Living wage and/or minimum wage

[bamarsha]

Correct, so if you want the Government to take care of all the people with out savings continue to argue about how much someone should be paid. This includes emergency savings for when something bad happens that you haven't planned for.

No, that's were self-responsibility is supposed to come into play. Your goal shouldn't be earn as little as you can, but to better yourself and earn more. Work for your wants and savings, don't rely on others, especially the government.

[OkieBerto]

No, that's were self-responsibility is supposed to come into play. Your goal shouldn't be earn as little as you can, but to better yourself and earn more. Work for your wants and savings, don't rely on others, especially the government.

You just described who I am. I have self-responsibility, my goal is to climb the financial ladder and do better and earn more. I have savings, I have all the luxuries you stated earlier. I don't rely on others, especially the government. That being said, I believe people should be paid a decent wage for all types of work.

[OkieBerto]

I would like to know from those who do not believe there should be a livable wage. If you were the owner, what would you pay an entry level fast food worker in the Modern Day economy?

[jedicurt]

No, that's were self-responsibility is supposed to come into play. Your goal shouldn't be earn as little as you can, but to better yourself and earn more. Work for your wants and savings, don't rely on others, especially the government.

okay... but then why is job jumping so looked down upon then? if that is what the goal should be, then people changing jobs when employers don't increase wages based upon what you have learned and are now capable of, why is that frowned upon so much?

[GaryOKC6]

From my experience, a more and more companies are paying way more than 15.00 to get the talent level they want. I think people should get a livable wage, but they are also responsible for earing it too. I worked my way through college in the late 70's on 3.00 an hour working in a hot greasy factory. That alone motivated me to work harder to get ahead. My friends were all out having fun in the evenings, and I was studying. It took me longer but I kept my eye on the prize. I have 4 daughters and have always pushed them to be the best they can be. It starts with work ethic. Two of them bought a house while working as a server. Both have moved on to other career paths and neither graduated college. They did it by showing up every day on time, working hard and going above and beyond. My point is that anybody can make a good living if they are willing to put in the work.

[BoulderSooner]

Thank you for adding so much to the conversation. Snark doesn't pay very well these days. I am glad you find this situation so funny.

what is funny is thinking it takes 80k for a single person to live comfortably in OKC

[BoulderSooner]

I would like to know from those who do not believe there should be a livable wage. If you were the owner, what would you pay an entry level fast food worker in the Modern Day economy?

the smallest amount that i could ..

[BoulderSooner]

From my experience, a more and more companies are paying way more than 15.00 to get the talent level they want. I think people should get a livable wage, but they are also responsible for earing it too. I worked my way through college in the late 70's on 3.00 an hour working in a hot greasy factory. That alone motivated me to work harder to get ahead. My friends were all out having fun in the evenings, and I was studying. It took me longer but I kept my eye on the prize. I have 4 daughters and have always pushed them to be the best they can be. It starts with work ethic. Two of them bought a house while working as a server. Both have moved on to other career paths and neither graduated college. They did it by showing up every day on time, working hard and going above and beyond. My point is that anybody can make a good living if they are willing to put in the work.

well said

[bamarsha]

From my experience, a more and more companies are paying way more than 15.00 to get the talent level they want. I think people should get a livable wage, but they are also responsible for earing it too. I worked my way through college in the late 70's on 3.00 an hour working in a hot greasy factory. That alone motivated me to work harder to get ahead. My friends were all out having fun in the evenings, and I was studying. It took me longer but I kept my eye on the prize. I have 4 daughters and have always pushed them to be the best they can be. It starts with work ethic. Two of them bought a house while working as a server. Both have moved on to other career paths and neither graduated college. They did it by showing up every day on time, working hard and going above and beyond. My point is that anybody can make a good living if they are willing to put in the work.

Exactly.

[OkieBerto]

the smallest amount that i could ..

So minimum wage?

[OkieBerto]

what is funny is thinking it takes 80k for a single person to live comfortably in OKC

So I guess we need to define what it means to live comfortably. What does it mean to you? Considering you have added little to nothing to this conversation.

[bamarsha]

I would like to know from those who do not believe there should be a livable wage. If you were the owner, what would you pay an entry level fast food worker in the Modern Day economy?

I would start by looking at what my competitors were paying. If I wanted to just get by, start there or a little lower (expect more turnover). If I wanted to be a "high-end" restaurant (like CFA), I would pay more to keep the good employees... and once you proved you are reliable and a good employee, I would make sure compensate you accordingly so I didn't lose you to another restaurant (or even another industry)... at least until the labor force exceeded the labor budget (which will vary based on a number of factors). Basically, you get what you pay for.

So, to answer your question, it could be anywhere from $10/hr to $15/hr, after all is considered. Show me you are worth more and get more. Show me you are worth less and be careful of being replaced.

[Bill Robertson]

All these posts about first jobs, fast food places, living wages, job functions, etc. make me think about my history.
At 14 in 1974 two friends who also went to NW Classen and I went to work as busboys at Glen's. One of the nicer steakhouses at the time. We got a wage but I don't remember what plus a percentage of what the waitresses claimed they got. We always thought most of them shortchanged us. Then I went to work at Casa Bonita. There we got a pretty good wage. Again I don't remember exactly what. Plus tips divided equally between all the floor servers. But between the two jobs I made enough to hang out with friends and build a very fast '68 Pontiac Tempest. Did quite well picking up races on 39th Street.
Then I worked my way through part time college and part time working as an electrician. Working more and more in automated control systems which were very new at the time. That led to a position doing only controls work for Kerr-McGee. Which led to facility management.
Then I started where I am now. For the past 24 years I've been a building and grounds maintenance site manager at the same Fed Govt facility. But I've worked for 5 different contractors. Most have been very small and I've been site manager, HR, cust. relations, ?. Everything except payroll. The last contractor actually has just been awarded a second 5 years so for the first time I'm working for the same employer for more than 5 years. I started 24 years ago at $48k per year. Last year I made just short of 6 figures. At what has been the normal annual raise, by contract, I'd have hit 6 figures next year.
But starting June 1 the govt. has taken a stance with contractors that have multiple sites that they don't have site management anymore. Multiple sites are supposed to be managed centrally by a corporate office position. My employer decided that this wouldn't work. Correctly. Because our function is so different from anything else the contractor does at other sites. So I'm unofficially working from home, part-time. Limited to no more than 15 hours per week. Hourly rate based on what my salary was divided by 2080.
So now our household income is only about $60k. Our house is paid off. All 3 cars (1, 2019 and 2, 2002s) are paid off. Mostly because a couple years ago I saw this situation coming and buckled down to pay everything off. But even at 60k after taxes, insurance on everything, phones, internet and other utilities we can go out a time or two a week. And cover things like the garage door opener that died a couple weeks ago. I really don't know what we'll do when my wife's '02 Liberty bites the dust. It has 225k miles and it's going to someday. So the earlier comment of around 40k being a minimum living wage sounds to me to be pretty close. I wouldn't have thought so 6 months ago but I can see it now.

[gjl]

My first real adult job where you go to work M-F, 8 hrs a day was at age 21 at Western Electric for $4.22/hr. Within that first year I moved out on my own from having a roommate in an apartment to living by myself in a rent house, bought a new 15" ski boat and a new used car. Within 2 years I bought a 1150 sq ft brick house with a 2 car attached garage in Warr Acres with a 9.5% mortgage. Using this inflation calculator https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/ That same 4.22 would be 23.33 or $48526/year today. My 4.22 back then was very livable for a single person. By the time I bought the house I was probably making around 5.50/hr.

[OkieBerto]

I would start by looking at what my competitors were paying. If I wanted to just get by, start there or a little lower (expect more turnover). If I wanted to be a "high-end" restaurant (like CFA), I would pay more to keep the good employees... and once you proved you are reliable and a good employee, I would make sure compensate you accordingly so I didn't lose you to another restaurant (or even another industry)... at least until the labor force exceeded the labor budget (which will vary based on a number of factors). Basically, you get what you pay for.

So, to answer your question, it could be anywhere from $10/hr to $15/hr, after all is considered. Show me you are worth more and get more. Show me you are worth less and be careful of being replaced.

The Irony of using the phrase, "You get what you pay for," while then giving the starting wage at $10 an hour in today's economy.

[OkieBerto]

My first real adult job where you go to work M-F, 8 hrs a day was at age 21 at Western Electric for $4.22/hr. Within that first year I moved out on my own from having a roommate in an apartment to living by myself in a rent house, bought a new 15" ski boat and a new used car. Within 2 years I bought a 1150 sq ft brick house with a 2 car attached garage in Warr Acres with a 9.5% mortgage. Using this inflation calculator https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/ That same 4.22 would be 23.33 or $48526/year today. My 4.22 back then was very livable for a single person. By the time I bought the house I was probably making around 5.50/hr.

So you bought a house with a yearly income of around 13,000 a year? My math might be wrong, I am sure I will get a comment about it.

[gjl]

So you bought a house with a yearly income of around 13,000 a year? My math might be wrong, I am sure I will get a comment about it.

I just checked my Social Security Earnings Records and in 1978 when I bought the house I made 15560 that year. So I probably made a bit more than the 5.50 and/or worked a little overtime too. It was a union hourly job that paid time and 1/2 for overtime. The house was 35K and I borrowed 31K on a 30 year loan My house payments were around $290/mo with taxes and insurance to start out if I recall. I was able to do it. I was also still single with no kids. Didn't get married until age 36.
I should add that was October 1976 when I started that job and May 1978 when I bought the house.

And I have always used hourly wage times 2080 hrs to figure yearly income.

[Bill Robertson]

So you bought a house with a yearly income of around 13,000 a year? My math might be wrong, I am sure I will get a comment about it.

Don't know about him but I bought my first house in 1978 for $16k. My first 3 houses including that one didn't total $100k. And they weren't projects either.

[gjl]

Don't know about him but I bought my first house in 1978 for $16k. My first 3 houses including that one didn't total $100k. And they weren't projects either.

A guy I worked with at Western Electric would talk about his house payments on a house he bought in the early 60s were $68/month.

[OkieBerto]

I just checked my Social Security Earnings Records and in 1978 when I bought the house I made 15560 that year. So I probably made a bit more than the 5.50 and/or worked a little overtime too. It was a union hourly job that paid time and 1/2 for overtime. The house was 35K and I borrowed 31K on a 30 year loan My house payments were around $290/mo with taxes and insurance to start out if I recall. I was able to do it. I was also still single with no kids. Didn't get married until age 36.
I should add that was October 1976 when I started that job and May 1978 when I bought the house.

And I have always used hourly wage times 2080 hrs to figure yearly income.

Your information is so helpful. Thank you for giving us a window into the past when it comes to wages.

[OkieBerto]

Don't know about him but I bought my first house in 1978 for $16k. My first 3 houses including that one didn't total $100k. And they weren't projects either.

The first place I bought was a Condo in the early 2000's. I was straight out of college and had a great job at a country club. I made about $10 an hour. The Condo was a lease to own and I ended up buying it for $65,000. The mortgage rate was a little high and I had a car payment. There were also HOA dues I had to pay. I lived paycheck to paycheck back then though.

[gjl]

Your information is so helpful. Thank you for giving us a window into the past when it comes to wages.

Well that sounds pretty snarky but I also included what those wages would be today.

[OkieBerto]

Well that sounds pretty snarky but I also included what those wages would be today.

I was being honest. I appreciate your input on this topic. Sorry if it came across snarky.

[Plutonic Panda]

I don’t know why things need to be over complicated. Living wage should be just that something you can live off of. I think most people would consider at least having some disposable income to be able to save a little bit of money. Be able to go and eat at least once or twice a month. Having adequate transportation. Being able to eat. Paying utility bills. You would own whatever domicile you reside in. Healthcare. Etc.

Anything else like well what about having children? What if you smoke or drink? What foods are affordable to you that you can eat to be healthy? None of that is neither here nor there. All that can be worked out.

Any job you work whether it’s minimum wage or not, If it’s a full-time job, It should be enough to pay livable wage. It’s pretty crazy we’re in the 21st-century and trying to define what livable means.

[fortpatches]

From my experience, a more and more companies are paying way more than 15.00 to get the talent level they want. I think people should get a livable wage, but they are also responsible for earing it too. I worked my way through college in the late 70's on 3.00 an hour working in a hot greasy factory. That alone motivated me to work harder to get ahead. My friends were all out having fun in the evenings, and I was studying. It took me longer but I kept my eye on the prize. I have 4 daughters and have always pushed them to be the best they can be. It starts with work ethic. Two of them bought a house while working as a server. Both have moved on to other career paths and neither graduated college. They did it by showing up every day on time, working hard and going above and beyond. My point is that anybody can make a good living if they are willing to put in the work.

Just for reference, since I dont know when the "late 70s" is more specifically:
3.00/hr in 1979 = $13.82/hr in 2024 adjusted for inflation.
1978 = $15.10
1977 = $16.13

The other way around - $15/hr now would have been about $3.56/hr in 1979, $3.20 in 1978 and $2.97 in 1977.

So it seems $15/hr is roughly equivalent to what you made in the late 70s.