Homeless people

[jerrywall]

I've had some incidents yet am entirely sympathetic to them. I had a friend with severe schizophrenia go through a period of homelessness a few years back. Luckily he was able to work through the system, go to Red Rock, etc. I work in Film Row basically diagonally from the Jones Assembly. When I pulled into our work parking lot last week I had a woman come and slam on the window banging and then she walked away. Evidently did it to a few other cars too. Later she had set up a tent inside of our gated parking lot. To me it's just depressing, not scary.

[jerrywall]

Within yards of the Jones you have: the large City Rescue Mission facility, New Life Affiliates facility, Refuge OKC complex and just down the street is the Jesus House complex. Just to the south and west you have an industrial complex that is ripe for people squatting and camping in the area.

I'm pretty sure City Rescue is a dry facility. I don't know about the others. I wonder if this limits the outreach they can do?

[Steven Myers]

With the limited information from this story I thought of a few things that could be helpful... or not. I've been in that area quite a bit (especially considering I don't live in Oklahoma) as a pedestrian and cyclist and I've never encountered a problem. That's just my experience though. But I can say that with the new apartments opening and more "eyes on the street," it's bound to be a safer area for everyone (including the homeless). I don't know if you need to dismiss the entire area. Heck, it's only a few blocks from the police department if you ever need help.

Second, if I'm reading your story correctly, there seems to a difference between the homeless population and a different group of people you're describing. Is that correct? It's just important not to lump everyone into one group if their circumstances and affiliations are different.

Lastly, a decent percentage of homeless people aren't simply "crazy," but often suffer from psychological disorders like paranoid schizophrenia or some form of bipolar disorder. These disorders make it hard to function and can be the reason they become and stay homeless (related: our country is utterly failing at supporting people with disorders). I am not at all dismissing your concerns because these disorders can in some cases lead to erratic or violent behavior, but it's just important context. In many cases, the people you encounter like the person who came to your car may also be in far more danger and in need of help too.

Anyway, if you think this is serious, you might report your encounter to the Jones, OKCPD, and local homeless shelters to make sure they have this information.

These were all clearly homeless people. I am not a psychologist. I don't use fancy terms to describe people that act crazy. This guy was crazy. I am not the least bit concerned for his situation or if he is in danger. It's not my problem. He didn't harm me or my property so there is no need to bother the police.

[Steven Myers]

I'm just wondering what criteria made it clear they were homeless when they had 'normal' clothes, backpacks, smartphones, and a car. The "went home to the cool, safe confines of Nichols Hills" gives me a few possible ideas, but I don't want to assume.

The homeless in the car were only 2 of the people. The rest were on foot. The criteria that I used to make this remarkable determination was simple observation. I know it's hard to tell the difference sometimes between hipsters and the homeless but these people were absolutely homeless. This is an area with shelters and encampments close by. Go hang out there at 10pm tonight if you don't believe me. You make the call. Then go back to your home that I doubt is a shack itself before you judge my situation just because I am honest about it.

[Steven Myers]

My goodness, sir. Why did you ever leave your white oasis?

I have many black friends. I listen to rap music. I watch BET. I subscribe to JET. I speak jive. I am in fact a black man. African American to you, thanks. Assume much?

[Steven Myers]

Large percentage of them have mental health problems. It's not uncommon to hear them talking, or even arguing, with themselves. I've always just shown them some courtesy and give them simple yes or no answers to their questions until they move on. It has always kept things from escalating.

Having worked down here 20+ years I can tell you it's much safer now than at any point in those 20+ years I've had an office down here.

5 years ago there were days I didn't feel safe walking to my car in the dark and now I feel comfortable walking the mile, and back, to the Chesapeake to catch a Thunder game.

I didn't feel safe in the area I was talking about. Neither did the woman who had her tire slashed while sitting in her car in front of the Jones recently. Or the family whose car window was smashed with a large piece of cement and it injured their child a block or so away from that area last week.

[Steven Myers]

Curse the darkness or light a candle. There are many organizations that would welcome an enthusiastic person to help them meet their mission.

I did light a candle by posting this on this forum.

[Steven Myers]

This is because the Jones (and most of western edge of Film Row) is basically intruding on the homeless outreach hub of Oklahoma City. The entire area is going to have to grow together and adapt. This will be a big challenge for not only the transients, but also the non-poverty classes to get comfortable with such dynamics.

Within yards of the Jones you have: the large City Rescue Mission facility, New Life Affiliates facility, Refuge OKC complex and just down the street is the Jesus House complex. Just to the south and west you have an industrial complex that is ripe for people squatting and camping in the area.

Exactly. This was my point. It will be interesting to see what happens to all of these facilities in the near future when the hipsters realize this is an issue. I bet the city decides it's time to move the homeless somewhere less conspicuous. Money talks. They got the trains to stop blowing their horns downtown after all because they are too special to have to hear that.

[Steven Myers]

This is the second report of a very aggressive/violent panhandler in that area and it sounds like the same guy. I hope you called the police, this guy needs to be dealt with. BTW, that will not stop me from visiting the area. Just be aware of your surroundings or maybe valet park next time.

This was not the same guy. I looked that incident up. That guy was white. This guy was not.

[ultimatesooner]

my wife often accuses me of looking like a homeless person on weekends because i don't bother with doing things like brushing my slightly balding hair and wear clothes i've had for 20+ years to do projects around the house - you sound slightly more judgmental than her. But i'll make sure and yell at the next Nichols HIlls yuppie i see to get on the next level

[Pete]

Exactly. This was my point. It will be interesting to see what happens to all of these facilities in the near future when the hipsters realize this is an issue. I bet the city decides it's time to move the homeless somewhere less conspicuous. Money talks. They got the trains to stop blowing their horns downtown after all because they are too special to have to hear that.

There are similar issues all over downtown.

I lived in SoSA for a year and very close to the county prison. That hasn't detered hipsters and the well-heeled alike from spending the most money per SF for homes; and rents are very high as well.


One person's scary and I'll-never-go-there-again experience is no big deal to many who see uncomfortable encounters as a trade-off for living/working so close to the best amenities in the state, and most figure out they aren't in any real danger at all. I've come across plenty of ranting people and if anything just feel sympathy for them.

For 7 years I worked in what was considered one of the 'worst' areas of Los Angeles (which is saying something) and it didn't bother me a bit. I minded my own business, treated everone I came across with respect and never had one issue.

Safety, after all, is in the eye of the beholder as the odds of any one person experiencing violent crime virtually anywhere is astronomically low.

If you simply don't like seeing such things, then anywhere in the urban core is not for you. Fair enough. Plenty of other people clamoring to go to these places and live in the area.

[Steven Myers]

The over-arching issue as to why there is a huge and growing homeless problem is directly due to the lack of funding of mental health programs in Oklahoma and nationally. Virtually every chronically homeless person has serious mental and/or addiction problems.

Not to get political because I am old enough that I actually voted for him twice, but this started with the slashing of these programs by Ronald Reagan. It's also the reason we incarerate at a way higher percentage than almost any other country and why Oklahoma does so more than almost any state.

In the meantime, you can't just say the homeless population is growing and therefore the existing problem isn't being well addressed by loads of people and agencies. There are tons of successes but the entire U.S. is in the terrible position of having to treat symptoms (which is very, very important) rather than the causes.

Obviously there are many people that are on the streets because of mental issues but there are also a large proportion that have made the choice to live this way. It is literally a way of life for these people. They do not want "help". They want to live off the grid with little or no responsibility. Apart from the guy who freaked out on me the others I saw looked healthy, well clothed, and were using smartphones and eating at McDonald's. There is an entire culture within the homeless community that exists to live this way and it is growing due to disenfranchisement with the system as they see it. The proverbial "dropping out" of society. It's real and thanks to technology more organized than ever. Not that it really matters much in the greater scheme of things.

[Steven Myers]

my wife often accuses me of looking like a homeless person on weekends because i don't bother with doing things like brushing my slightly balding hair and wear clothes i've had for 20+ years to do projects around the house - you sound slightly more judgmental than her. But i'll make sure and yell at the next Nichols HIlls yuppie i see to get on the next level

I am not judgmental. I know a homeless person when I see one.

[Pete]

^

I will merely say that many studies -- and my own personal experience -- show that almost all homeless have some sort of mental illness and/or addiction.

You seem to be leaping to all types of conclusions after seeing a few people with backpacks and cell phones. You are entitled to your opinions but you should also be expected to be challenged when you make statements like you have here.

[stile99]

Well. That escalated quickly, and one guy got plonked.

How's everyone else's evening?

[Steven Myers]

There are similar issues all over downtown.

I lived in SoSA for a year and very close to the county prison. That hasn't detered hipsters and the well-heeled alike from spending the most money per SF for homes; and rents are very high as well.


One person's scary and I'll-never-go-there-again experience is no big deal to many who see uncomfortable encounters as a trade-off for living/working so close to the best amenities in the state, and most figure out they aren't in any real danger at all. I've come across plenty of ranting people and if anything just feel sympathy for them.

For 7 years I worked in what was considered one of the 'worst' areas of Los Angeles (which is saying something) and it didn't bother me a bit. I minded my own business, treated everone I came across with respect and never had one issue.

Safety, after all, is in the eye of the beholder as the odds of any one person experiencing violent crime virtually anywhere is astronomically low.

If you simply don't like seeing such things, then anywhere in the urban core is not for you. Fair enough. Plenty of other people clamoring to go to these places and live in the area.

Tell that to the woman who was also accosted outside the Jones recently. Check the News 4 website for that story. The homeless guy slashed her tire after she rushed to get in her car to get away from him. Or the family who had a homeless guy smash their car window injuring their child recently near this same area. Also on the news. I will go where I please but from now on I will be armed as I walk or have a gun ready in the car. I don't share your views of it didn't happen before so it never will. I mind my own business too but that has nothing to do with these things.

[OKCRT]

Exactly. This was my point. It will be interesting to see what happens to all of these facilities in the near future when the hipsters realize this is an issue. I bet the city decides it's time to move the homeless somewhere less conspicuous. Money talks. They got the trains to stop blowing their horns downtown after all because they are too special to have to hear that.

A homeless shelter in Nichols Hills would be cool.

[Steven Myers]

Well. That escalated quickly, and one guy got plonked.

How's everyone else's evening?

I don't feel plonked. My points stand. My evening is fine as long as I stay away from the homeless on Sheridan.

[Pete]

Tell that to the woman who was also accosted outside the Jones recently. Check the News 4 website for that story. The homeless guy slashed her tire after she rushed to get in her car to get away from him. Or the family who had a homeless guy smash their car window injuring their child recently near this same area. Also on the news. I will go where I please but from now on I will be armed as I walk or have a gun ready in the car. I don't share your views of it didn't happen before so it never will. I mind my own business too but that has nothing to do with these things.

We are talking about acutal risk and real danger vs. what is perceived.

The incident you mentioned regarding the tire... News reports say she was in her car, the guy wanted her to roll the window down and she didn't, so he punctured her tire. She took his photo as he walked away and he was quickly arrested. I'm sure it scared her but doesn't sound like she was ever at any great personal risk and certainly was not harmed in any way.

And so next time a homeless man starts screaming at you, you'll do exactly what with your ready firearm?

[Steven Myers]

A homeless shelter in Nichols Hills would be cool.

For the homeless it would be. Make it happen cap'n!

[Steven Myers]

We are talking about acutal risk and real danger vs. what is perceived.

The incident you mentioned regarding the tire... News reports say she was in her car, the guy wanted her to roll the window down and she didn't, so he punctured her tire. She took his photo as he walked away and he was quickly arrested. I'm sure it scared her but doesn't sound like she was ever at any great personal risk and certainly was not harmed in any way.

And so next time a homeless man starts screaming at you, you'll do exactly what with your ready firearm?

I can't find anything about the guy ever being arrested. He certainly wasn't "quickly arrested". Where did you get that? She had posted this ordeal on her facebook page with his picture and he was still at large then. She said in the news piece that she was "terrified" when he pulled out the knife and came around to her drivers side window. You have a strange definition of what is and isn't "great personal risk" and "harm". Some people are emotionally scarred for life from such incidents. Show some empathy for the victim here instead of just trying to further your point that we have nothing to fear from the well meaning homeless amongst us. I get it. You are all about helping them and supporting the cause but don't be so ridiculous. And what about the other family I mentioned before? You didn't respond to that. Tell their kid in the hospital how the homeless guy meant no harm. As for my firearm, I will protect myself and my family to the extent that the law allows

[Pete]

Post the story about the kid. I couldn't find it.

Of course she was scared; I said as much. But what real personal risk do you have when you are inside a locked car and someone has a knife standing at the front of your car? And in the end all that happened was her tire was punctured. Sorry, that doesn't amount to much other than a scary, hyped news story.

Feeling scared and actually being at risk for real personal harm are completely different things.

[BBatesokc]

We are talking about acutal risk and real danger vs. what is perceived.

The incident you mentioned regarding the tire... News reports say she was in her car, the guy wanted her to roll the window down and she didn't, so he punctured her tire. She took his photo as he walked away and he was quickly arrested. I'm sure it scared her but doesn't sound like she was ever at any great personal risk and certainly was not harmed in any way.

And so next time a homeless man starts screaming at you, you'll do exactly what with your ready firearm?

WTH? Some stranger (I don’t care if he’s homeless or not) wields a deadly weapon at my wife (even if she’s in her car) and then attempts to disable her car and thus keep her from fleeing - and to you that doesn’t constitute “great personal risk” and wasn’t “harmed IN ANY WAY.” WOW.... Simply, WOW.

[Pete]

He punctured her tire, said nothing and walked away.

You are editorializing with "weilds a knife at my wife" and "attempts to disable her car and thus keep her from fleeing". There is nothing that indicates any of this.

[Steven Myers]

^

I will merely say that many studies -- and my own personal experience -- show that almost all homeless have some sort of mental illness and/or addiction.

You seem to be leaping to all types of conclusions after seeing a few people with backpacks and cell phones. You are entitled to your opinions but you should also be expected to be challenged when you make statements like you have here.

I have not leapt to any conclusions. I counted 11 people that were clearly homeless. You don't need to be an expert to recognize a homeless person. I guess you think you do. Whatever. My original point was that I found it interesting how they were dressed better than most homeless that are typically seen panhandling around town and that they were on smartphones and that many of them knew each other. I don't see why you find it necessary to try to diminish my experience. This area is an enclave for the homeless in OKC. This is a fact. My point in adding that Nichols Hills was safe was to accentuate this fact. I saw young girls walking to their cars parked in a field with no lighting in the dark as I left the show and I felt concerned for them as I would be about my own daughter. I simply wanted to point out that the area is clearly in transition more so than others due to it's proximity to the homeless population there and how that might shake out given my incident and the others that have taken place. I had hoped someone might offer some insight into what will happen, not be insulted for living in a nice part of town. There are small homes in Nichols Hills you know.