Streetcar

[okclee]

So my next question would be,

Where would the best location in downtown Okc be to develop the rail trasit hub?

Also, is the rail transit hub part of the MAPS 3 budget along with 5 to 6 miles of streetcare?

[Platemaker]

You can't cross the BNSF at 13th. You'd have to build an overpass, which would blow the budget. 4th, 5th, or 23rd are your best bets.

That's 10th street.

[Urban Pioneer]

There is $10 million in MAPS 3 for commuter transit infrastructure. Such monies could be applied to a hub.

OKC is in the process of asking ACOG to conduct a hub study through an independent engineering firm.

[okclee]

That's not my map, it's Platemaker's. I personally wouldn't run it to the Capitol, just to OUHSC/OU Med, Midtown, DT, and Bricktown for now.

I'm sorry, you are right, not your map.

I wouldn't run it to the state capitol either, that would be a waste, unless platemaker is a politician.

[onthestrip]

Having heard the mayor say he prefers a spoke and hub type system and that we have enough money for 5-6 miles, Ill offer my opinion based on that.

Im not really sure what would be the best spot for the hub, somewhere around the myriad gardens I would think would be ideal. As far as the spokes go, one would need to go west to tie in Film Exchange/new OCU law school/Civic Center/OKCMOA. Going East: Probably down Main St to tie in all of Bricktown and extend it for access to boathouse row. To the South: the new Park and convention center if thats where its located. To the North: this might be a little tricky. You want to go up broadway to tie in to existing housing and businesses along there but it also needs to makes its way to the Plaza Court and St Andrews area. Getting lines to the heart of Midtown is critical in my mind because it has the best potential to create new private investment.

[okclee]

If we indeed do build a main hub, this location is very critical for the future of Okc transit.

What are some ideas on the location of a main hub?

[PLANSIT]

That's 10th street.

Same thing applies.

[proud2Bsooner]

This map seems to be fairly correlative to Platemaker's but it looks like it goes further south to the southern tip of the park.

[Platemaker]

Same thing applies.

The map was just for fun... 10th street is the alignment proposed in the Fixed Guideway Study.

[PLANSIT]

The map was just for fun... 10th street is the alignment proposed in the Fixed Guideway Study.

Oh, I know. I was just pointing out that although it would be nice, it just isn't practical right now. Keep the maps coming. They provide food for thought.

[okclee]

^^ Exactly, great job with any and all streetcar map possibilities.

[Platemaker]

^^ Exactly, great job with any and all streetcar map possibilities.

Uh oh!!! I'm a Google My Maps junkie!!! You're all gonna be sick of me!

How about one way figure eight style lines a la Portland. Maximum streetcar frontage... this would serve current hotels very well... access to multiple lines. Of course this is more than 6 miles worth... but whatever.

[okclee]

If we build a new central hub, one would think it needs to be near the downtown bus trasit hub.

[Platemaker]

Possibly... but we could be like Boston and have a "North Station" = current bus transfer station... and a "South Station" = Santa Fe or Union.

[okclee]

This map seems to be fairly correlative to Platemaker's but it looks like it goes further south to the southern tip of the park.

Platemaker,

Can you overlay this map onto one of your google maps?

[blangtang]

If we build a new central hub, one would think it needs to be near the downtown bus trasit hub.

But you don't want those people on the streetcars

[Platemaker]

Platemaker,

Can you overlay this map onto one of your google maps?

Here ya go... I made a point to include all points listed on the map... it's 6.42 miles.

[okclee]

Great job Platemaker.

6.42, that is what I was curious about.

We have 5 to 6 miles to work with.

[Architect2010]

How many streetcars are a part of this system?

Especially if we are considering a spoke system which would require a streetcar to travel the length of one spoke, then return to the hub before traveling the line of another spoke.

But maybe I'm envisioning this all wrong. But regardless, it still helps to realize how many actual vehicles would be a part of this system.

[Platemaker]

Great job Platemaker.

6.42, that is what I was curious about.

We have 5 to 6 miles to work with.

Well that jog up Shartel and 18th is what I'm considering 'Historic Neighborhoods" fromt the MTPOKC graphic. It would be right at 6 miles if it ended at 13th.

[okclee]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"How many streetcars are a part of this system?"


^^ Urban Pioneer may know the answer to this question.

[Platemaker]

How many streetcars are a part of this system?

Well Portland's is 4 miles and they usually run 7 streetcars at a time about 1/2 a mile apart at 6-12 minute intervals.

So if we ran a similar schedule at 6 miles it would be about 12 streetcars.

[Architect2010]

Then no worries on my part. Less than that would be fantastic for me.

[BDP]

A couple of things to consider:

1) Part of the street car route will probably be contingent on where the convention center goes. It only makes sense for the convention center to have a stop and I am not sure that location is selected yet. Of course, if it's next to the park, they can share a stop.

2) Getting into the Historic Districts may be tricky. I can see some resistance from residents to any lines running through the neighborhoods like on Walker or Shartel. Broadway and Classen probably make the easiest routes north and south out of the triangle and out of MidTown simply because of the room those streets afford. Granted they may not offer the most scenic routes, once you get above 13th, though. It may not matter in this first step, but I think the most likely way to get it to 23rd will be around the HP neighborhoods and not through them.

[Platemaker]

BDP - I fear your second point is valid. If they looked at it like the St. Charles line in New Orleans lined by mansions maybe they'd find it charming. Classen and Broadway would definitely work... and maybe Robinson between 13th and 23rd. Also... there doesn't really need to be 'stations' in the HP neighborhoods... one at 13th and no others until 20th.
Walker would be a great option for future extensions to the Paseo.