Gang Activity is Up in OKC

[rxis]

it is no surprise that gang activity is up. It seems to always change inline with the economy.

i wonder if this is an issue that teachers talk about.
The administration at my middle school started trying to enact strict disciplinary measures due to "gang type" of activity. A follow the rules or get outta here was the attitude of the principles. However, the "bad" kids were already gone and us "good" kids were just starting middle school. The "good" students ended up getting punished for the former "bad" students. We moved onto high school with a higher grade average and a lower drop out rate. I don't think the administration played much of a part in it but they got a lot of praise.

[brannonterry]

Wow! This is really surprising the comments I am reading on here. first off I am a young black male in graduate school finishing this month. I have just accepted a job in Washington dc. I nor any of my friends (all grew up in north Tulsa) have felt our DNA take over and felt the need to join a gang or kill someone. you really sound like the ultimate privileged republican white male when you make these comments. You cant ignore the economic issues that are going on in the inner cities across the country. I went to an elementary school with books that were 10 years old and I just turned 26. So don’t give me the crap of "ok your free now so why are you not on our level." Just remember that it was not that long ago where you angels hung and arrested us for no other reason than being black. Its not right to say that all whites are evil because of ALL of the evil things you have done throughout the years. Does that mean that just because you have a white skin color you are destine to do evil things no. You can not ignore the problems many minorities have in the inner city. sad thing is that you really believe what you are saying and god only knows what you say behind closed doors (or should I say Klan rallies).Not fun being judged is it?

[SOONER8693]

OK, I'm just an ignorant white male, could you please elaborate on all the "evil" things us white folk have done in the past?

[writerranger]

Wow! This is really surprising the comments I am reading on here. first off I am a young black male in graduate school finishing this month. I have just accepted a job in Washington dc. I nor any of my friends (all grew up in north Tulsa) have felt our DNA take over and felt the need to join a gang or kill someone. you really sound like the ultimate privileged republican white male when you make these comments. You cant ignore the economic issues that are going on in the inner cities across the country. I went to an elementary school with books that were 10 years old and I just turned 26. So don’t give me the crap of "ok your free now so why are you not on our level." Just remember that it was not that long ago where you angels hung and arrested us for no other reason than being black. Its not right to say that all whites are evil because of ALL of the evil things you have done throughout the years. Does that mean that just because you have a white skin color you are destine to do evil things no. You can not ignore the problems many minorities have in the inner city. sad thing is that you really believe what you are saying and god only knows what you say behind closed doors (or should I say Klan rallies).Not fun being judged is it?

Simple Question: Are there drugs available - FDA approved - that are prescribed for blacks only?

Your Klan Rally comment is offensive and racist in that it judges me as someone who has made a choice to advocate hatred toward one race or another. I do not. My comments are based on science. The same science that - finally - is allowing drug companies to genetically target drugs that recognize the differences between the races. Differences in the races translates into many possibilities of research. Only one of which is cultural, and an example being the connection between race and crime. Either you can deal with the fact that there are differences between the races - or you cannot. Science is proving everyday that, despite what your high school diversity class teacher taught you, there are indeed major differences.

-----------------------

[Midtowner]

Brannon:

I agree with you that a eugenics-type argument is a poor method of explaining why so many kids from minority backgrounds turn to gangs. There are far too many more obvious 'nurture' type factors that would tend to influence such a decision as compared to the 'nature' factors which may or may not exist.

If we simply take a look at history, and examine the fact that many of this world's earliest great civilizations were principally made up of people of color. It wasn't until Rome and Greece that white men even had anything approaching what might be mistaken for a cultured civilization.

By that time, the Persians had a mighty empire, as did the Egyptians. The Babylonians had come and gone. The Chinese and Japanese had great empires. The people of the subcontinent of India, and the people of southeast Asia had built great cultures.

It isn't disputed that Europeans became very proficient at warfare. Mostly, they did so by adopting weapons and tactics from these previous civilizations. Using these inventions, we more-or-less have been the dominant culture for the last 500 or so years. Don't get too big a head though, 500 years is barely a blip on the radar screen when you consider the fact that civilization first really took hold in Mesopotamia some 10,000 years ago (and I don't think those were fair skinned, blonde-haired Mesopotamians).

(was that a tangent?)

At any rate, many blacks in our American society (and around the world) are caught up in a cycle of poverty. The reason for the beginnings of this cycle can easily be traced back to the slave trade and the colonization of Africa by European powers (something which culturally, Africa really has not recovered from).

The fact is, when someone is born into poverty, black, white, or purple, they are far more likely to end up like their parents than they are to end up going to college, finishing high school, or even staying out of prison.

Growing up in Edmond, I really had no concept of what poverty in America was. Sure, I'd seen real poverty, but not in the United States (and if any poor person thinks they have it bad here, they really ought to visit Africa -- there's some real poverty). I pretty much believed that there was no such thing as hopelessness until 4 A.M. one day, while out of gas and travelling on I-40 through Memphis, I took the very first exit after downtown where I saw a service station. I ended up in what I've been told is pretty much the most dangerous part of Memphis -- at 4 A.M.

Within seconds of exiting my vehicle, and starting to fill up my empty tank, some toothless black woman tried to sell me a block of what I think was meth. Within a minute or two, I had been hit up by another person for $5.00 since he "Just got out of prison." Moments later, we noticed a mob heading over to my vehicle. It was at that time we (there were 5 of us) jumped in the truck and took off. As we drove out of the parking lot, these guys were literally hanging off of my car. It was like the night of the living dead.

While these folks were clearly not starving, and while they clearly had money to put clothes on their back and a roof over their heads (likely thanks to me, the taxpayer) they had apparently lost all hope. They had no purpose to live except for to live to the next day. No goals, no ambitions, just a few lost people wandering around waiting to die. Not a single person I saw that night was employable. No one would hire them, even to dig ditches -- or at least, I couldn't imagine that happening.

Of course, tragically, they were all probably in their 20's. Likely that none of them had the money to afford things like condums, and likely that all of them thought nothing of having unprotected sex.

What kind of children do people who stay out at 4 A.M., hanging around a closed gas station, selling drugs, panhandling, and possibly robbing passers-by have? Probably kids who'll grow up to be just like mommy and daddy. Much like my parents, two folks with graduate degrees had myself who will go on to get his own graduate degree. The likelihood of my parents having a kid who didn't finish college was slim. The likelihood of kids of the folks in Memphis ever finishing high school is probably just, if not more unlikely.

Writeranger:

Your comments that your beliefs are based on science confuses the findings of said science. You might want to refer to some statistics which were gathered in an unbiased manner. You might also refer to some sort of sociological paper which explains why these statistics are the way they are. Just stating that "it's science" is far less than you're going to need for trying to make such an argument. On one hand, you're arguing for a biological predisposition to gangs and violence for minorities. On the other hand, you're completely ignoring all of the sociological factors at play here.

Try to reconcile that, and you'll be on the right track.

[Midtowner]

-- and Brannon, the "white privilege" route is also a biased way of looking things. It amplifies the negativity of inherent racism in our world while minimizing the results of personal choice. I can see that this concept might be involved somewhere in your thinking, but white privilege is a concept which was created as an excuse for the failure of individuals to blame their own race, or rather, the race of another man, or a comination thereof for their own failures or losses.

It's a fairly valid concept, but I think some folks like to apply it with a little too broad a brush.

[travich]

I believe that races that were repressed DO need a fair amount of "leg up" in our society. The real question is at what point have we given them enough assistance to catch up? Too much assistance and the people become dependent on it. Too little and people have a more difficult time than most trying to get out of poverty, etc. The real question is, what's a good balance of assistance, etc. is the right amount?

We need to teach repressed peoples how to fish, not give him a fish every day. That's why I strongly support children coming from poverty to have a big leg up in paying for college, etc. However, in our current system, besides being a 4.0 student in high school is to join the military. Now why does everyone think there are so many songs about "Why do we only send the poor?" Because the poor have hopes and dreams and are trying to find the easiest route to those dreams.

I speak about all of this from experience. I just earned my MBA because of the GI Bill and I came from single mom of three children on Welfare most of her life. The only way I felt I had a way out of poverty was through the military/GI Bill. It was a tremendous opportunity, but it holds tremendous risks.

Sorry for rambling, but this topic upsets me a little. People born middle class or with a sliver spoon their mouths should be very thankful for what they have... They could have ended up as one of the dead soldiers in Iraq for simply trying to fulfill their hopes and dreams.

I am saddened by the lack of empathy for those in poverty who are stuck there. Some of these people truly have little way out. Some DO CHOOSE TO BE there. The ones that choose to be there should remain there, but those that can't get out, should have a choose (education, education, education) of making it out. And many of them do not have that choose.

[Midtowner]

Education isn't the only way up. There are countless people who have done well in bussinesses such as restaurants and construction who aren't educated in the least.

My feeling is that ultimately, anyone who is currently poor has chosen that life for themselves. Opportunities such as the G.I. Bill, the Job Corps, etc. are available to everyone.

It costs nothing for someone to join a work crew and learn a trade.

It's just a lot easier to sit on one's couch and watch daytime TV. As a society, we certainly facilitate that. The ingredient that people need is self-confidence. They need to feel that if they put in work, it will be rewarded. It's really not a complex concept.

While one group will use the eugenics argument to explain why the group can't be successful, the group themselves is using the white privilige argument to explain why they can't be successful.

I think the truth is somewhere else entirely.

[travich]

Sure, some people choose to be poor, but you unfairly say that about the entire group. I am from an area of the country where even "joining a work crew" is difficult to do without a votech, etc. How can you pay for votech if you don't have a job? It's chicken and egg.

And it's easy to generalize, but what about those women who depended on their husbands for a source of income while raising their 4 kids? I guess that fact that this woman got screwed by her dead beat husband was her choose? No. If her kids are not old enough (and responsible enough) to watch themselves, there's no way she can have a 40 hour work week making minimum wage. This is just an example of poor that supposedly choose to be poor.

Walk a mile in their shoes. THEY are stuck and dependent on the system. And I can't agree with you that they chose this life.

[OklaCity_75]

Anyone who has been born since the 1960's is poor because of poor life choices.

You make the choice to live beyond your means and not manage your cash flow.

You make the choice to have a child. Everyone who conceives a child made a conscious decision to have sex. (The only exception is in the case of rape or molestation.)

You decide not to take advantage of your free education in traditional school. Many people fail to realize that the whole purpose of traditional school is to prepare you for college courses. It is not designed to give you everything you need for the real world.

If we want to curb poverty we need to start drilling to every students head the importance of a good education and the need to hold restrain themselves from certain behaviors. (IE: Sex, Drugs, Drinking)

In regards to paying for college...I do not care who you are if your poor the money is available. Sure, you might have to make some sacrifices in your personal life and playtime but it can be done. There are loans, grants and scholarships for everything under the sun. Some employers are even paying their employees to go school. The only stipulation is that you have to pursue a particular career with your employer.

The only people who cannot get college paid for are the rich kids who have been cut off by mom and dad. Usually mom and dad cut them off for playing instead of studying.

This is America and it is shame that so many people lack the motivation to better themselves. Instead, everyday more and more people are screaming about how the government should do more for them and they blame the rich in this country for all of their problems.

Eventually a person has to stop and ask the question; “What I am doing to improve my life?” “What mistakes do I need to avoid?” “Am I prepared for what might happen tomorrow because of the decisions I made today?”

Personal will power is a person’s only enemy. If you want something bad enough you will find a way to achieve.

Then again its like midtowner said

It's just a lot easier to sit on one's couch and watch daytime TV. As a society, we certainly facilitate that. The ingredient that people need is self-confidence. They need to feel that if they put in work, it will be rewarded. It's really not a complex concept.

[Midtowner]

Sure, some people choose to be poor, but you unfairly say that about the entire group. I am from an area of the country where even "joining a work crew" is difficult to do without a votech, etc. How can you pay for votech if you don't have a job? It's chicken and egg.

And it's easy to generalize, but what about those women who depended on their husbands for a source of income while raising their 4 kids? I guess that fact that this woman got screwed by her dead beat husband was her choose? No. If her kids are not old enough (and responsible enough) to watch themselves, there's no way she can have a 40 hour work week making minimum wage. This is just an example of poor that supposedly choose to be poor.

Walk a mile in their shoes. THEY are stuck and dependent on the system. And I can't agree with you that they chose this life.

We can play this game.

1) Can't join a work crew without vo-tech: Use public assistance money to learn the necessary skills. Job corps and vo-tech offer needs and merit based scholarships. You can take advantage of those. Daycare is also available. If all else fails, a greyhound ticket ain't so expensive, and I hear they're hiring like crazy in Louisiana (and paying very well).

2) Mom with 4 kids, deadbeat husband: Take advantage of the FREE DHS child care programs. Get DHS after deadbeat -- he'll be forced to either pay, or end up ultimately going to jail. If the woman vigorously pursues the child support $, she'll eventually get help. There are also all kinds of options for single moms with kids.

As for her being a 'victim,' someone who has no work skills, and then chooses to get pregnant 4 freakin' times is absolutely not blameless. The kids are, mom isn't. She could have given the kids up for adoption at birth, she could have terminated the pregnancies, she could have used birth control. Again, vo-tech offers on-site daycare and gives needs based scholarships which this lady would probably qualify for despite her stupid past decisions.

If she doesn't qualify for the scholarships (which would be shocking), she'd qualify for grants, and ultimately student loans -- the same program that I'm currently using to attend law school can also be used for vo-tech, or an undergrad degree.

[travich]

Midtowner, this is not a game. You seem to think everything is black and white and it's not. Again, I'm not disagreeing that some people choose to be poor, but I adamently believe that that's not the case some of the time.

People can't always move, people can't always get assistance, people can't always find their deadbeat husbands (for assistance). It's just not that black and white. I understand that those that have never been there think that it's a cakewalk to be poor and stuck. That they're victims, but again, that's not always the case.

I will never understand the lack of compassion for thos in poverty. I'm not suggesting we give hand out, but hand ups... Again, education assistance, etc.

Saying education isn't the way out is ignorant at best. Studies have shown that there's a strong correlation between education and income. In fact, look at Oklahoma. One of the lowest education rates in the country with some of the lowest salaries in the country. Look at Massachusetts salaries and their education level. It's obvious. An educated populate creates and brings well-paying jobs to the state.

Look, I CHOOSE to disagree with you. You're not going to convince me that all poor people CHOOSE to be in their situation. Therefore, I don't see a point in continuing this discussion, so I'll bow out now.

[Midtowner]

You can bow out because I can counter every one of your hypothetical situations with evidence showing that a poor choice was made at some point.

We agree as to the way out -- hands up, not hand outs. I'm saying that people who fail to take advantage of the multitude of hands up that are currently offered are 100% to blame for their situations.

The very premise that they are "victims" divorces them from responsibility for their own choices. Sorry, your mother of 4 had 4 kids she couldn't care for. Your person who couldn't find work on a work crew decided it'd be fun to fart off school.

I didn't say education wasn't a way out. I just said it wasn't the only way out. There are a lot of success stories out there involving people who for whatever reason couldn't cut it in school doing just fine.

You can "choose" to disagree with me just as you "choose" to be wrong. And yes, it is a game. You offer up these sob-stories, and I can tell you why and how those people suck at life. It's fun. Have any more?

[goddessnna]

Regarding race, DNA difference, etc. which someone was stuck on before:

The brotherhood of man
We can all trace our roots back to one ancestor, and he's not that old

By Matt Crenson
Associated Press
July 16, 2006

Whoever it was probably lived a few thousand years ago, somewhere in East Asia -- Taiwan, Malaysia and Siberia all are likely locations. He -- or she -- did nothing more remarkable than be born, live, have children and die.

Yet this was the ancestor of every person now living on Earth -- the last person in history whose family tree branches out to touch all 6.5 billion people on the planet today.

That means everybody on Earth descends from somebody who was around as recently as the reign of Tutankhamen, maybe even during the Golden Age of ancient Greece. There's even a chance that our last shared ancestor lived at the time of Christ.

"It's a mathematical certainty that that person existed," said Steve Olson, whose 2002 book "Mapping Human History" traces the history of the species since its origins in Africa more than 100,000 years ago.

Full article at:
http://www.commercialappeal.com/mca/opinion/article/0,1426,MCA_536_4844420,00.html

[writerranger]

Regarding race, DNA difference, etc. which someone was stuck on before:

The brotherhood of man
We can all trace our roots back to one ancestor, and he's not that old

By Matt Crenson
Associated Press
July 16, 2006

Whoever it was probably lived a few thousand years ago, somewhere in East Asia -- Taiwan, Malaysia and Siberia all are likely locations. He -- or she -- did nothing more remarkable than be born, live, have children and die.

Yet this was the ancestor of every person now living on Earth -- the last person in history whose family tree branches out to touch all 6.5 billion people on the planet today.

That means everybody on Earth descends from somebody who was around as recently as the reign of Tutankhamen, maybe even during the Golden Age of ancient Greece. There's even a chance that our last shared ancestor lived at the time of Christ.

"It's a mathematical certainty that that person existed," said Steve Olson, whose 2002 book "Mapping Human History" traces the history of the species since its origins in Africa more than 100,000 years ago.

Full article at:
http://www.commercialappeal.com/mca/opinion/article/0,1426,MCA_536_4844420,00.html

More PC BS.

Again, the question: Are drugs FINALLY being made specifically for blacks?

And, if the answer is yes (and it is), why the problem with understanding that there are major differences in the races?

The link between higher levels of African adrenalin, testosterone, race and crime (and athleticism - ever watched football and notice how many white running backs?) is overwhelming. Of course, it doesn't matter if your inner-PC Cop won't allow you to dare consider the possibility. It's just easier to fall in line and bash the science. Every major scientific breakthrough seems to follow a pattern: scorn it (and kill people for it) for 100 years, laugh at for 100 years, finally debate it for 100 years, and then accept it as fact in another 100 years.

Really, this is a waste of time. Unless one is willing to personally involve themselves in the study of this issue (because you won't read it in many quarters of the mainstream press) and see the overwhelming evidence, they won't understand it; and I would rather not discuss it here with people who are speaking only what they learned in Diversity 101 class. The PC platitudes are irritating when you know what the research shows.