OKC as tourist destination

[mkjeeves]

What was the OKC economy based on then? Not what you would have liked it to have been based on. What was it actually based on?

[Just the facts]

What was the OKC economy based on then? Not what you would have liked it to have been based on. What was it actually based on?

Do you mean prior to 1951? I would say mostly oil, but food production was pretty big.

[mkjeeves]

And lets not forget Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac who under-write almost every home loan in America and both bailed out by the taxpayers.

Hell, I could do this all day. You like watering your suburban yard - thank the US Army Corp of Engineers and the federal taxpayers for the water.

That would include underwriting home loans in the urban core as well. How many people do you think move downtown are going to pay cash? As far as my water goes, I already mentioned I live NW and do not water my lawn. (The house was on a well since the '50s when it was built until recently too.) Devon waters theirs though. But in case you were not aware, the North Canadian runs right through the urban core and the damming for my current water supply was authorized in 1938 for flood control and the urban core was one of the primary areas it protected then as it does now. Drinking water was and is byproduct that come much later. Here's some history about that.

1920 October 21-30: Extensive flooding along North Canadian River – levees breached in Oklahoma City, flooding low-lying industrial and residential sections. Hundreds of families were left homeless due to, at that time, the worst flood in Oklahoma City history.

1923 October 13-16: Severe flooding along the North Canadian resulted in a breach of Lake Overholser Dam and forced the evacuation of 15,000 residents in Oklahoma City. This flood led to a radical redistribution of housing patterns in the city as higher income families moved northward, away from the river. The flood began in Woodward where the river crested over its banks and flooded the business district there. Much of western Oklahoma reported “semi-famine” conditions after being cut off from outside contact. The surge of water rushing toward Oklahoma City rose to 25 feet tall. This flood led to a radical redistribution of housing patterns in the city as higher income families moved northward, away from the river.

1932 June 3: A flood on the North Canadian inundated Oklahoma City, leaving eight dead and 3600 homeless. Property damage totaled $1.5 million (1932 dollars), including the destruction of 656 homes. The War Department was asked to furnish 650 tents to set up a tent city at the Fair Grounds to house those left homeless by the flood. Nearly seven inches of rain fell on the North Canadian watershed west of Oklahoma City between 11 p.m. and noon on June 2-3.

I'm a federal tax payer too, just like about everyone else in the burbs, including the ones who live far away from the river but subsidize flood control for downtown with their federal tax dollars.

[Just the facts]

Prior to 1951 most people payed cash for their homes that owned them. I think the longest home loan available was only 5 years and most were 3 years and only covered between 20% and 50% of the homes value, meaning a 50% to 80% down payment. However, in most ciites the vast majority of people rented. Homeowneship was reserved for the wealthy - hence the federal government creating the Federal Housing Authority after WWII. Not sure what the purpose was of your flooding examples as it appears most people who could afford to moved out of the flood plain.

[RadicalModerate]

Cities existed prior to 1951. They had tall buildings and everything. Even downtown OKC existed. What we didn't have were suburbs. Now by claiming that the suburbs are subsidizing downtown do you mean MAPS?

I'm not sure that is exactly correct . . . the part about "didn't have suburbs".
Nichols Hills and Crown Heights were both suburbs at one point in time.
(and the list could go on and on and on and on)

Oklahoma City used to be popular as a "tourist destination" mostly on account of the oil well on the grounds of the state capitol building. and because there were relatives here who never left, longing to return. it was that "friendly folks" thing. difficult to experience in most "urban conclaves". (plus there was Springlake Amusement Park, The Lincoln Park Zoo, and Frontier City.)

Now OKC is just another--constantly improving--beehive of diverse activity that is pretty much like any UrbanCore from Dallas to The Twin Cities.

[Just the facts]

I'm not sure that is exactly correct . . . the part about "didn't have suburbs".
Nichols Hills and Crown Heights were both suburbs at one point in time.
(and the list could go on and on and on and on)

Maybe so but they weren't auto-suburbs. Yes people commuted downtown via a streetcar, but they still had to live within walking distance of the streetcar (except maybe N.H. who had chauffeurs).

Anyhow -appologies to everyone for getting so far off topic.

[RadicalModerate]

No apology necessary! Why OKC, itself, has improved so much since I moved to this area, decades ago, that we occasionally do a "local tourist" driving thing (maybe 15 minutes, through Historical Neighborhoods) just to admire the accomplishments.

[adaniel]

No apology necessary! Why OKC, itself, has improved so much since I moved to this area, decades ago, that we occasionally do a "local tourist" driving thing (maybe 15 minutes, through Historical Neighborhoods) just to admire the accomplishments.

I do this all the time in the spring and fall. As an architecture buff, its amazing how many unique neighborhoods are tucked away in this city.

Anyway, to steer this back on topic. I think the OP sailed over some people's heads. Nobody thinks OKC is going to be the Orlando on the plains, but we are in a unique position as the largest city for some way around and have a good baseline of attractions. No doubt downtown, the bombing memorial, thunder games, bricktown, and the horse shows at the state fair draw in a fair amount of people. We also have a lot of people here for business and conferences, being the state capitol and the major business/retail center for Central and Western OK, and a big chunk of KS and TX panhandle to a lesser extent.

But there is still a lot of room to grow. For example, with Bells in Tulsa not coming back, Big Splash being viewed as a death trap, and no theme parks of size between Branson and Arlington, why doesn't Frontier City and White Water Bay increase their marketing in other parts of the region? WWB is getting the idea and expanding, Frontier City seems a bit slower to do the same, but both really don't advertise outside this area which is really puzzling. There's other attractions that are the same way.

Speaking of advertising, when OU or OSU are playing nationally televised games, the Okla. Dept of Tourism always airs those "OklaCool" commercials. Why doesn't OKCCVB do the same during Thunder games? I always see billboards for Tulsa on the Turner Turnpike, never for OKC on 35 though. I think they do a good job, but I think OKCCVB could step up their outside marketing a bit.

[Just the facts]

No apology necessary! Why OKC, itself, has improved so much since I moved to this area, decades ago, that we occasionally do a "local tourist" driving thing (maybe 15 minutes, through Historical Neighborhoods) just to admire the accomplishments.

I have started doing the same think here in Jax as well. In fact, I have even taken it to the next level by putting my bike on the back of the pickup so I can take in the sites at a slower and more up-close pace when the opportunity arises

[mkjeeves]

I'm not sure that is exactly correct . . . the part about "didn't have suburbs".
Nichols Hills and Crown Heights were both suburbs at one point in time.
(and the list could go on and on and on and on)

Oklahoma City used to be popular as a "tourist destination" mostly on account of the oil well on the grounds of the state capitol building. and because there were relatives here who never left, longing to return. it was that "friendly folks" thing. difficult to experience in most "urban conclaves". (plus there was Springlake Amusement Park, The Lincoln Park Zoo, and Frontier City.)

Now OKC is just another--constantly improving--beehive of diverse activity that is pretty much like any UrbanCore from Dallas to The Twin Cities.

You left out Wedgewood amusement park.

Anyway, here's the burbs of NW 32nd and Shartel in 1947. (Mom, aunt and granny. Granny moved there in the 'twenties when it really was the edge of town.) Disregard the well worn steel contraption in the background. No one used those in Oklahoma City. They walked to work and everywhere else, uphill, both ways, in the snow.

[mkjeeves]

Using a car for whatever reason would have been a regular affair for a lot of people. Here's my granny again about 30 years prior to the above photo. (Not is OKC this time.)

Do you think between those two dates all she did was walk and take mass trans? Nope.

Yes, without a doubt, it changed the world. You're never going to get to roll back the last hundred years of development, pretend it never happened and do again differently. Better learn to work with what we've got, and that includes the massive investment in everything that makes up the burbs.

[Praedura]

The Oklahoma Tourism and Recreation Department has created a new TV campaign. I happend to notice it when I came across this link:

https://www.facebook.com/oklahomatod...51493088694864

Various people singing 'Oklahoma!' while going about their (multitudinous and wide-ranging) activities. A bit corny perhaps, but very slickly done.
Of course, this is Oklahoma tourism in general, not just OKC.

Here's a direct link to the lastest commercial:
http://edgecast.travelok.com/videos/...oma201360a.flv




The full set of videos can be found here:
Oklahoma Video Gallery | TravelOK.com - Oklahoma's Official Travel & Tourism Site

[Plutonic Panda]

Love it!

[Dustin]

Awesome! That song will get stuck in your head for sure! Good advertising!

[bchris02]

I don't see OKC ever becoming a major tourist destination. However, it can be a great regional destination for a day/weekend trip and also a stopping point for people travelling across the country. What I really wish is this city would get a real theme park. Being at the crossroads of I-40/I-35/I-44 it could almost certainly support it. I think it would be a huge hit with locals as well as tourists. Anybody know what it would take for something like that to ever become a reality?

[Plutonic Panda]

I don't see OKC ever becoming a major tourist destination. However, it can be a great regional destination for a day/weekend trip and also a stopping point for people travelling across the country. What I really wish is this city would get a real theme park. Being at the crossroads of I-40/I-35/I-44 it could almost certainly support it. I think it would be a huge hit with locals as well as tourists. Anybody know what it would take for something like that to ever become a reality?

If I ever get the opportunity, I'm doing it!

[Dustin]

I don't see OKC ever becoming a major tourist destination. However, it can be a great regional destination for a day/weekend trip and also a stopping point for people travelling across the country. What I really wish is this city would get a real theme park. Being at the crossroads of I-40/I-35/I-44 it could almost certainly support it. I think it would be a huge hit with locals as well as tourists. Anybody know what it would take for something like that to ever become a reality?

I agree. I so want this to happen!

Does Frontier City own all that land to the West of the park? That would be prime real estate for a huge expansion.

[CaptDave]

Does Frontier City own all that land to the West of the park? That would be prime real estate for a huge expansion.

Even though the cost would be huge, I think bulldozing the fleabag motels and moving White Water Bay to the land north of Frontier City would create a nice amusement area. Too bad it isn't closer to the Zoo - if Frontier City and White Water Bay could relocate to the Adventure District the area would really take off.

[hoya]

They are nice little parks for what they are, amusements for people in the metro area. They're require significant investment to turn them into anything more than that. It would probably be easier to build something brand new if you were looking to go bigger.

Edit: Actually I'll rethink that. To turn Frontier City into something like Six Flags, you might want to go to a new location. I understand they own a bunch of land around there, but I remember it being a pretty small park all things considered. But they could probably grow a lot larger than what they currently have. They could be a decent regional tourist destination, bringing in people from Tulsa or small towns. I remember when I was a kid we went down to Six Flags in Texas. You could bring in people from around the state to go to Frontier City or White Water. Have to really increase advertising though and make the parks bigger.

[SoonerDave]

Amusement parks right now are only beginning to come out of the doldrums they experienced over the last five, perhaps ten years - due in part to the recession, but also due to a general ambivalence toward theme parks in general - a down period that led to some being mothballed or sold off and redeveloped. Disney is now starting to see substantial attendance gains as the economy starts to perk up, and in fact has stated they're confident enough in the numbers to start "weaning" people off their traditional heavy annual discounts.

I think hoyasooner hit it on the head - that Frontier City is purely a local park. A theme park that people would make a day-trip to would have to be something new and fresh, and on a par with Six Flags even for local dollars. Considering that you've got Silver Dollar City to the NE and SFOT to the south, you'd have to get a pretty crafty designer/concept person in here to conceive a marketable theme that could compete. That said, I don't think its impossible - was at Silver Dollar City in Branson about three years ago, and while its a nice park, its unremarkable as they've homogenized out many/most of the things that made it regionally appealing in the first place. A unique, properly themed park could do really well, especially given the natural I-40/I-35/I-44 corridor that converges here.

There were all kinds of urban legends from when I was a kid that Disney wanted to build a "Mid America" concept park in the midwest, and that they were at one time looking at property in S. Oklahoma, but the idea fizzled. Done right, I think there definitely is potential there.

[hoya]

The question is, do you make it regionally-themed, or go for something bigger that has zero connection with Oklahoma? A Western-style park has been done, with Silver Dollar City and Six Flags so close. A big water park doesn't really need a theme, but unless you really go big I'm not sure if you'll attract people from Tulsa or Lawton to come up just for that. There are other water parks around that provide a similar experience without requiring the trip.

If you really wanted a big park, and not just moderate exansion of FC and WW, you need some sort of intellectual property that isn't currently represented by places like Six Flags (with the Warner Brothers cartoons), Disney, Universal Studios, etc. Maybe you could do a Hunger Games-themed park or something. Lord of the Rings maybe. Something that has nothing to do with Oklahoma, but is popular enough that you'll attract large crowds from all over.

Or maybe you just put a bunch of giant ass rollercoasters there.

[HOT ROD]

definitely think the parks should combine and possibly move into the Adventure District. They could sell the existing land for development and create a fairly nice theme park by just combining and especially if they also moved into the AD. Then over time, add in a few more coasters and theme rides and spruce up the kid/midway and additional water attractions and YES, I do think 'the new Frontier City' could compete. Move the combined parks to downtown airpark and it would probably take off even better/faster.

[CaptDave]

Move the combined parks to downtown airpark and it would probably take off even better/faster.

Hadn't thought of that - not a bad idea but I still like somewhere in Adventure District bast.

[bchris02]

Does any other American city have their theme park downtown? Most of the time parks are far out in the suburbs like Frontier City or Worlds of Fun.

[ljbab728]

Does any other American city have their theme park downtown? Most of the time parks are far out in the suburbs like Frontier City or Worlds of Fun.

Elitch Gardens in Denver.

Directions to Elitch Gardens Theme and Water Park Denver | Elitch Gardens Theme Park & Water Park