Big 12 Midseason Observations

[dankrutka]

Sigh... Everyone plays like crap against K-State, not just [insert your team here]. That's what happens when they assert their game plan to grind out every game.

But I am sure OU would be two thousand touchdown favorites if only the game were played today.

Sigh. Do you honestly think K-State caused Blake Bell to inexplicably fumble on the 1? They had nothing to do with it, and if that doesn't happen OU very likely wins.

You act like K-State has some long-standing trend of doing this to OU. We're not talking about Alabama here. K-State hadn't beat OU since 2003, Snyder has had a terrible record against Stoops, and OU went into Manhattan last year against a very similar team and won 58-17 when they were ranked in the top 10... But I guess that's what happens when "they assert their game plan to grind out every game." It often doesn't work against more talented teams like OU and I believe that if they played again OU would win. Credit to K-State for dictating the game and capitalizing on OU's miscues, but if you watched the game at all, you'd realize that everything fell into place for them to pull the upset.

[dankrutka]

You guys scored how many points below your season avg, and that had nothing to do with the K-State defense?

You goons should listen to yourselves. My god. I have even more news for you..all you've done to restore your confidence is take your frustration out on a crappy Texas team and whoop up on Kansas. The only good win OU has is TTU. It's a LOT more likely that you'll lose again than run the table.

K-State is the only team that's really in the driver's seat. Just accept that. I'm not really surprised by that at all. If you didn't expect Klein to be dynamite again this year, and didn't expect Snyder to win the Big 12 at least once again, then you only see the world through crimson-colored lenses and your opinion isn't even relevant.

The advantage that K-State has over everyone is that they're the one oddball team that nobody can really prepare for. They bring a different brand of football that Big 12 coaches and scout teams just don't get. They have a gamer qb, the best coach in the conference, and they play mistake-free football. They are by far the most disciplined football team in the conference. They let you make the mistakes, and OU certainly did. Oh well!

Just like when OU played them last season with all the same key players. You've talked yourself into some kind of delusional K-State narrative. No one disagrees that K-State deserved to win, that Klein is good, or that they're in the driver's seat, but you act like K-State is some mammoth program that is able to will everyone to their style and dominate. In reality, K-State has 1 big 12 title in 16 years, and has been dominated by OU for the last 13 years. If you think other people are delusional to think OU might beat K-State if they played again then you're the one that's delusional. OU doesn't even look like the same team. And, I'm sure you'll say it's because of K-State, but they looked the same way against UTEP. Football is far more complex than your simplistic analysis.

[onthestrip]

And if OSU hadnt got screwed by a bad call against Texas theyd be undefeated in the Big 12 too. But that didnt happen and OSU lost. Just like OU did to KSU.

It almost seems that you think that if you keep repeating the reasons why OU carelessly gave it away to KSU that somewhere down the road the football fairies will change that loss to a win...

BTW, it isnt the first time Bell has fumbled right at the goal line.

[Stew]

And if OSU hadnt got screwed by a bad call against Texas theyd be undefeated in the Big 12 too. But that didnt happen and OSU lost. Just like OU did to KSU.

It almost seems that you think that if you keep repeating the reasons why OU carelessly gave it away to KSU that somewhere down the road the football fairies will change that loss to a win...

BTW, it isnt the first time Bell has fumbled right at the goal line.

How's that any different than poke fans endlessly whining about the call at the end of the Texas game? A loss is a loss is a loss is a loss. It's all part of the game.

[onthestrip]

How's that any different than poke fans endlessly whining about the call at the end of the Texas game? A loss is a loss is a loss is a loss. It's all part of the game.

Thats pretty much what I said.

[ljbab728]

There is no doubt that a loss counts as a loss no matter what. However, discussing the relative strengths of two teams based on how they lost is a legitimate discussion.

[dankrutka]

BTW, it isnt the first time Bell has fumbled right at the goal line.

What other time did Blake Bell fumble? I'm honestly asking. I don't remember another one...

[onthestrip]

Recall him fumbling last year on the goal line, he might have recovered it. I definitely remember him throwing a pic on the goal line last year.

[SoonerDave]

You guys scored how many points below your season avg, and that had nothing to do with the K-State defense?

You goons should listen to yourselves. My god. I have even more news for you..all you've done to restore your confidence is take your frustration out on a crappy Texas team and whoop up on Kansas. The only good win OU has is TTU. It's a LOT more likely that you'll lose again than run the table.

K-State is the only team that's really in the driver's seat. Just accept that. I'm not really surprised by that at all. If you didn't expect Klein to be dynamite again this year, and didn't expect Snyder to win the Big 12 at least once again, then you only see the world through crimson-colored lenses and your opinion isn't even relevant.

The advantage that K-State has over everyone is that they're the one oddball team that nobody can really prepare for. They bring a different brand of football that Big 12 coaches and scout teams just don't get. They have a gamer qb, the best coach in the conference, and they play mistake-free football. They are by far the most disciplined football team in the conference. They let you make the mistakes, and OU certainly did. Oh well!

Ahh, what would a fun thread about football be without someone like Spartan to come in an stink it up with his own special brand of trolling?

Did I *ever* say that the KSU defense had *nothing* to do with OU scoring below its average? Nope. I said the KSU defense had *nothing* to do with Blake Bell fumbling a snap at the KSU one-yard line. Engage on contemplation of the difference.

Goons? Seriously, Spartan? That's the best you can do?

Did I *ever* say KSU wasn't in the driver's seat? Nope. They are. No question. It would be asinine to suggest differently.

Did I *ever* say OU categorically *would* run the table? Nope. I created a theoretical scenario that considers the notion that OU runs the table. Did I even say it was likely? Nope. Are we allowed to have a little fun in your world, Spartan? No, I guess doing that just makes us crimson "goons." Just as I said in my post, I make no pretense that this OU team is in the league of an Alabama. It isn't. There are no first-round draft picks on either side of the offensive/defensive lines, although I think Tony Jefferson and Aaron Colvin have pro potential with their speed and tackling ability.

In point of fact, I think Notre Dame's physical play on the lines on both sides of the ball could prove a real problem for OU. I'm *not* one of these guys picking a double-digit blowout. Not at all. If OU gets out with a win, that's great in my book. But if ND wins, I will not be shocked. Really physical teams give OU trouble, because, right now, OU is not quite that physical. In general, OU gets by with that in this conference, but when all things are equal, it can be a liability. On the other side, ND hasn't come close to seeing an offense that can execute at an up-tempo level. Maybe they'll pressure Jones, maybe they won't. We'll see.

So, in summary, please stop twisting what I posted into some manufactured notion for you to perform your typical troll-like contortions for the purposes of ridicule and name-calling. Even you are above calling people "goons." I made *none* of the assertions you're implying, while you make no bones about the fact that you've posted your opinion about a "huge dropoff" between KSU and OU. That argument is truly laughable. If the programs were as distant as you imply, OU playing them to within 5 points given the well-described circumstances here should be considered a monumental success even in your book.

[Spartan]

Just like when OU played them last season with all the same key players. You've talked yourself into some kind of delusional K-State narrative. No one disagrees that K-State deserved to win, that Klein is good, or that they're in the driver's seat, but you act like K-State is some mammoth program that is able to will everyone to their style and dominate. In reality, K-State has 1 big 12 title in 16 years, and has been dominated by OU for the last 13 years. If you think other people are delusional to think OU might beat K-State if they played again then you're the one that's delusional. OU doesn't even look like the same team. And, I'm sure you'll say it's because of K-State, but they looked the same way against UTEP. Football is far more complex than your simplistic analysis.

Okay, fine, I'll agree that I don't think OU is very good and I've never thought Landry Jones was a very good quarterback. Blake Bell as a starter would at least be a lot more interesting.

But I think you're getting way to nuanced to avoid saying K-State is good this year. And you're right, as a program they're lucky to be in an AQ conference right now. But this team has some weapons. Watch them destroy TTU (this week) and then OSU, really the only ones left in their way..

However I still think it's absolutely preposterous and offensive to the purity of football as a sport for you sooner diehards to be acting as if fumbles don't happen. They do. It's a big part of football. And for you to scoff at "mistake-free football" as simplistic analysis is laughable, because playing mistake-filled football is exactly what OU has done the last several seasons.

[dankrutka]

Recall him fumbling last year on the goal line, he might have recovered it. I definitely remember him throwing a pic on the goal line last year.

So you're not even sure?!? Then why bring it up. In probably 100 bulldozer snaps, he's lost one fumble. It was an aberration.

[onthestrip]

So you're not even sure?!? Then why bring it up. In probably 100 bulldozer snaps, he's lost one fumble. It was an aberration.

Because you claimed it was so out of the ordinary, but in fact he has turned it over near the goal line.

[Spartan]

I'm sorry, but you lose football credibility when you only dwell on the improbability of having a turnover against the highest turnover margin team in FBS. It's not even close between K-State and the next-best turnover margin team in the Big 12.

And I'm sorry, but right now, to even say OU and KSU are close is hilarious. Who has OU beaten? TTU (who will be exposed) and UT (who has been exposed, should have three conf losses). Who has KSU beaten? Miami, OU, ISU, WVU.. a clear pattern is emerging, they have definitely proved themselves.

This weekend will go a LONG way toward establishing OU's credibility, believe it or not. Kudos to Joe Castiglione for scheduling.

[OKCisOK4me]

How's that any different than poke fans endlessly whining about the call at the end of the Texas game? A loss is a loss is a loss is a loss. It's all part of the game.

Those people are just stupid. A true OSU fan would know the reason we lost the game is that we couldn't stop Mack Brown's 4th down attempts. That TD was only possible because they got past a 4th & 16. Horrible defense.

[onthestrip]

Endlessly whining? It's interesting because I stopped hearing about it quite shortly afterwards from the OSU folks in my circle. The paper made an issue about it for less than a week but that's about all I've heard since.

If you want to talk endlessly whining, I still hear OU fans bringing up Oregon and Texas tech.

[Spartan]

.....ergo, OSU fans are better at just drinking their sorrows away. Maybe.

[dankrutka]

Because you claimed it was so out of the ordinary, but in fact he has turned it over near the goal line.

To be clear, you're changing your argument. You have provided no evidence that Bell has ever fumbled running the Belldozer. What happened against K-State was an anomaly. In 100 snaps he's never lost another fumble.

[dankrutka]

I'm sorry, but you lose football credibility when you only dwell on the improbability of having a turnover against the highest turnover margin team in FBS. It's not even close between K-State and the next-best turnover margin team in the Big 12.

And I'm sorry, but right now, to even say OU and KSU are close is hilarious. Who has OU beaten? TTU (who will be exposed) and UT (who has been exposed, should have three conf losses). Who has KSU beaten? Miami, OU, ISU, WVU.. a clear pattern is emerging, they have definitely proved themselves.

This weekend will go a LONG way toward establishing OU's credibility, believe it or not. Kudos to Joe Castiglione for scheduling.

First, the Bell fumble has nothing do with K-State. They did nothing to cause it. Nothing.

Second, you just questioned who OU has beat and then claimed that K-State has quality wins against Miami, ISU, and WVU?!? K-State's credibility is built on the OU game. ISU and Miami are terrible, and it appears WVU is nothing more than an average team. How can you use WVU to build up K-State's resume and then not use Tech's to do the same for OU? Did you see what Tech did to WVU?!? Clearly, you're just throwing out things to "win an argument" without any consideration of reality. Lol.

[OKCisOK4me]

Endlessly whining? It's interesting because I stopped hearing about it quite shortly afterwards from the OSU folks in my circle. The paper made an issue about it for less than a week but that's about all I've heard since.

If you want to talk endlessly whining, I still hear OU fans bringing up Oregon and Texas tech.

They also get salty when you talk about how they like to rip certain body parts off...hahahahaha

[Spartan]

First, the Bell fumble has nothing do with K-State. They did nothing to cause it. Nothing.

Second, you just questioned who OU has beat and then claimed that K-State has quality wins against Miami, ISU, and WVU?!? K-State's credibility is built on the OU game. ISU and Miami are terrible, and it appears WVU is nothing more than an average team. How can you use WVU to build up K-State's resume and then not use Tech's to do the same for OU? Did you see what Tech did to WVU?!? Clearly, you're just throwing out things to "win an argument" without any consideration of reality. Lol.

Don't forget OU has to travel to Morgantown still. I agree on TTU though, but I can't wait to see what happens this weekend.

[dankrutka]

Don't forget OU has to travel to Morgantown still. I agree on TTU though, but I can't wait to see what happens this weekend.

I agree, and OU could definitely still lose a game or two and this discussion might not matter. The issue with this team, and Landry in particular, is consistency. Can they continue to play at the high level they've played at these past 3 weeks or will they falter? I suspect they'll have a tough game soon because there's no way they keep up the turnover ratio they've had recently. This Notre Dame should be telling. Notre Dame seems to be a very good defensive team that is questionable on offense. Probably a top 15 team, maybe top 10. We'll see how OU responds...

[zookeeper]

KSU goes all the way to the BCS championship. Kansas State and Alabama would be a great game.

[Just the facts]

KSU goes all the way to the BCS championship. Kansas State and Alabama would be a great game.

I am going to go out on a limb and predict the following - KSU/OU rematch assuming both win-out.

[zookeeper]

To add to my KSU prediction for the BCS championship game, Collin Klein walks away with the Heisman.

[Just the facts]

No team is coming out of the SEC or PAC-12 without a loss - so who would be higher ranked, an OU team with one loss which came to the #1 team by 5 points or a 1-loss team from another conference that lost to someone who WASN'T the #1 team? The BIG XII has learned what the SEC has been doing - lose early in the year.