New Convention Center Study

[workman45]

Yes, it needs to be done, and the prices make this a opportune time to do so.

We've known this was part of the reason for loosing the bid for the American Legion national convention and it will continue it's negative impact to our economy.

[Kerry]

The best time to catch up (and pass) other cities is when they are standing still. Pushing forward with MAPS III while other cities are putting projects on hold will reap returns twice as fast and at a much lower cost.

From today's Las Vegas Review Journal
ReviewJournal.com - News - Signs go south for LV

The downturn has side-tracked the authority's drive to complete an $890 million renovation of the Las Vegas Convention Center. Board members voted unanimously to suspend the project until at least the middle of 2010.

Brenda Siddall, the authority's vice president of finance, said the suspension is necessary to help keep the agency in the black in light of declining room tax revenues, its primary source of income.

A year ago, the authority projected it would receive $243 million in room tax revenue this fiscal year, a projection that has been downsized to $190 million.

The decrease threatens to leave the authority with a $7 million shortfall in its ending fund balance, which isn't allowable under law, Siddall said.

Suspending the convention center renovation, with other measures, will help the authority maintain an adequate ending fund balance.

"It is the only solution which does not impact our mission of filling hotel rooms," Siddall said.

The vote occurred Tuesday, but the plan to suspend the project has been public since last week.

Michael Hughes, vice president of research and consulting for Tradeshow Week magazine, said the suspension is understandable. But he added that the authority should get the project back on track as soon as possible.

"If this renovation is not done eventually ... one day a major event might say the facility is not up to best practices," Hughes said. "You walk into the facility, and it feels like the early '90s. Today, these events are about the attendee experience."

That pretty much sums up why OKC should proceed full steam ahead.

[hipsterdoofus]

That pretty much sums up why OKC should proceed full steam ahead.

So we can get halfway through it and quit because the economy downturn sooner or later will hit here?

[BDP]

So we can get halfway through it and quit because the economy downturn sooner or later will hit here?

So we can further diversify our economy, so the effects of downturns, especially in our isolated sectors, will not be as devastating.

One bonus of having strong convention traffic, is that it brings current and future decision makers to your market. Beyond the direct economic impact of bringing in outside money and tax dollars, conventions are a chance to showcase your market. It brings in thousands of people every year that otherwise would have no reason to come to Oklahoma City.

[Kerry]

So we can get halfway through it and quit because the economy downturn sooner or later will hit here?

So why do anything? The next downturn is always around the corner .

[Chicken In The Rough]

...
the point is not to garner the approval of Tulsans, but to invest in our city in whatever way we feel will raise the standard of living, improve its competitive position, and make it a viable and desirable place for current and future generations to live, work, and create.

Bravo!

I have a concern that a couple of peope have mentioned. The price tag of a new convention center is large enough to completely devour the next MAPS funding. I've seen $400 million to $450 million tossed around. I think a first class, million SF center could easily surpass this figure. If we try to add this to the next MAPS, what will become of our transit funding? Or, funding for most other projects? We might see a new CC and a couple other minor projects. But that's about all the money there will be.

[hipsterdoofus]

I don't know why i even try...this board is full of people who only dream - not that dreaming is bad, but you have to have a touch of reality too...you guys are crazy if you think that the downturn in the economy isn't going to hit here eventually.

[shane453]

I don't know why i even try...this board is full of people who only dream - not that dreaming is bad, but you have to have a touch of reality too...you guys are crazy if you think that the downturn in the economy isn't going to hit here eventually.

No one said you were wrong about economic downturn eventually reaching Oklahoma City. But the question is how can we avoid or diminish its impact and the impact of future downturns, and the answer is by having a wide range of industries- including the convention business.

[soonergolfer]

Doofus,
By your rationale we should just sit on our thumbs and save our pennies? There is no doubt the downturn will hit us, probably a little worse before it gets better. Fact of the matter is that this center will not be completed for 4 or 5 years. If we are still economically hurting really bad at that time, the one cent tax would be the least of our or our countires problem.

[Richard at Remax]

the word "economy" is starting to join the list of words I cringe at because it is overused. stimulus, evil doers, maverick, joe the plummer are also on this list.

everything will work itself out with that E word. everyone has or will tighten thier belts but it shouldn't deter us from looking and planning on the future. do you think cities like dallas or houston just woke up one day and snapped thier fingers and thier convention centers and other civic projects? if you want to be big time you have to pay for it. we just need to be smart how we use our money.

[BDP]

this board is full of people who only dream

We're just trying to counter the general apathy and complacency that permeates the community, both online and in the real world. : )

you have to have a touch of reality too...you guys are crazy if you think that the downturn in the economy isn't going to hit here eventually.

I don't think anyone here has said that the downtown wouldn't affect the city. If anything, many are simply looking for ways that Oklahoma City can position itself to take more part in the good times whenever they may return and to better diversify the local economy going forward so that the effects of collapse in our core industries will be mitigated in the future. That's not dreaming. That's called planning.

And, btw, it already has hit here. It just doesn't seem as bad because we didn't have as much to lose.

[jbrown84]

Fox 25 had a LOVELY tease for this story the other night:

"The Ford Center and the Cox Arena. Now the mayor want's ANOTHER convention center. And he wants YOU to pay for it!"

Completely irresponsible...

[BG918]

We're just trying to counter the general apathy and complacency that permeates the community, both online and in the real world. : )



I don't think anyone here has said that the downtown wouldn't affect the city. If anything, many are simply looking for ways that Oklahoma City can position itself to take more part in the good times whenever they may return and to better diversify the local economy going forward so that the effects of collapse in our core industries will be mitigated in the future. That's not dreaming. That's called planning.

And, btw, it already has hit here. It just doesn't seem as bad because we didn't have as much to lose.

Very well said. I think there is a fine line between dreaming and, like BDP said, planning for the future. There doesn't seem to be enough of either in OKC which is why this forum is so great. For big projects like a new convention center, light rail, etc. you must start planning well ahead of the actual construction and that is what the city is doing, even in the midst of a recession.

[metro]

BDP, well said!

jbrown, if that is true, that is completely lazy journalism as usual and irresponsible.

[jbrown84]

Right.

Forget the fact that this has nothing to do with arenas. It won't have another arena.

Forget the fact that the Cox would be 50 years old by the time we could get this built.

Forget the fact that peer cities are all ahead of us in size and most are ahead of us in quality.

[Midtowner]

Very well said. I think there is a fine line between dreaming and, like BDP said, planning for the future. There doesn't seem to be enough of either in OKC which is why this forum is so great. For big projects like a new convention center, light rail, etc. you must start planning well ahead of the actual construction and that is what the city is doing, even in the midst of a recession.

I don't think it's so far out. The modus operandi of our city government is to put forward votes to 'continue' the MAPS tax, promising tons of neat stuff without having to raise taxes. I think they need to be as "shovel ready" as possible [I threw that in just for worthy cook] by the time the Ford Center tax expires so that they can more effectively market the tax as a continuation of the status quo rather than a departure from the norm, or worse, a tax hike.

[hoya]

OKC needs so much stuff to make it competitive with other cities that I'd like to see MAPS continue for the next twenty years, at least. I mean, we've been paying that one cent sales tax since, what, 1993? We have seen first hand the benefits of that tax and the improvements it paid for. It's not like businesses are going to be hurt by paying the same taxes they've already been paying. It's not like 16 years down the road, the tax suddenly becomes too much to bear.

Now, I'm not one for higher taxes, but as long as Mayor Mick and crew can continue finding worthwhile projects, I will support them. MAPS has been a fantastic success so far, and we could see a huge benefit by having a new convention center downtown.

[BDP]

Now the mayor want's ANOTHER convention center.

Well, good. At least we have a mayor that not only thinks we have a future, but thinks about how it could be better.

And he wants YOU to pay for it!

No problem. I'm happy to pull my weight around here. ; )

[Patrick]

build a new convention center and refurb the cox center as simply a second downtown arena.

[ssandedoc]

Just because we build another convention center doesn't mean the Cox Convention Center will go unused. This month alone we are expecting around 150,000 guests from various conventions and events held at the Ford & Cox Centers. Having a third, world class convention center would only increase the number of conventions we have here. Cities like Chicago, etc are well equipped to handle multiple events and conventions simultaneously. OKC can too if people would just give us a break.

I do agree that mass transit needs to be built as priority right next to the new convention center because they will go hand in hand with our city's growth and development.

[kevinpate]

what was originally the MAPS tax, now the Thunder House Tax,will likely continue for far more than 20 years. Perhaps 50+ years. And perhaps, rarely, if ever, more than 5 years at a time, but it's a fixture now, and so long as they don't propose anything vastly dumb, it'll change its flavor, but remain in force like the good little energizer bunny penny that it si. now saying that's a bad thing, just saying a penny sales tax that never goes away is not really a temporary tax, no matter whose undies you dress it up in

[Kerry]

Fox 25 had a LOVELY tease for this story the other night:

"The Ford Center and the Cox Arena. Now the mayor want's ANOTHER convention center. And he wants YOU to pay for it!"

Completely irresponsible...

Just who does Fox 25 think pays for everything government does?

[Chicken In The Rough]

I sincerely apologize in advance, for injecting politics into the discussion, but... are we in agreement? Does it appear that Keynesian economics (i.e., large scale public spending) has a useful purpose and can be an effective tool? Is OKC not much better off due to MAPS? Please don't tell the Laissez-faire righties. It will spoil their dinners. It seems that public spending indeed can spur private investment.

[metro]

Just because we build another convention center doesn't mean the Cox Convention Center will go unused. This month alone we are expecting around 150,000 guests from various conventions and events held at the Ford & Cox Centers. Having a third, world class convention center would only increase the number of conventions we have here. Cities like Chicago, etc are well equipped to handle multiple events and conventions simultaneously. OKC can too if people would just give us a break.

I do agree that mass transit needs to be built as priority right next to the new convention center because they will go hand in hand with our city's growth and development.

Ford Center is an arena, not a convention center, although some conventions do use arenas. I totally agree that we need multiple venues, but a large enough, world class convention center could handle this role, and the COX Center could be better used as a mixed use development or transit center.

[metro]

I sincerely apologize in advance, for injecting politics into the discussion, but... are we in agreement? Does it appear that Keynesian economics (i.e., large scale public spending) has a useful purpose and can be an effective tool? Is OKC not much better off due to MAPS? Please don't tell the Laissez-faire righties. It will spoil their dinners. It seems that public spending indeed can spur private investment.

Actually, I'm willing to bet just as many righties if not more voted for MAPS than lefties. The only people I know who were against it were lefties.