crazy.

Not just counties, constable districts within counties.

Until a few years ago, most of far north and pretty much all of south Dallas was completely dry. The dividing line was the footprint of old Dallas before it started annexing areas after the 1910's. The wet/dry boundaries were never updated until 2010, and a lot of Dallas County is still "moist" and not completely wet.

So no, very few states have completely given up on prohibition.

[bchris02]

It's my understanding that 3.2 was classified as non-intoxicating to circumvent prohibition.

If anyone wants to drink cold beer in their car or in the parking lot, 3.2 beer is already available for that activity and it's more readily available and accessible than higher point beers, so using that to keep cold beer out of liquor stores is pretty silly.

Exactly. The difference between 3.2 beer and full-strength beer has a lot more to do with taste than alcohol content anyways.

[bchris02]

I can't agree with this more. At least our laws are consistently bad lol. The county by county rules that Texas has is just crazy.

While Texas is certainly no bastion of libertarianism when it comes to liquor laws (I found out this weekend that you can't buy beer in a gas station after midnight), I don't understand how anybody could say they aren't preferable to Oklahoma's laws.

[jerrywall]

Not just counties, constable districts within counties.

Until a few years ago, most of far north and pretty much all of south Dallas was completely dry. The dividing line was the footprint of old Dallas before it started annexing areas after the 1910's. The wet/dry boundaries were never updated until 2010, and a lot of Dallas County is still "moist" and not completely wet.

So no, very few states have completely given up on prohibition.

I remember the first time I had to buy a membership card to get a beer at Chili's in the Dallas metro...

[Jersey Boss]

I think Oklahoma legislators on the House side just want to kick the problem with Oklahoma alcohol laws down the road for yet another year as we all become old, or older and older waiting for major changes. The liquor store owner's excuse for not wanting chilled beer legalized is the height of ridiculousness.

Lawmakers who wrote cold beer bill do ?not? want it to pass | KFOR.com

While Sam stated in the article that he has been coming and going at 9:30 for 37 years, 37 years ago liquor stores were open until 10 in Oklahoma.

[jerrywall]

While Sam stated in the article that he has been coming and going at 9:30 for 37 years, 37 years ago liquor stores were open until 10 in Oklahoma.

When did it change to 9pm?

[Jersey Boss]

When did it change to 9pm?

It changed when liquor by the drink was approved by the voters in 1984. I used to work part time at a pizzeria in Norman that had a bar in it. We would stock the bar from a liquor store and I remember that it closed at 10 back then.

[jerrywall]

It changed when liquor by the drink was approved by the voters in 1984. I used to work part time at a pizzeria in Norman that had a bar in it. We would stock the bar from a liquor store and I remember that it closed at 10 back then.

Ah, that would be why I don't remember. I was in grade school then. I do remember when they put the restrictions on 3.2 beer after 2am.