Prague Diploma Controversy

[TaoMaas]

If we're going to punish this girl for maybe embarrassing some folks in the audience, what punishment should the administrators receive for embarrassing our entire state in front of the nation?

[kevinpate]

David Nootbaar said it's sadly ironic that his daughter, Kaitlin, was denied her diploma for saying “hell” in her valedictorian speech for Prague High School, where the mascot is the Red Devil. “In church on Sunday they say ‘hell' at least four times,” Nootbaar said, standing across from the school district's office, which includes an electronic marquee showing a small demon holding a pitchfork.

You can read more at http://newsok.com/prague-student-den...#ixzz24BXEMQ70

but seriously, is there any need to do so?

[Buffalo Bill]

[Jake]

Politcal correctness...political correctness everywhere!...

[RadicalModerate]

no diploma for using the word hell in a speech instead of heck . . . that is farking ridiculous. those administrators need to get their collective heads out of their esses or she needs to sue the shoot out of them. what about the first amendment fer cryin' out loud. geez. what a bunch of worthless, prissy, cokesockers.

[BBatesokc]

IMO this is ridiculous and an example of people who find the comfort in the illusion they have power and feel very threatened when it is exposed they actually have none.

I personally think she had a speech written down and was most likely ad-libbing a bit (who wants to sit through a verbatim speech from some piece of paper) - add in nervousness and she (heaven forbid) for a kid for a second.

At worst it was a bit of civil disobedience. "Hell" is not one of those words that causes most people a seconds worth of pause. She didn't tell the system to "go to hell" or anything of the sort.

The school overreacted and now its getting them the negative attention they deserve.

I spent plenty of time in the principal's office when I was at PCHS and fortunately I had teachers who came to my defense most every time (Journalism teacher - Effinger - when the school said I couldn't take out full page ads in the school paper they didn't approve of) and once by my art teacher when the school wouldn't display some of my art even though it had won awards at a local college contest. Both times fortunately the administration backed down.

I hope the students do some protesting and additional pressure is placed on the school to turn her diploma over. If not, it really will matter not to her and the school will continue to nurse its wounds.

[MadMonk]

Next thing you know they'll be listening to that damnable rock n roll and wearing dresses that show their knees! We gotta stop this now! -paraphrased from Dirty Dancing, a movie where a town of hicks stops the future from happening.

Mothers of Prague!
Heed the warning before it's too late!
Watch for the tell-tale sign of corruption!
The moment your son leaves the house,
Does he rebuckle his knickerbockers below the knee?
Is there a nicotine stain on his index finger?
A dime novel hidden in the corn crib?
Is he starting to memorize jokes from Capt.
Billy's Whiz Bang?
Are certain words creeping into his conversation?
Words like Hell?"
And 'so's your old man?"
Well, if so my friends,
Ya got trouble...

[RadicalModerate]

I personally think she had a speech written down and was most likely ad-libbing a bit (who wants to sit through a verbatim speech from some piece of paper)

Obviously you've seen much better Power Point presentations than I have.

Free the Diploma!

What do we want?
[Her diploma!]
When do we want it?
[Now!]

Adding insult to injury, with a touch of irony . . .
(from the article)

Rick Martin, superintendent of the district, located about 60 miles east of Oklahoma City, issued a statement: “Speakers are allowed significant freedom in their remarks, but all speeches must be approved in advance as being appropriate for graduation exercises. In this case, Ms. Nootbar prepared an appropriate speech, which was approved by the high school principal. Unfortunately she did not present the speech as written and used language that was inappropriate for a graduation exercise.”

He misspelled Nootbaar's name in the statement.

Nootbaar roughly translates: "Brilliant Student."
Nootbar equals "Nut Bar"

(for demonstration purposes only)
Hey, hey, Mr. Rick
Time you quit being such a weenie.

[Roadhawg]

So obviously you feel that any kind of language is approriate for a graduation speech and it should be anything goes? That is a total non-sequitur.

By God I think they should make an example of her and either give her a good flogging, waterboard her or really teach them young whipper snappers a lesson and burn her at the stake. Her actions shouldn't be tolerated, next thing you know she'll be skinny dipping in the Sea of Galilee.

[RadicalModerate]

I think about six months in The Kolache Mines ought to get her mind right . . .

[Roadhawg]

If we're going to punish this girl for maybe embarrassing some folks in the audience, what punishment should the administrators receive for embarrassing our entire state in front of the nation?

That seems to happen a lot in Oklahoma.

[RadicalModerate]

"Okie From Prague" just doesn't have the same ring to it . . .
"(you're walkin' on) The Writin' Side of Me" on the other hand . . .

[kevinpate]

The hell you say!
No sheepskin for you!
-Diploma Nazi

[RadicalModerate]

^^^LMAO!!!^^^

(the A stands for ace)

[TaoMaas]

That seems to happen a lot in Oklahoma.

So true. My wife and I watched an episode of "Here Comes Honey Boo-boo" the other day. My first reaction was, "Thank goodness...I just knew she was going to be from Oklahoma."

[RadicalModerate]

If we're going to punish this girl for maybe embarrassing some folks in the audience, what punishment should the administrators receive for embarrassing our entire state in front of the nation?

Perhaps forcing the prinicipal and administrators to watch "Here Comes Honey-Boo-Boo"?


After all, it's on The Learning Channel . . .

[Bellaboo]

All this girl did was 'quote' a line from a movie with the word hell in it.........BFD.............. those administrators are showing what type of power mongering idiots they really are...

[RadicalModerate]

"Frankly, my dear, I don't give a darn."

(nah . . . not the same . . .)

[metro]

By God I think they should make an example of her and either give her a good flogging, waterboard her or really teach them young whipper snappers a lesson and burn her at the stake. Her actions shouldn't be tolerated, next thing you know she'll be skinny dipping in the Sea of Galilee.

Maybe she used Obamas hot mic. She probably thought she was transmitting to Vladmir.

[SoonerDave]

The frustrating thing is that this situation represents is when guidelines get blown up and administrators are made to look foolish.

It is perfectly reasonable to have some sort of contextual guidelines or standards covering what can be said at a school graduation. But they'd better be fairly loose guidelines that respect freedom of speech. And if the district had guidelines establishing that profanity (and, yes, I believe using the term "hell" in this way would be considered profane usage) was not acceptable, and she knew those rules going in, then there's a problem....

On the other hand....

To turn it into this federal case is serving no one.

The solution has to be somewhere in the middle. Compromise, mutual respect, and all that business. Unless I'm mistaken, the district said it would relent if she apologized for violating their content rules (however right or wrong they may be in everyone else's view), and that surely seems a way through this. Heavens, if she was so strident in her defense of the use of that word, she could always apologize "for violating the guidelines," and not the content itself. The district might not like that, but it would inevitably be played out in the media that she apologized, shifting the focus back on the administration.

The opposite extreme, of course, would be a protracted and embarrassing litigation that I believe the district would almost surely lose, costing the taxpayers a chunk of money and doing absolutely zero of benefit for the student (or anyone else), or even the notion of establishing content guidelines for a graduation speech. Sadly, I suspect a court date is ahead for all involved.

Everything, it seems, gets drawn as a hot line in sand these days. I, personally, don't like her choice of words at all. But I have a tough time taking it to the extreme of withholding her diploma, unless there was actually a rule in the district specifying that such was a potential consequence of violating the speech guidelines - which I seriously, seriously doubt. You can't make up rules on the fly, or at least you generally shouldn't be able to IMHO.

* sigh *

[RadicalModerate]

The Nootbaar Saga: F'n A's

So . . . Do you think The Academic Authorities out there in Weatherford are going to give her a pass--perhaps even an excused absence--for her upcoming appearances on Jay Leno, Jimmy Kimmel or Jimmy Fallon? Letterman?

Maybe they could give her an all expenses paid trip to San Francisco, necro this guy, and let him serve as a tour guide to "where it all began" . . .


Edited to Add:
You can't make up rules on the fly, or at least you generally shouldn't be able to IMHO.
Flys will be buttoned and/or zipped up.
Pants will be worn at waist height, with a belt.
Exposed shirt tails will not be tolerated.
Baseball caps will have the brims pointed in a rational direction.
Vice-Principals talking out their donkeys are par for the course.

Since "He's a Rebel" is too gender specific . . . Maybe this could serve as an apology?
Or at least the intro to the upcoming final fifteen minutes of fame on one of those TV shows?

[Roadhawg]

Maybe she used Obamas hot mic. She probably thought she was transmitting to Vladmir.

We're talking about a teenage girl who used the word 'hell' but good job on dragging Obama into the conversation.

[Larry OKC]

I think after 4 years of overachieving in school even a f-you to the principle and administration would be OK. It doesn't matter. She can go to college and get a degree, and worry about her GED later.

Without the diploma, can she go to college...is that full scholarship she got now invalid? Or did she graduate and they are just denying the physical piece of paper that she might frame or store in a drawer someplace? In other words, if she submits her high school transcript, does it show that she graduated?

When I graduated, the diploma we were handed as we walked across the stage was a blank piece of paper. This was to ensure that nothing unacceptable would happen during the ceremony (it was a private religious high school and in that case, the use of Hell would have not been tolerated in the context she used) and to make sure all outstanding monies owed (tuition, books, supplies, fees etc) were paid before the actual diploma was bestowed

[OKCisOK4me]

To put this in perspective...

I graduated from a high school in Missouri called Hale. That was the town name too and for Homecoming every 4 years they make and sale shirts that say, "Hell yes, I'm from Hale!"

These administrators are being re-DONK-u-lous and need to let it go...

[Bellaboo]

If those administrators had half a brain, they'd give her the diploma and then restate their policy going forward, just to clear up any possible gray areas if there are any.....but then again, are they intelligent enough to do this and move on ?

if this went to litigation, it'd be like the couple getting a divorce and spending a couple of hours attorney fees fighting over a 5 dollar hammer.