Dallas loses big... Finally

[Patrick]

Well, although I'm not fan of Texas, I don't wish lost jobs on anyone, not even Texans. As a result of this, there are going to be families struggling to survive, in an economy that's still recovering from recession.

I just hope that most of the workers can find new jobs.

Anyways, I think the impact this is having on Dallas is a good reason to go after smaller discount and more carriers, and maybe minihubs, instead of looking for a major hub. Nuclear was right in his assessment.

[mranderson]

Patrick: Granted. Job loss is worrysome and stressful. Believe me when I say I have had more than my share of it over the years. Mostly greedy employers who care more about themselves and the all mighty dollar than a working stiff.

However. I really can not describe my hatred of the Dallas area, let alone Texas.

The people who are rude and pompus I hope they suffer. The others I hope it is a short unemployment.

[Patrick]

I agree....I even had a similar feeling after 9-11. Granted it was sad what our country faced on that day and the loss of life was sad, but not all of the people lost in the WTC were sweet little angels like the media would like you to believe. A few of those stock brokers were yuppies, sticking people in the back on a daily basis.

[swake]

Good to see that OKC is still such a cosmoplotian city embracing people from all walks of life from every corner of the nation and world. This really is reinforcement of the cow town image of OKC that is so pervasive here here in Tulsa. Please think about what you are saying and stop, it's bad for the whole state. Rooting for people to lose jobs? Not all that were killed were losses becuase they were yuppies? WHAT?? Get a grip and grow up.

Real question, why so much hatred for Texas? I don't like Dallas, I truly don't know anyone that does and that includes friends who live there. It's a mess. But OKC, will never be a world class city so long as it is obsessed with Dallas. Better to look at what Dallas has done well, and what they have done wrong and build your own city on that knowledge.

[mranderson]

Why all the hatred? I have answered that question already.

Once again. Too many hicks (yes we have them also, more than our share), rude people (yes we have them also, not as many), snobbish people, VERY high crime rate that the police do not want to control, a racist city council (I have seen fist fights on the horseshoe). Plus, the fact that all they think of is their cows, their barbques, and their hickhood.

It seems as we are always losing to that hickhole down south. I am tired of it. Our city council needs to get on the ball and find out why these companies are passing us by. Do they like hickvilles? Do they like backward legislautres? What? We need to know, then convince these people that WE are better.

I lived in that place for eight years. I did not want to move there in the first place, however, a job was better than poverty. I left and they can still smell the rubber on the tires from when I squeeleed out of there.

You can think Dallas is the greatest place on the Planet. However, I would rather go to cool places. You can think Padre Island is the greatest beach on earth, but I would rather go to cool places.

I am sick of Dallas this and Dallas that. If you like it, I am sure they would welcome you. I will hate that place and celebrate every time they lose. No matter how many jobs are lost. Their loss can be OUR gain.

[Patrick]

swake you're right. We shouldn't wish bad on Dallas. That isn't right, and it's not fun to see people lose their jobs, or lives. Instead we should probably just use the selling points we have as a city and try to create our own individual identity. I agree that so many times we try to compete with Dallas. While competition is good, we shouldn't lose the notion that we are a unique separate city, and we should strive for something completely different from Dallas. By no means would I want OKC to resemble Dallas.

But at the same time I really see no difference between this and the competition between NY and Boston, Seattle and Tacoma, Minneapolis and St. Paul, San Francisco and Oakland, etc.

[HOT ROD]

I really dont understand why you guys [Patrick, MR Anderson] dont understand what I was saying.

I said, hub cities tend not to have persistent local traffic - they mostly have transient commuter traffic. Few exceptions are Chicago, Wash DCA, SFO, and LAX.

Then I said, that Dallas was dropped because it had little local demand.

Demand is synonomous with traffic, that is the correlation in my two statements. local demand was low, so traffic was low at DFW DELTA. Combine that with the drop-off of transient OKC pax using DFW Delta as a hub, that is the biggest reason why it is closing.

Should we PM about this?

I know I am an attorney and an MBA, but hey - we are supposed to be able to communicate effectively to everyone. I know I have an ability to sway opinions through dialog,

but I was just stating a few facts that needed to be interjected. People on this forum were talking about the VOID at DFW, and that OKC had no chance of becoming a hub because of the VOID at DFW - and I stated that there is NO VOID, DFW was overkill; hence the reductions.

Rob, I accept your apology. I guess you are not a bit pragmatic when you criticize other's posts. I was supporting your position on DFW with a superlative set of facts about HUB airports in general and you shot me down; called my logic uncomprehensible - you killed your support.

SWAKE: I dont think we are obsessed with Dallas, we are just happy to see things go a little bad for them once in a while. Dallas has prospered at the expense of OKC (and TUL to an extent) as many of our companies (and residents) have trucked down I-35 over the past 20 something years as Dallas was the so-called New York of the South. Its nice to see them suffer!

Im sure Tulsa would feel the same way about the bohemouth - Houston! If companies pulled out of there.

[floater]

To be immature, I despise Dallas and do enjoy some economic misfortune of theirs. DFW has carted off half of my college buddies and half of my sisters'. I can't blame them, because they have to pursue their lives as they see fit. In addition, I rarely hear a kind word on the part of Dallasites (or other Texans, for that matter) for OKC. On travel forums and other discussions, they are always dismissive of Oklahoma City and Oklahoma, no matter what gains we make. They would rather die than admit we do anything better than they do. That's why Mack Brown will be gone if he doesn't win next month.

Okay, I may be overstating on those last statements, but if Texans enjoy sticking it to us, I see no reason why we shouldn't return the same. I do not wish to see workers lose their jobs, but to see Texas' arrogant business leaders, writers, and opinion leaders eat their words is priceless.

[okcpulse]

In all honesty, I believe it is Oklahoma City's unique opportunity to be the "bigger person" when it comes to other cities' misfortunes. Offer assistance or work with officials in neighboring cities on job losses or revenue loss... that is... if they looked to us. But swake, this is something you will never catch any city, including Dallas, doing. We are in fierce competition for jobs, and Dallas, being the cosmopolitan city they are, do not treat us well in the arena of competition. Nor have they ever been courteous or cordial, especially when it came to making business decisions.

I have no "obsession" with Dallas. To me, Dallas is just another city. I believe Houston has had more of an impact on the Tulsa area than Dallas on OKC. And I do recall some Houston bashing on the Tulsa forum. But really, I don't blame the Tulsa forum for the bashing, either. Nothing is more frustrating than seeing your good paying jobs leave your city for another.

I believe the feelings on this thread reflect a simple expression "Oh my gosh, Dallas can lose? I didn't think that was possible!" However, Delta dropping Dallas as a hub is only one less member of the club. Dallas is still an American Airlines hub.

I don't despise Dallas, or any other city for that matter. I depise the airline industry. They literally determined the growth in this country by setting up the hub system to begin with.
The hub and spoke system is by far the dumbest concept ever concieved by the human race in the travel category. I believe there should only be connections where needed, like the east and west seaboard cities when flying over seas. What is the point of flying to, say, Phoenix to get to Seattle? I can see stopping in Denver on the way. I also don't get the feasability of the OKC-Atlanta-New York connection either. Hubs take you out of the way from where you need to be.

[Patrick]

Hot Rod, let's just forget about it and move on. I think your points are clear. I'll go ahead and just PM you and we can discuss it off the board, because I'd really like some clarification. But I don't think it's really worthwhile to go on an talk about it here.

On to the other topic,

Well, Dallas has the growing economy to help these displaced workers, so it's not like they'll be out of work for long. And as many of you have said, Dallas has hurt our economy by stealing jobs (and skilled workers) away from our market. So, it's easy to find myself being a tad bit jovial about Dallas' loss.

swake, it's not that we wish bad on Dallas, it's more that for years now Dallas has been growing at our expense. It's about time that the tables were turned.