REHCO / Former Downtown Ford site

[Larry OKC]

Will our dreams come true? Will the new CC site be moved, and Howard/Hall can proceed with plans for retail and housing in this area? Will this thread be revived from the dead?

Zombies live (well, sort of)

[jn1780]

Zombies live (well, sort of)

Hey now, this isn't the Crossroads Mall thread. lol

[Larry OKC]

I did refrain from mentioning it...only because I was trying to think of a clever way to tie it in...

[Bits_Of_Real_Panther]

Hopefully they do it right, anything less than 15 stories wouldn't be wasting that prime location.

I hope this one happens

[Pete]

Bringing this thread back from the dead now that the convention center has moved on to another site.

In fact, REHCO just filed to have the old parts building demolished.

[shawnw]

You wouldn't think they would spend money to demo something if they didn't think they'd get that money back on a sale or development...

[Bellaboo]

In fact, REHCO just filed to have the old parts building demolished.

More $20 parking.

[Teo9969]

So now that we've moved on from the Convention Center, let's be real here:

Does REHCO have the resources to do this lot justice? They seem to be high-quality developers, but being the best developer in the world does you no good on this lot if you can't get ahold of more than $100M.

[bchris02]

I really hope a mixed-use development with housing and retail happens on this site within the near future. I hope the plan isn't for more surface parking.

[hfry]

Let's be realistic here. They just left millions of dollars and rumored future cox CC site land to keep these lots. There is no way they are planning just more surface parking. It might be that way for a few years while they plan and gather finances but something will be done with the site because it is arguably one of the most valuable undeveloped sites downtown today.

[hoya]

So now that we've moved on from the Convention Center, let's be real here:

Does REHCO have the resources to do this lot justice? They seem to be high-quality developers, but being the best developer in the world does you no good on this lot if you can't get ahold of more than $100M.

Just for the sake of argument, let's say they can't get more than $100M. They don't have to develop the whole property at once. What if they built a 20 story tower on one corner, and then sold it. And then they used that money to build another, etc?

[Spartan]

You mean Rainey Williams' definition of world class development...

[bchris02]

You mean Rainey Williams' definition of world class development...

And if you don't believe he can pull it off...then well you don't know Rainey Williams.

[G.Walker]

I wouldn't be surprised if part of this site ends up being massive parking garage for Chesapeake Energy Arena.

[Urbanized]

At the risk if being gauche...for the record, we are talking about individuals who wouldn't even have to borrow $100 million if they chose to self-finance. Funding isn't an issue.

[Urbanized]

I wouldn't be surprised if part of this site ends up being massive parking garage for Chesapeake Energy Arena.

Why in the world would Chesapeake Arena need a giant parking garage when it has functioned just fine without one for almost 15 years?

[HOT ROD]

well, in all fairness - isn't the lot functioning as a parking lot for Chesapeake arena today?

they must have too much money to know what to do with it then. just sayin'.

[Teo9969]

At the risk if being gauche...for the record, we are talking about individuals who wouldn't even have to borrow $100 million if they chose to self-finance. Funding isn't an issue.

Nobody with that kind of wealth bets it all on a singular development. The question remains simply based on the fact that aside from Devon, we've yet to see a recent (this century) private development take place downtown that was valued at >$100M.

There's no question whether these people have resources, however, it could easily be argued this site deserves $1B worth of development, and I highly suspect these developers don't have that in their back pocket. I readily admit, it's not my money etc etc….But in my opinion, anything less than $600M of development on this site is selling OKC short, and anything less than $300M on this site is an embarrassment.

[Teo9969]

To those thinking this will be parking, that seems pretty pessimistic. Nothing about the history of these developers would indicate that they would only build a parking garage.

I highly doubt that's a possibility here. I imagine we're sure to get a mixed-use development of some sort on this property.

[Spartan]

I agree that it seems pessimistic to equate OKC's recent success/failure rate with large CBD "mystery tower" projects to this site which involves totally different developers/investors. On this site you actually have vested interests with a proven track record. That said, we screwed up in not needing to see a proven track record before we demo'd Stage Center. We didn't insist on high standards (beyond predominantly parking uses) before we allowed demo of our historic Main Street.

When your community is used to negative development experiences, it makes it harder to do good development. OKC should be saying no to bad development for the sake of its good development, because at the end of the day, we are dangerously close to getting all of the bad before any of the good can happen. There is no strategy that I can see and not much happening with the CBD that instills much confidence. Luckily areas outside the CBD are another story, but we really did screw up (in 2015 even) with out CBD, and this pessimism and lack of community ethos is just the resultant factor.

Why in the world would Chesapeake Arena need a giant parking garage when it has functioned just fine without one for almost 15 years?

I don't get this logic, because why does anything need a giant parking garage when it functions just fine without one right now? And yet we are tearing down or historic Main Street for new garages left and right and ripping out new bike lanes on Walker to widen it to 4 lanes to serve all the parking garages.

If there's one thing that holds true is that a parking garage is always needed, always highest and best use (in OKC), and always wins in the end.

[Urbanized]

Nobody with that kind of wealth bets it all on a singular development. The question remains simply based on the fact that aside from Devon, we've yet to see a recent (this century) private development take place downtown that was valued at >$100M....

Where did I say ANYTHING to that effect? Where did I suggest that they WOULD self-finance? There were multiple comments questioning whether they could even get their hands on money; I only said that money was no problem whatsoever here. They can get any amount desired.

You are twisting my comments into something they are not. Stop it.

[Bellaboo]

The question remains simply based on the fact that aside from Devon, we've yet to see a recent (this century) private development take place downtown that was valued at >$100M.

Actually, the SandRidge redevelopment was valued at $100 million. I can see that with the Braniff and Parkside buildings along with the main tower improvements.

[Spartan]

That development also took $15 million in historic preservation rehab off the table (including over $5 million in tax credits that can't go into just any project downtown), with the KerrMac and India Temple demolitions. Probably would have been 75-ish units altogether.

[Teo9969]

Where did I say ANYTHING to that effect? Where did I suggest that they WOULD self-finance? There were multiple comments questioning whether they could even get their hands on money; I only said that money was no problem whatsoever here. They can get any amount desired.

You are twisting my comments into something they are not. Stop it.

Man, I'm not twisting your words, I'm simply responding to them. I'm not implying you believe that, but perhaps not every bloke that comes across this thread is going to understand that.

The owners of the site have done great things for OKC and have shown capacity for high quality development. I'm just trying to "set the stage" as it were as to what should be expected on this site. And while I certainly believe they have the capacity to tap into lots of money, assuming an entirely private entity that has never proved their capacity to whip out $600M from their (and more realistically their lenders') pocket(s) is going to do so here seems to me more optimistic than calculating.

I guess I'm bringing all this up to avoid any accusation that potential future complaints about a project are strictly reactionary and nit-picky. And sure, it's hubris and overly self-important on my end, but I'm on an internet forum and this is my only good avenue to publicly dream about these blocks. I'm dreaming of an incredibly substantial development because I think it's fair as a citizen of this community to want what is best for it.

I trust Hall and Howard more than I trust any other entity in OKC, so I'm hopeful. But as Spartan said, it's hard not to be cautionary with CBD development.

[Urbanized]

I think most "blokes" who come across this thread understand that if someone has personal resources north of $100 million they also have the capacity to borrow the same amount of money (and more) on a qualifying project. There were a number of questions upthread about their ability to get their hands on that type of money. I responded to those questions, and made it clear that getting that level of funding is not a problem for these developers. Nothing more, nothing less. If you desire to turn that discussion into some other type of exercise obviously I am powerless to stop you.